After suffering from pretty much of all HypoT symptoms for last 6 years i came across the Ray Pest articles and Broda Barnes work. Does anyone else have experience of self treating themselves with NDT (e.g Metavive or such like) or perhaps point me to relavent threads on this forum.
My waking basal temperatures is always in region 35-36 Celsius. During the day it very rarely goes above 36.4
Ps In hindsight i think HypoT got worse after experimenting of and on with fasting and more recently trying to follow ZOE diet style .
My TSH (2,5) ,FT3(4.9), FT4(17.9) - strangely are within range,Cholesterol is raised though- according to Broda Barnes then go by symptoms which I have.
Full Medichecks reading with Ranges below:-
Diabetes
HBA1C
20 - 41.999 R. — 64 mMol/Mol
OESTRADIOL
41.4 - 159 R. — 45.9 pmol/L
TESTOSTERONE
8.64 - 29 R. — 8.02 nmol/L
FREE TESTOSTERONE - CALC.
0.16 - 0.47 R. —0.216 nmol/L
Autoimmunity
THYROGLOBULIN ANTIBODIES
0 - 115 R. — 22.4 kIU/L
THYROID PEROXIDASE ANTIBODIES
0 - 34 R - 22 kIU/L
Thyroid Hormones
TSH
0.27 - 4.2 R. —1.82 mIU/L
FREE T3
3.1 - 6.8 R. — 4.8 pmol/L
FREE THYROXINE
12 - 22 R. — 17.3 pmol/L
Hormones
FSH
1.5 - 12.4 R. — 3.8 IU/L
LH
1.7 - 8.6 R. —3.4 IU/L
Red Blood Cells
HAEMOGLOBIN
130 - 180 R - 135 g/L
HAEMATOCRIT
0.4 - 0.52 R. - 0.445 L/L
RED CELL COUNT
4.4 - 6.5 R. - 4.79. 10^12/L
MCV
80 - 100 R. - 92.9. fL
MCH
27 - 32 R - 28.1 pg
MCHC
320 - 360 R. -303 g/L
RDW
11.5 - 15 R. -15.3 %
WHITE CELL COUNT
3 - 11 R. - 6.8. 10^9/L
NEUTROPHILS
2 - 7.5 R. - 4.3. 10^9/L
LYMPHOCYTES
1.5 - 4.5 R. - 1.7 10^9/L
MONOCYTES
0.2 - 0.8 R. — 0.1 10^9/L
EOSINOPHILS
0 - 0.4 R. — 0.6 10^9/L
BASOPHILS
0 - 0.1 R. — 0 10^9/L
Clotting Status
PLATELET COUNT
150 - 450 R. — 275 10^9/L
MPV
7 - 13 R. - 10.2 fL
Kidney Health
UREA.
2.5 - 7.8 R -- 4.8 mmol/L
CREATININE
60 - 120 R. —70.8 umol/L
EGFR
≥ 60 R. — >90 ml/min/1.73m2
Liver Health
BILIRUBIN
< 22 R. — 16.5 umol/L
ALP
30 - 130 R. - 96 U/L
ALT
< 45 R. — 58 U/L
GGT
< 55 R — 25 U/L
Proteins
TOTAL PROTEIN
60 - 80 R — 80 g/L
ALBUMIN
35 - 50 R. — 47 g/L
GLOBULIN
19 - 35 R. — 33 g/L
SHBG
20.6 - 76.7 R. —14.2 nmol/L
Cholesterol Status
TOTAL CHOLESTEROL
< 5 R. — 5.9 mmol/L
LDL CHOLESTEROL
< 3 R. 3.66 — mmol/L
NON HDL CHOLESTEROL
< 4 R. — 4.41 mmol/L
HDL CHOLESTEROL
> 1 R 1.52 mmol/L
TOTAL CHOLESTEROL : HDL
< 6 R — 3.9 Ratio
TRIGLYCERIDES
< 2.3 R — 1.64 mmol/L
TRIGLYCERIDE : HDL
< 0.87 R. — 1.08 Ratio
APOLIPOPROTEIN A1
> 1.25 R. — 1.58 g/L
APOLIPOPROTEIN B
< 1 R. —1.27 g/L
LIPOPROTEIN(A)
< 75 R. — 7 nmol/L
APOB : APOA RATIO
< 0.7 R. —- 0.8 ratio
Inflammation
CRP HS
< 3 R. — 4.6 mg/L
Gout Risk
URIC ACID
200 - 430 R — 281 umol/L
Iron Status
IRON
10 - 30 R — 21.6 umol/L
TIBC
45 - 81 R — 61.6 umol/L
UIBC
12 - 43 R — 40 umol/L
TRANSFERRIN SATURATION
25 - 45 R— 35.1 %
FERRITIN
30 - 518 R— 102 ug/L
Vitamins
FOLATE - SERUM
> 7 R — 13.3 nmol/L
VITAMIN B12 - ACTIVE
> 37.5 R — 133 pmol/L
VITAMIN D
50 - 250 R. — 49.8 nmol/L
Any advice or pointers for this journey appreciated.
