Will excess weight ever come off?!

Haven't posted for some time. Been trying to tackle related health issues and optimise thyroid. But weight just will not budge at all.

I read stories of people who finally begin to lose weight because they somehow (almost magically lol) find out why their excess weight has not moved and hey presto, they drop weight.

Years ago I did lose weight quite easily via a popular local class, but I didn't have hypothyroidism then.

Here's all the information about me, if anyone can offer any insight, that would be wonderful. If I've missed any salient bits of information, feel free to fire questions.

I'm 62 years old, so post menopausal.

Switched from Levothyroxine to NDT (Erfa) last October.

It was a very rocky journey and I almost went back to Levo on several occasions but my husband pointed out how ill I'd felt on Levo. So carried on with some help from a couple of people. I had adrenal issues, I believe I still have them, possibly the opposite way from where they were.

My eating regime:-

I have Coeliac Disease so I stick strictly to gluten free, no wheat, no rye, no barley and I don't eat oats, not even the ones labelled gluten free. They make me ill.

I don't drink alcohol at all, haven't done so for about 9 years.

I haven't smoked for 36 years.

I try not to eat any refined sugar, a very occasional treat.

I don't eat anything with artificial sweeteners in.

I've recently been trying to follow principles from the 8 week blood sugar diet and this does seem to be helping the way I feel generally, but no weight loss. I'm not following the recommended 800 calories per day. But keeping to no snacks, no late night food, less carbs, more protein and good fats.

I do eat meat, lean chicken, occasional beef, love fish, particularly the oily types.

I am not exercising at all. I did have one week a few weeks ago where I felt pretty good and went swimming twice, swum 10 lengths on each occasion and did 2 x 2 mile walks that week. About 2 days later I had what I can only describe as a complete crash energy wise. Indicative that adrenals are still not right.

I'm currently taking just under 2 grains of Erfa, split into 2 doses 7am and 3.30pm.

Late morning, taking 1000mg Vitamin C, one multi mineral supplement (no fillers) one x B12 tablet, COQ10, and 1 x 500mg Ashwagandha.

I'm also using a bio identical progesterone cream small amount before bed at night which was to help with a bit of low mood which had crept in during recent months. It does seem to help.

I had a blood test and saliva test done last week.

Results as follows:- (Saliva has changed considerably since last test in Nov 16.)

21.06.2017Adrenal Saliva Test

Time Result Range

Waking * 21.31 14.00 – 21.00

12.00 * 10.27 4.00 – 9.00

16.00 * 7.30 2.50 – 7.00

Before bed* 8.31 0.80 – 4.50

21.06.2017Thyroid Test

TSH 0.448 mIU/L 0.27 - 4.20

Free Thyroxine 13.95 pmol/L 12.00 - 22.00

Total Thyroxine (T4) 95.1 nmol/L 59.00 - 154.00

Free T3 4.66 pmol/L 3.10 - 6.80

Thyroid Antibodies

Thyroglobulin Antibodies 20.340 IU/mL 0.00 - 115.00

Thyroid Peroxidase Antibodies *70.68 IU/mL 0.00 - 34.00

Haematology

Vitamins

Vitamin B12 532 pmol/L 140.00 - 724.00

Folate (Serum) >19.98 ug/L 2.91 - 50.00

25 OH Vitamin D 112.1 nmol/L 50.00 - 200.00

Biochemistry

Inflammation Marker

CRP – High Sensitivity 3.8 mg/l 0.00 - 5.00

Iron Status

Ferritin 132.3 ug/L 13.00 - 150.00

[startagaingirl]

Hi - it might be an understanding issue on my part, but are you taking your minerals and vitamins at the same time? I thought it was better to separate them. Your b12 is still relatively low - optimum around 1000 - so it could be interference is affecting absorption. Also are you taking a mixed B vit to balance out your b12? The other thing I see missing is selenium to help with anti-bodies. Apart from all that your FT3 is still only 42% through the range - most feel better at 66%+, so you are still under-medicated and that could be the reason you now have high cortisol. Your adrenals will be trying to compensate for low FT3 by producing extra cortisol. That also explains your energy crashes after exercise, your body doesn't have enough T3 to replace in a short time-span that used up by exercise.

