Antibodies and vitamin/mineral levels

Antibodies are TPO 803.5 (<34) and TG >1300 (<115)

Been told negative for Hashimotos

Also

Ferritin 22 (15 - 400)

MCV 77.1 (80 - 100)

MCHC 386 (310 - 350)

MCH 28.2 (28 - 32)

Haemoglobin 113 (115 - 150)

Iron 5.4 (6.0 - 26.0)

Transferrin saturation 15 (10 - 30)

Folate 3.8 (4.6 - 18.7)

Vitamin B12 195 (190 - 900)

Vitamin D 28.3 (25 - 50 deficiency. Supplementation is indicated)

Taking 800iu vitamin D and 1 ferrous fumarate tablet a day, both since 2013 and results taken Aug 2017. Feedback welcome thanks

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5 Replies

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  • Hi Summer, your haemoglobin, iron and folate are below range. Hopefully others on this Forum will give you advice about this. Your B12 is at the bottom of the range and should be nearer to the top. You should supplement with methylcobalamin. I use Jarrow's.

    You have got Hashimoto's because you have high antibodies, which are attacking your thyroid gland. Some doctor's don't know what Hashimoto's is and call it 'autoimmune thyroiditis.' Lots of people with this illness give up gluten. Gluten molecules are similar in structure to thyroid molecules, so eating it can produce a 'flare up'. Also, avoid soy, which can interfere with the uptake of thyroid hormones.

    Have you had your TSH and T4 measured? If so can you post them as well. How are you feeling?

  • previous endo put me on T3 added to my levothyroxine since I don't convert T4 to T3, current endo says I don't need T3 and symptoms are not low thyroid. List below

    Constipation

    Feeling cold

    Cold hands and feet

    Goitre

    Heavy periods

    Weight gain

    Tiredness

    Hair thinning outer eyebrows

    Cramps

    Pins and needles

    So no idea where I now stand. Taking 100mcg levothyroxine and diagnosed hypothyroid 2013.

    Thanks

    TSH 1.50 (0.2 - 4.2)

    Free T4 16.1 (12.0 - 22.0)

    Free T3 3.7 (3.1 - 6.8)

  • I wonder what your current endo thinks these symptoms are then? Some yet to be invented illness? If it has been established that you don't convert to T3 why was it withdrawn? Is this to do with cost, I wonder? Dr. Anthony Toft who used to head the British Thyroid Association believes that TSH needs to be below 1 to feel the benefit of treatment. Your T3 and T4 are at the bottom of the range and should be towards the top.

    This link is to a post on this Forum giving advice on what to do if T3 is withdrawn:

    healthunlocked.com/thyroidu...

    If you decide to self medicate T3, put a new post on the forum and you will get information about where to get it from. I take NDT, so don't have that information to hand.

  • Oh what rubbish! Of course you're not negative for Hashi's! Both your antibodies are well over-range, so that is Hashi's whether they like it or not! But, some endos/doctors refuse to call it Hashi's and prefer to call it Autoimmune Thyroiditis. If they deny that, then ask what on earth the antibodies mean, then!

    All your nutrients are low. Your B12 is so low you should be tested for Pernicious Anemia before you start any kind of supplementation.

    The vit D supplement you have been prescribed is not enough to raise your levels, you could take it for the rest of your life and still be deficient.

    And I very much doubt that one ferrous fumarate tablet a day is going to do anything for your iron! You should look at SeasideSusie's replies to other people to get an idea of what you should be taking. :)

  • Summer601

    TPO 803.5 (<34) and TG >1300 (<115)

    I always thought you had to be educated to a certain level to get into med school. It looks as though your doctor missed the lesson where it was discussed that < means less than!

    Yes, you are positive for autoimmune thyroid disease aka Hashimoto's which is where antibodies attack the thyroid and gradually destroy it. The antibody attacks cause fluctuations in symptoms and test results.

    You can help reduce the antibodies by adopting a strict gluten free diet which has helped many members here. Gluten contains gliadin (a protein) which is thought to trigger autoimmune attacks so eliminating gluten can help reduce these attacks. You don't need to be gluten sensitive or have Coeliac disease for a gluten free diet to help.

    Supplementing with selenium l-selenomethionine 200mcg daily can also help reduce the antibodies, as can keeping TSH suppressed.

    Here's some information so that you can read and learn all about Hashi's so that you can help yourself, it's obvious that your doctor isn't much help:

    Gluten/thyroid connection: chriskresser.com/the-gluten...

    stopthethyroidmadness.com/h...

    stopthethyroidmadness.com/h...

    hypothyroidmom.com/hashimot...

    thyroiduk.org.uk/tuk/about_...

    Hashi's often causes gut/absorption problems which can lead to dire nutrient levels, which you have in abundance. SlowDragon has links and information about that and she will respond when she's around.

    **

    Ferritin 22 (15 - 400)

    MCV 77.1 (80 - 100)

    MCHC 386 (310 - 350)

    MCH 28.2 (28 - 32)

    Haemoglobin 113 (115 - 150)

    Iron 5.4 (6.0 - 26.0)

    Transferrin saturation 15 (10 - 30)

    1 ferrous fumarate tablet a day since 2013

    For thyroid hormone to work ferritin needs to be at least 70, preferably half way through range. You can help raise your level by eating liver regularly, maximum 200g per week due to it's high Vit A content, and including lots of iron rich foods in your diet apjcn.nhri.org.tw/server/in...