Cheers
Kully
Written by
PaddiSurfer
To view profiles and participate in discussions please or .
- it additionally mentions Hypothyroidism as a reason for feeling cold=> Confused
Hypothyroidism occurs when your thyroid doesn’t produce and release enough hormones, causing aspects of your metabolism to slow down. One of the more common symptoms of this condition, which affects nearly 5 percent of Americans age 12 and up, is a sudden sensitivity to cold. Other warning signs include fatigue, weight gain, joint and muscle pain and a slowed heart rate.
First of all, Metavive is not NDT. It is what we call a Glandular. And we have no idea what is in it. There may be some hormone, there may not. But if there is, we can have no idea how much. And that is not an ideal way to treat hypothyroidislm.
That said, it does help some people, but usually taken along side real NDT with know hormone quantities. These can be bought on-line without a prescription but are difficult to find and supply is not guaranteed. It's all a bit of a gamble, really.
As Buddy195 says, we do need the ranges for all your results to make any sense of them. But a TSH is always a TSH and yours is not saying hypo. So I imagine that is why you've never managed to get diagnosed. A TSH says your thyroid is struggling, but you're not truly hypo until it's over 3. And doctors usually want it to be over 10 before they will diagnose. NHS doctors do not go by symptoms! They don't even know what they are.
And the problem with symptoms is that they are all non-specific - all of them could be due to 'something else'.
I'm not trying to discourage you from self-treating, not at all. I self-treat myself. But only after years of experience having aquired quite an exstensive knowledge of thyroid. You need to know what your doing. Do you feel confident that you know enough about thyroid to self-treat?
Another problem with self-treating is that it will hinder your chances of getting a diagnosis. And that could cause problems in future - if you're hospitalised or something like that. So you need to go into it with your eyes fully open, and full knowledge of the possible pit-falls ahead.
Did you give us the ranges somewhere? Can't be much help without the ranges.
When taking supplements, you also need to take the co-factors, or the supplements won't do you much good - and could even do harm. With vit D, you need to take some form of magnesium and vit K2-MK7.
B vits all work together and need to be kept balanced. So rather than taking the odd B here and there, you'd be better of with a good methylated B complex.
Folic Acid: methylfolate would be better. Folic acid is the synthetic form of folate and has to be converted to methylfolate in the body. Not everyone is very good at that.
B12: it doesn't say what it is. But there's not enough of it.
Iron: taking iron blocks absorption most of the other ingredients, so your not going to get much benefit from anything. Iron should be taken at least two hours away from everything else except vit C. And there's not much vit C in this multi.
Copper and zinc: These two need to be kept balanced, but if you're hypo, you're likely to have one of them too high, and therefore the other one will be too low. And taking more of the one that is already high is not a good idea. Both should be tested before supplementing either.
Selenium: no information on what form of selenium.
Iodine: Worst of all! Nobody should self-treat with iodine, it needs specialist supervision, with a protocol set up first. What's more, you should never taking without having your iodine level checked first, because excess iodine is dangerous. And it's even worse for hypos because iodine is anti-thyroid - i.e. reduces hormone production. If you've been taking this multi for some time, it could be the cause of all your problems.
>> See my earlier reply : Added to my original post above and also in Bio.
When taking suppleents, you also need to take the co-factors,
>> Sorry forgot to mention I am taking K and Magnesium.
B vits all work together and need to be kept balanced. So rather than taking the odd B here and there, you'd be better of with a good methylated B complex.
>>> Thanks point taken. Will purchase a good methylated B complex.
