Blood Test for vits (and thyroid)

[Lottyplum]

Hello all.

Following advice from SlowDragon, got GP to agree to Vit testing as T3 low and as SlowDragon though they would, they drew blood for Thyroid levels , too! Must say here, too, after GPS lowered my Levo, because I had too many hypo symptoms return, I upped the dose from 175 to 200 as on 200 for 40+ years and faired ok. Feel so much better on this dose and getting my 1 hr walk in every day, with at least 6-10000 steps.

Also, here on the vitamins I have been taking since COVID. Initially to protect from the dreaded virus but from the forum realise it helps my thyroid too! It worked too!

D3, K2(MK7), magnesium (from 3 sources), B-complex, selenium, Beta Glucans immune support (contains Vit A, D+C, zinc, copper, selenium, garlic, beta Glucans, elderberry extrac), Vit E, Quercitin, zinc, cod liver oil with evening primrose oil.

My blood test taken last Friday@8.35am. Also should mention that my TSH has been suppressed for years, no doubt aided by the fact I have no thyroid gland as it was removed 42 years ago!

Thank you in advance for your help!

[waveylines]

Seems to me putting your dose back up was a wise decision! Good for you! Glad you feel much better and back on track. Yay!

Ft4 is great..... & maybe they should take note that the TSH is unimportant!!

Your B12 & vit D & folate look look good to me. Though if your taking any vit D supplement you may want to dial back a bit as its very top of the range.

I'm not familiar with ferritin in where in the range to aim for so won't comment.

[Lottyplum in reply to waveylines]

Thankyou. I'm wanting to get my T3 up in numbers so really been trying with my supplements. T3 has gone up since I upped my Levo but still don't think it's optimal - but I am new to all this even tho a golden oldie of 74! 🪇

[waveylines in reply to Lottyplum]

Honestly Lottyplum though the blood tests are useful at the end of the day its really about how you feel. Everyone is different. If you feel your normal self & well then that's really good.If you're going to go for T3 added into the mix then you need to pick an Endo very very carefully. If you want it on the NHS you will need to see a NHS Endo.GP referral.

Many Endos are diabetes specialists and know no more than a GP. A lot go on TSH levels....

Thyroid UK have a list of Thyroid doctors (private & NHS) you can ask for to be emailed across but still check them out very carefully. Liothyronine (T3) isnt easy to get on the NHS but it does happen.

[Lottyplum in reply to waveylines]

Yep. Understand that many Endos know even less than necessary to help thyroid patients so just wondering if there’s anything I can do to up my T3. I know I Only function well with my T4 in the high range, hence upping my Levo to 200mgs. At one point, because my TSH is suppressed GP in medical centre shunted it down to 150!! I was unwell, gained nearly a stone+looked and felt like the Michelin man. No more will I let them push me around like that. I used to run every day+ loved it so even at my age would like to get back to running, even at my age! So, I will continue taking private blood tests+just let the GP have a copy+ try to improve any Vit levels I can - if I can get more info in that arena.

[SlowDragon Administrator]

Was last dose levothyroxine 24 hours before test

FT4: 21.8 pmol/l (Range 11 - 23)

Ft4 is 90.00% through range

But

FT3: 4.8 pmol/l (Range 3.9 - 6.8)

Ft3 only 31.03% through range

So how do you feel

Many (most?) thyroid patients need/feel best with Ft3 at least 60-70% through range……and probably Ft4 a little lower

So a very slight reduction in levothyroxine …..eg 100mcg 4 days a week and 87.5mcg 2 days a week (reducing dose by 25mcg PER WEEK)

You may benefit from addition of small dose T3 prescribed alongside levothyroxine

Would need to see endocrinologist to get T3 prescribed,

initially see one privately as it’s important to see a know thyroid specialist and NHS over a years wait and often don’t get to see head consultant, only a junior

List of thyroid specialists and endocrinologists who will prescribe T3

healthunlocked.com/thyroidu...