Gillian

[Hidden in reply to startagaingirl]

Many thanks Gillian,

I noticed that my T3 was quite a bit lower than my last test and not sure why that is. I do think I'm undermedicated, but when I've tried to increase, even a small fragment of a a tablet (effectively 1/8th grain) it gives me a headache, similar to the headache I got when I first started taking it. Initially I was told finish Levo one day, start 1 grain Erfa next. I did this but by day 3 I was feeling horribly unwell. I dropped dose back to half a grain per day split in two doses.

I did take selenium in a supplement for a while but stopped about a month ago I think mostly because the tablet I have is horrible to take. Sorry that sounds wimpish lol.

I have tried splitting vitamins AM and minerals PM, but not sure whether I took the minerals rather late, but I've been waking at around 4.30am / 5am since doing this. So far not taking a B multi, perhaps thats something I should add in. It's so much money all the time for supplements!

I only exercised that one week I mentioned, I've been put off even trying again because of the 'crash' I had a couple of days later.

[Hidden in reply to startagaingirl]

I've just remembered something about B vits Gillian. I did take a supplement before which had all the Bs in but I was affected terribly by the Niacin in it. I had a pretty violent flush from it which went from my neck downwards for quite some time and made me feel quite unwell.

[startagaingirl in reply to Hidden]

Could you find one with a lower dose of niacin (b3) maybe? Whilst flush is apparently harmless I am sure it is unpleasant, but it is important to balance all of them as they work together.

Unfortunately you will be extremely unlikely to lose weight until you are optimally medicated and your system is back in balance. I wish that were different as i also struggle with weight, but I'll get there and so will you.

Gillian

[Hidden in reply to startagaingirl]

I've just been looking at 'non flush' niacin supplements.

I do hope something will shift. I've been quite disheartened more so the last few weeks as I've been trying to find an outfit to wear to my son's graduation ceremony 10th July, which doesn't make me look like a fat frumpy old lady

[Mary-intussuception]

OK

My healthy weight loss regime from a while back which should work. I'm not keeping strictly to it at the moment as I am doing too much. So not losing but not gaining.

Healthy eating reducing diet of 1000 - 1200 calories per day. Involves Restricted foods, Prohibited foods and 'eat freely' foods (eg raspberries, melons ALL vegetables excluding potatoes which are restricted to one medium or 2 small x twice per day)

Exercise needs to be started with no more than 3 to 5 minutes sessions at least once preferably three times per week. This can be increased on second week to three 10 minutes sessions of leisurely walking or swimming. Increasing gradually over several weeks to 3 x half hour sessions per week. More to follow.

[Hidden in reply to Mary-intussuception]

Thanks Mary, I'd be interested to hear more. I'm wary of eating more fruit than I do just now because I was doing that before and believe I was having blood sugar issues. Also I was constantly mid meal snacking which I have stopped altogether now (a tip from the Leptin diet book and the blood sugar diet book)

[Saggyuk in reply to Hidden]

I always thought eating smaller meals more regularly helped stabilise glucose levels and therefore cortisol levels? You could always get a cheap three day blood glucose monitoring pack to check how stable they actually are and if you're getting low/high levels or stable - only about £15?

[Hidden in reply to Saggyuk]

I do actually have a blood test booked for next week for cholesterol & fasting glucose. But also I work in a small nursing home and from time to time one of the nurses is happy enough to check my sugar levels if I feel unwell at all.

[greygoose]

800 calories a day is not enough. Low calorie diets have a negative effect on conversion, and that could be affecting your T3 level. Your T3 is too low for you to lose weight. It's low T3 that causes symptoms like weight-gain, and difficulty losing it.