Is this the mulit you're taking? vitabiotics.com/products/we...
>>> Yes this is the one
On here, we don't recommend multi-vits in general, but this one is particularly bad. >> Noted.My Doctor recommended it . Will bin the Wellman multi asap.
Folic Acid: methylfolate would be better. Folic acid is the synthetic form of folate and has to be converted to methylfolate in the body. Not everyone is very good at that.
>> Thanks a new
B12: it doesn't say what it is. But there's not enough of it.
Iron: taking iron blocks absorption most of the other ingredients, so your not going to get much benefit from anything. Iron should be taken at least two hours away from everything else except vit C. And there's not much vit C in this multi.
>>>Thanks I did not know this negative aspect of Iron.
Copper and zinc: These two need to be kept balanced, but if you're hypo, you're likely to have one of them too high, and therefore the other one will be too low. And taking more of the one that is already high is not a good idea. Both should be tested before supplementing either.
Selenium: no information on what form of selenium.
Iodine: Worst of all! Nobody should self-treat with iodine, it needs specialist supervision, with a protocol set up first. What's more, you should never taking without having your iodine level checked first, because excess iodine is dangerous. And it's even worse for hypos because iodine is anti-thyroid - i.e. reduces hormone production. If you've been taking this multi for some time, it could be the cause of all your problems.
>>> I've not taken pure iodine before other than in this multi vitamin form which was only started a week ago.
?? Question though in Dr MyHill's book it mentions that Lugal's iodine supplementation 15% 3 drops per day is a god for most people as she feels most of the population is iodine deficient. Why is there so much difference of opinion on iodine
I will get my iodine level checked and look into a
Thanks for the detailed response . Very much appreciated.
Yes, I know a lot of doctors recommend taking iodine. In fact, a lot of doctors think that all you have to do for a thyroid problem is throw iodine at it! But I bet they've never suffered the consequences of excess iodine themselves!
I don't know where she gets her information about iodine deficiency, I've never heard of a survey of any kind. It's rather a bold assumption. But I did not say no-one should ever take iodine, I said you should get tested first to see if you need it - it won't help you if you don't, more is never better. AND THEN it should be taken under the guidance of an experienced practician. Taking a few drops of iodine just in case is not a good idea.
Iodine is just one of the ingredients of thyroid hormone - 4 atoms for every molecule of T4, a very small amount. And if you're hypo, and your thyroid is not making as much hormone - or none at all if you're on thyroid hormone replacement - you need less iodine, not more. It will not magically make your thyroid come alive and start functioning normally. That's just not what it does.
I can mirror much of your story, as I was living in S Ireland when I was diagnosed with thyroid problems, by my Doc. But I couldn’t be prescribed T4 until an Endocrinologist diagnosed me.
That was a 2 yr wait …too long, so I went onto NDT. As I’d found a good book in the library, (no easy internet in 2008!)This book guided me with the Broda Barnes technique, I’d results similar to yours. My BP was lower.
The book was by Dr Barry Durrant Peatfield, that saved my sanity. The brain fogs were bad I just wanted to hibernate. He did explain about cholesterol and its important use in one’s body . Even vegetarian rabbits have cholesterol !
By 2015 I’d moved to the UK and lots of blood tests were done. I was reacting to T4. All sorts were tried, I’d vile case of hives.
I couldn’t source good NDT.
In 2020 I was able to see a good Endocrinologist, who put me on a trial of T3/T4 and the balance was just right, it was as good as the NDT, (nearly as the T1& T 2 are missing.! )
As others in this forum have pointed out we need your tests boundaries. Also living in the UK to get medical help in the majority of cases you’ll only get help if you are on T4 T3 meds.
There’s lots more to my story. Oddly I’m also a vegetarian and minimal alcohol drinker.
Content on HealthUnlocked does not replace the relationship between you and doctors or other healthcare professionals nor the advice you receive from them.
Never delay seeking advice or dialling emergency services because of something that you have read on HealthUnlocked.
TSH still high even on T4? Also High MHCH
latest bloods
and all bloods taken over the years
Searching for a diagnosis (DESPERATELY) Please helpppp.... Is Hypothyroid possible with these blood tests??? NEW HERE
Obtained my results as advised by the community, after being advised by GP to go for repeat test in 4-6 weeks as borderline thyroid issue...
Blood Results - Thoughts?