[Lottyplum in reply to SlowDragon]

Sorry to be a pain but what are your thoughts in my Folate, ferritin+B12 levels? Good enough or need work? Thank you.

[SlowDragon Administrator in reply to Lottyplum]

Both good

[Lottyplum in reply to SlowDragon]

Thankyou.

[Lottyplum]

Yes. Followed Thyroid UK’s protocol for blood test - tho this was meant to be just for vits so to be on the safe side, did blood test as if for thyroid bloods! Sneaky GP. When taking Levo for 40 yrs @ 200mgs always felt much better. When GP reduced I ended up (no matter what I did with increased water etc) in severe abdominal pain. GP wouldn’t listen that it was due to reduced Levo. Sent to hospital and registrar didn’t listen either! Had endoscopy - clear; Ct scan - clear. So I increased my Levo from 175 to 200mgs and so much better. Didn’t consult GP. Began taking private blood tests. At your suggestion because of low FT3, asked GP for D3, Ferritin, B12 and Folate. Results above. Do I have any issues I can address to help raise my FT3 before I go down the private Endo route? I did see an NHS Endo last Sept, who talked tosh at times (from what I have learned on this forum) and even discharged me before any of the blood results she ordered came back! Not encouraging. Thank you for your help.

[SlowDragon Administrator in reply to Lottyplum]

As your vitamin levels are all good there’s not much else you can do to try to improve conversion rate of Ft4 to Ft3

Are you still strictly gluten free

Have you tried dairy free

Personally I find both are essential…but still need T3 as well …more on my profile

Next step it to get T3 prescribed alongside levothyroxine

Roughly where in U.K. are you

[Lottyplum in reply to SlowDragon]

Thanks. I'm in Lancashire. Saw an NHS Endo last Sept for first time. Told me all Endos think the same. Suppressed TSH causes osteoporosis! My face told her I disagreed! Sent me for DXA scan but my bones are Ok. My parting shot was, "we all have a unique thumb print+one size doesn't fit all!" Even with poor T3 conversion, was discharged there+then so have no faith in her. She prob thought I was not compliant enough ! Was going to get private Endo list from Thyroid UK. Thanks for all your help. Invaluable.

[Lottyplum in reply to SlowDragon]

Forgot to say, am gluten free but not dairy free. Have a mix of df milk +ordinary milk in cups of tea!

[SlowDragon Administrator in reply to Lottyplum]

I find Plenish oat milk the best alternative milk

Perfect in coffee ….and now got use to it in tea

[Lottyplum in reply to SlowDragon]

Then will give going df a go. At least I like Nomo chocolate!!🤗

[pennyannie]

Hey there again :

If it helps I now aim to maintain my ferritin at around 100 - folate around 20 - with active B12 at around 75 ++ ( serum B12 500 ++ ) and vitamin D at around 100 :

We tend to feel at our best when the T4 is up in the top quadrant with our T3 tracking behind by around 15%.

The accepted conversion ratio when on T4 monotherapy is said to be 1 / 3.50 - 4.50 - T3/T4 - with most people feeling at their best when they come in this ratio at 4 or under.

So if I divide your T3 into your T4 I'm getting your ratio coming in at 4.73 - so slightly wide :

Apart from having to maintain optimaal vitamins and minerals conversion can also be down regulated by any physiological stress ( emotional or physical ) inflammation, antibodies, dieting, depression and ageing - so not as a simple ' fix ' but worth bearing in mind.

A small reduction in T4 with a corrsponding small dose in T3 could restore thyroid hormonal balance and maybe take the strain off your body just a little.

Your lucky to have a GP who seems to be able to run all the blood tests -

Maybe go into openprescribing.net and then analyse - and check out your surgery -

just enter your surgery name and the drug as being Liothyronine and see if they are even writing any T3 prescriptions and supporting some patients -

you can also check your CCG/ICB area in this way.