[Hidden in reply to greygoose]

Don't panic greygoose, I'm not doing the 800 calorie part of the diet. I don't think I could manage that. Just some of the principles of the diet make sense.

Wonder how can I get my T3 back up, it was better at my last test in March. It was at 5.41 with same range. I'm wondering whether the Ashwagandha is messing with things.

[Saggyuk in reply to Hidden]

Even though more than 800, are you definitely eating enough calories though bearing in mind required calory intake for a two yr old with tiny body is 1000? I put on weight if i eat anything much less than 1750 per day and certainly under 1500 a day and generally the more I eat, the more I lose. Not eating enough will effect glucose levels and can cause high cortisol as your body needs energy from somewhere so will compensate first with creating more glucose production and when no glucose left, running on adrenals. not enough calorie intake will also have conversion issues. Just in case

[greygoose in reply to Hidden]

No panic, just general information. It's unbelievable that any diet would recommend 800 calories a day. But, as a hypo, you need to know how things work, and you need calories to convert. A no-carb diet isn't recommended, either, because you need to eat carbs to support conversion, and conversion is what it's all about.

[Hidden in reply to greygoose]

Thanks GG I wonder if this is why my cortisol levels have risen since my last saliva test in November? I have been following quite low carbs / more protein and fats.

[greygoose in reply to Hidden]

Have a look at this :

eastwesthealing.com/hypothy...

It explains a lot.

[Hidden]

Hi Georgina, it is an awful problem and for most people it's due to insulin resistance. You need to get your body to burn fat instead of carbs. For a time you need to avoid all carbs since they break down into glucose and then you have too much insulin which one doctor said "insulin makes you fat". This also creates problems for the liver. Any fat eaten with carbs will then go into storage. It's recommended not to eat fat and carbs at the same meal.

You can get your body to use the fat for energy This may sound impossible but really hen you eat more fat you really don't get that hungry unlike carbs that make you want to eat all the time. There are books about fat as fuel but you could probably find out a lot on the internet under ketogenic diet.

Also unfiltered vinegar blocks starch and after you make the transition you can eat some starches and a small amount like a teaspoon or two before meals will help with that and also kills certain bacteria that feeds on starch. I think that results can be achieved rather quickly if you are fairly strict about it. I also found out on the SIBO series I wrote about today that meat does not feed SIBO and neither does lemon. An imbalance of bacteria seems to be a major instigator for other problems and for one it keeps ferritin low. I hope you will look into this.

[Hidden in reply to Hidden]

Thanks for the information Heloise. I have been eating quite low carbs for probably a couple of months now but have correspondingly increased protein and (good) fats. I haven't put any weight on, but haven't lost any either.

Also for quite some time now I've been buying the normal versions of cottage cheese and yoghurt (greek) rather than the low fat versions and these don't seem to have caused a weight increase.

[Hidden in reply to Hidden]

Can you stop carbs totally for a short while because your body will grab that first since it is preferable at this stage. When you stop producing lots of insulin you will lose weight. Does that make sense?

Any low fat item means it is processed and not good in a whole foods diet. Do you like coconut oil or MCT which could be added to other foods or drinks? It has been hard for me to find enough fatty food but they will satiate you, no kidding, Don't be afraid of fat, your brain will love it and your brain tells everything else what to do. I'm still keeping weight off or losing a bit more even though I may slip up occasionally. I only need to lose five more pounds. Nuts and meat if you eat them contain fat and don't be afraid of so called saturated fat. You need all omega 3-6-9 essential fatty acids.

[Hidden in reply to Hidden]

The only low fat items I used to use were cottage cheese and yoghurt. And when I mention yoghurt, I don't eat any of the flavoured ones, so they're just yoghurt, no additives. I've been on a gluten free diet for over 40 years (I have Coeliac disease) so I'm accustomed to reading ingredients all the time and don't eat things which have zillions of ingredients.

I've been eating lean meat and fish always, though I don't really eat pork or lamb and I do eat nuts, particularly cashews a lot.

Today, I'm less bothered about my weight, just wish I could feel less 'crashed'

[Hidden in reply to Hidden]

I'm sure there is an answer, Georgina; it's such a puzzle but I wonder if the information about SIBO would help. They have mentioned Coeliac quite often in this series. I know there is a ton of information out there to plow through but I just found an answer myself after about 20 years so it pays to keep looking.

I've posted links earlier about this free for now series. They will rerun it later if you can't watch them now. It's sibosos.com

[Hidden in reply to Hidden]

I will read up on SIBO Heloise thanks. I forgot to ask you whats MCT? I'm a little sceptical of coconut oil though I do use it occasionally. I read an article the other day which seemed to saying coconut oil isn't the wonder item it's being heralded as. Though who knows which is the true version of anything nowadays.

[penny]

Having gained a lot of weight when hypo. I lost a stone when I was diagnosed (privately) and took NDT (1 grain). No further weight loss. I eventually went on the 5:2 and lost 24lbs; I still do occasional diet days for the health benefits. At the time I was taking T3 on prescription and when there was a 'bad' batch I could not lose weight. I concluded that when not optimally medicated I could not lose weight. Good luck.

[Hidden in reply to penny]

Thanks Penny. I did read on a post somewhere the other day that someone gained weight while taking NDT (was that Greygoose?) though I haven't really put on weight, just can't shift the excess 3 stone I could do with losing.

I felt that my thyroid levels have certainly been a lot better since being on NDT so I think perhaps I wasn't converting T4 to T3 on Levo. My TSH level was always 3.00 or upwards of there, whereas now it's been consistently below 1. But I have wondered whether a little extra T3 might help. My latest blood test shows a bit of a drop in my T3 level from where it was at the upper end in March.

[greygoose in reply to Hidden]

Probably was greygoose, because it did happen to her! lol

NDT is like any other form of thyroid hormone replacement. It isn't a magic elixir. It suits some people and not others. And, even though it didn't suit me, I would recommend trying it, because it does work for a lot of people. But, don't be like me! Give it a fair trial but don't waste years of your life on it when it's obvious it isn't working! It's all trial and error.

[Hidden in reply to greygoose]

Thanks GG, I'm assuming it is working thyroid wise as my thyroid levels have been much improved since taking it. Though someone else who has been giving me advice has said they feel I should be taking more than I am. But recently I've tried a tiny increase and had similar symptoms to those I had when I first started taking it. Muzzy head and a bit of a headache. I assumed these were related to the increase.

[Hidden in reply to Hidden]

Levothyroxine wasn't working that well for me, so think I'd prefer to stay on Erfa. I was on 75mcg Levo. with poor levels, and when I tried an increase to 100mcg and even a split increase 75 / 100 alternate days, I had awful symptoms crept in.

[greygoose in reply to Hidden]

Could be due to your highish cortisol. If you could lower that a bit, it might help - but please don't ask me how! I don't know about lowering cortisol, I only know about raising it.

But, you certainly do need an increase of something. Have you considered trying a small dose of T3 with your Erfa?

[Hidden in reply to greygoose]

Its odd because my last saliva test showed low and I've been working hard to try and sort that with all sorts of supplements, now seems to have gone the other way, though is the test just indicative of levels on that day I wonder.

I have wondered about adding in T3 though no idea where to obtain it from now. You may remember a previous post where I said I had some T3 but I let go of it all some months ago. I believe it was you who said keep it, you might need it

[greygoose in reply to Hidden]

Ah! Well, there you are, you see! Goosie knows best! lol

Yes, of course, even a saliva test just shows you the state of things on that particular day. But, the results you put on your post above, were all slightly high - and very high at night. Perhaps you should stop the supplements, now, and see what happens.