[Lottyplum in reply to pennyannie]

Thanks for your helpful response. The full blood test was in response to SlowDragon's suggestion after my last private blood test. Had to wait a month and in that time things improved. My GP said T3 was irrelevant so not much hope in that dept, as per usual. I'm just glad my supplementation has been beneficial as improved in the full panel I had 12 months ago. Thank you again.

[SmallBlueThing]

You might want to ask for a Bone Profile blood test, to be sure your vitamin D3 supplementation isn't causing hypercalcaemia.

[Lottyplum in reply to SmallBlueThing]

Was going to give my D3+K2 a miss for a short time+then get D3 test done privately+see if it falls slightly. I always take D3 with K2(M57). Last year's DXA scan was fine. Talking to my medical centre about these things is like talking to a wall! They seem to be clueless! It was hard enough getting a print out of my blood test - had a fight if my hands with receptionist. She said GP had to approve! Nearly lost my rag with her (thru gritted teeth). The energy needed to deal with them is enough to cause a migraine. Think I will check what my private medical insurance includes but think it's rather basic but the way the NHS treats us older folk is the reasoning behind having it.😱

[SmallBlueThing in reply to Lottyplum]

I never have a problem getting a Bone Profile, but do draw a blank with GPs acting on the results. I have mild hypOcalcaemia which, if anything, was worse one year when I had plenty of sun-exposure. I took a loading dose of vitamins D3+K2 earlier this year, which may have been responsible for my slightly improved calcium level, but haven't, at least yet, had my vitamin D tested by GP this year. I may have to wait until my annual treat of a private fingerprick test. Full blood counts seem to be standard in these days of continuing COVID-19.

Hypercalcaemia can cause all sorts of symptoms and problems, and can be more likely if vitamin A intake (perhaps from eating liver) is also high.

[Lottyplum in reply to SmallBlueThing]

I’m trying to keep as far away from our medical centre as have no confidence in their ability to listen or to understand thyroid issues! Looking at my bloods from last Sept I have improved big time, feel so much better since upping my Levo so will do blood tests again in spring to check again. Thanks again for your input. So grateful for everyone helping my understanding in this complex arena.🥰

[Noelnoel in reply to Lottyplum]

Was going to give my D3+K2 a miss for a short time+then get D3 test done privately+see if it falls slightly

Lottyplum

Remember that at this time of year we get far less sunshine on top of which we tend to be fully clothed, preventing skin exposure and even if the skin is exposed, because the angle of the sun is such that UVB rays are blocked, D3 declines so it may be the wrong time of year to be stopping your supplement. Just a thought … and in any case you’re only just outside the parameters, so your level isn’t alarmingly high

NHS guidelines say that toxicity occurs at a level of 500 and while I’m not suggesting anyone should be aiming for that, at 155 your level is considered safe still

Btw, how much selenium do you take and how often? Selenium is said to aid T4 conversion so it may be worth testing selenium levels to see if you have room to increase your dose and raise your body’s capacity to convert better

[Lottyplum in reply to Noelnoel]

Thankyou for those tips. Thanks now I will continue with D3/K2 and check again in the spring! Think I need to double check the total amounts of the selenium I take as I take a separate daily selenium tab+it's also in the Beta Glucan Complex I take (with zinc, copper+elderberry). I know with age (I'm 74) supplements can be depleted +GPs no longer have us in for an annual al MOT since COVID so we're on our own+have to care for ourselves mentally, emotionally+ nutritionally with help from others like this wonderful forum. Gosh, I've learned+continue to learn so much here. Cannot thank you all enough!🤗

[Noelnoel in reply to Lottyplum]

It’s a fab forum

Yes, it’s a good idea to calculate how much selenium in total. It’s also a good idea to make sure you’re leaving enough time between taking doses of certain supplements and levo

[Lottyplum in reply to Noelnoel]

I always leave 4 hrs from my Levo and taking any supplements. Don’t want to mess with absorption. 🤐

[Noelnoel in reply to Lottyplum]

👍