[Rhondoll]

I am hypo and have hasimoto and in the same boat I work out 2 days a week to 5 depending on how busy I am I eat very clean and gluten free and no weightloss I gained 45lbs after diagnosed and can't lose a lb

[Hidden in reply to Rhondoll]

It's maddening isn't it Rhondoll!

I had the phase about 3 weeks ago where I thought I actually felt quite 'well' and I took advantage and did the swimming and walking but 'crashed' completely energy wise a couple of days later. Now I'm wary of doing any kind of exercise.

[BadHare]

Might be worth a read:

chriskresser.com/your-gut-m...

Your Gut Microbes and Your Thyroid: What’s the Connection?

on March 23, 2016 by Chris Kresser

While there are many factors that influence thyroid function, recent research suggests that gut health may be a key player. The trillions of microbes that reside in your gut have a profound influence on the production of hormones in the body—including thyroid hormones. Read on to find out if a disrupted gut microbiota might be contributing to your thyroid problem, and learn how healing your gut could improve your thyroid function.

[Hidden in reply to BadHare]

Thanks Leverette, funnily enough I read another Chris Kresser article earlier this morning about why not to reduce or cut out carbs when you have Hypo and it kind of made a lot of sense.

Also a couple of other people have said they felt probiotics would be a good thing to try to balance / rectify gut flora which may be contributing to my issues, though in general I don't have digestive issues of any sort.

I will take a look at the article, thank you.

[BadHare in reply to Hidden]

You're welcome!

I started eating kefir every day, after reading his article on its benefits when looking for vitamin K foods. It definitely helped balance my digestion, & I felt better for the extra protein & B12.

DanteNXS(?) recently posted about sugars & thyroid hormones. I'm not good with starch, but eat lots of sugary foods, especially fruit during summer.

It's two years since I started taking thyroid hormones, initially NDT, then I've jiggled with T3 as well, or solely T3 last & this summer. My weight dropped initially, but now seems fixed, despite almost doubling my pre-TH calorie intake. I started restrictive eating times a year earlier, & found this helped, too. I thought it would be hard, but it suits me even more, knowing THs are best absorbed on an empty stomach.

Hope you find something that suits you, & you're feeling better soon!

[Hidden in reply to BadHare]

Leverette, do you buy your Kefir or make it?

I did buy some a while back and rather liked it, but it was in a store further afield from where I live, so not on my usual shopping route.

[BadHare in reply to Hidden]

I make it. I started adding commercial kefir to milk, progressed to powder, then grains. The latter resembles a cauliflower floret with a rubbery texture. It's as easy to make as a cup of tea or coffee. It just needs feeding regularly with organic milk, & keeping happy at an ambient temperature. I think my kefirans have tribble genes.

[penny]

I obviously didn't explain myself clearly...I did not gain weight on NDT, I had the excess weight when undiagnosed and lost 1 stone in the first month on NDT. I gained a lot again when my GP prescribed T4 as NDT was unavailable - I got very sick. I self-medicate on T3 now as the GP stopped my T3 prescription with immediate effect some years ago as, quotes "you have never been diagnosed as hypothyroid". My point was that when my T3 medication was below par I could not lose weight; as soon as my tablets were back to full strength I started losing weight again, about 2lbs per week, every week.

[Hidden in reply to penny]

Sorry Penny, its probably me not reading things properly. I'm so tired at the moment. I've actually come home from work early to rest up on the sofa.

I did have a large quantity of T3 up until a few months ago because I'd intended to go that route rather than NDT. But then 2 things happened. I saw an Endo in London who was willing to allow me to try Erfa and I wasn't confident enough to do the switch to T3 from Levo. on my own. So I parted company with the 600 tablets I had to someone who needed them in another forum!.

Would you be able to message me privately where you get your T3 from? I do know of 2 sources but always interesting to know of others.

[Hidden]

That sounds interesting Lars but I don't understand the last sentence at all?