    BUT you really need an iron infusion for a level as low as this so ask for one, but you may only be allowed tablets which will take months to raise your level whereas an infusion will raise your level within 24-48 hours.Take each iron tablet with 1000mg Vitamin C to aid absorption and help prevent constipaton. Always take iron 4 hours away from thyroid meds and two hours away from other medication and supplements as it will affect absorption.

    Has anyone told you that you have iron deficiency anaemia? These results suggest it and you should point this out your doctor. If you have been told you have iron deficiency anaemia then you are being given the wrong treatment.

    NICE Clinical Knowledge Summary for iron deficiency anaemia treatment (which will be very similar to your local area guidelines)

    cks.nice.org.uk/anaemia-iro...

    How should I treat iron deficiency anaemia?

    •Address underlying causes as necessary (for example treat menorrhagia or stop nonsteroidal anti-inflammatory drugs, if possible).

    Treat with oral ferrous sulphate 200 mg tablets two or three times a day.

    ◦If ferrous sulphate is not tolerated, consider oral ferrous fumarate tablets or ferrous gluconate tablets.

    ◦Do not wait for investigations to be carried out before prescribing iron supplements.

    •If dietary deficiency of iron is thought to be a contributory cause of iron deficiency anaemia, advise the person to maintain an adequate balanced intake of iron-rich foods (for example dark green vegetables, iron-fortified bread, meat, apricots, prunes, and raisins) and consider referral to a dietitian.

    • Monitor the person to ensure that there is an adequate response to iron treatment.

    I would also ask your doctor why, after taking ferrous fumarate for 4 years, is your ferritin still below range and that you appear to have iron deficiency anaemia. He must have seen these results, ask him why he has ignored them.

    **

    Folate 3.8 (4.6 - 18.7) Vitamin B12 195 (190 - 900)

    You are folate deficient and your B12 has just scraped in at the bottom of the range.

    Do you have any signs of B12 deficiency b12deficiency.info/signs-an... You should post on the Pernicious Anaemia Society forum for further advice healthunlocked.com/pasoc and you should quote your folate, B12, ferritin results, any iron deficiency information, any signs of B12 deficiency you may be experiencing. You may need testing for Pernicious Anaemia and you may need B12 injections.

    You should discuss the PA forum's advice with your GP. If you are prescribed folic acid DO NOT start taking it until any further investigations regarding your B12 have been done.

    I have read (but not researched so don't have links) that BCSH, UKNEQAS and NICE guidelines recommend:

    "In the presence of discordance between test results and strong clinical features of deficiency, treatment should not be delayed to avoid neurological impairment."

    And an extract from the book, "Could it be B12?" by Sally M. Pacholok:

    "We believe that the 'normal' serum B12 threshold needs to be raised from 200 pg/ml to at least 450 pg/ml because deficiencies begin to appear in the cerebrospinal fluid below 550".

    "For brain and nervous system health and prevention of disease in older adults, serum B12 levels should be maintained near or above 1000 pg/ml."

    Folate should be at least half way through it's range.

    **

    Vitamin D 28.3 (25 - 50 deficiency. Supplementation is indicated) Taking 800iu vitamin D since 2013

    Another question for your doctor - why, considering I've been supplementing with Vit D for 4 years, am I just 3.3 away from severe Vit D deficiency?

    800iu D3 isn't going to ever raise your level. It is hardly a maintenance dose for someone with a reasonable level.

    NICE treatment summary for Vit D deficiency:

    cks.nice.org.uk/vitamin-d-d...

    Treat for vitamin D deficiency if serum 25-hydroxyvitamin D (25[OH]D) levels are less than 30 nmol/L.

    For the treatment of vitamin D deficiency, the recommended treatment is based on fixed loading doses of vitamin D (up to a total of about 300,000 international units [IU]) given either as weekly or daily split doses, followed by lifelong maintenance treatment of about 800 IU a day. Higher doses of up to 2000 IU a day, occasionally up to 4000 IU a day, may be used for certain groups of people, for example those with malabsorption disorders. Several treatment regimens are available, including 50,000 IU once a week for 6 weeks (300,000 IU in total), 20,000 IU twice a week for 7 weeks (280,000 IU in total), or 4000 IU daily for 10 weeks (280,000 IU in total)."

    Each Health Authority has their own guidelines but they will be very similar. Go and see your GP and demand that he treats you according to the guidelines and prescribes the loading doses. Once these have been completed you will need a reduced amount (not a paltry 800iu though) to bring your level up to what's recommended by the Vit D Council - which is 100-150nmol/L - and then you'll need a maintenance dose which may be 2000iu daily (not 800iu daily), it's trial and error so it's recommended to retest once or twice a year to keep within the recommended range. You can do this with a private fingerprick blood spot test with City Assays vitamindtest.org.uk/

    There are important cofactors needed when taking D3

    vitamindcouncil.org/about-v...

    D3 aids absorption of calcium from food and K2-MK7 directs the calcium to bones and teeth where it is needed and away from arteries and soft tissues where it can be deposited and cause problems.

    D3 and K2 are fat soluble so should be taken with the fattiest meal of the day, D3 four hours away from thyroid meds.

    Magnesium comes in different forms, check to see which would suit you best and as it's calming it's best taken in the evening, four hours away from thyroid meds

    naturalnews.com/046401_magn...

    Check out the other cofactors too.

    **

    TSH 1.50 (0.2 - 4.2)

    Free T4 16.1 (12.0 - 22.0)

    Free T3 3.7 (3.1 - 6.8)

    You are undermedicated on 100mcg Levo and as your conversion is so poor you need your T3 back. If your T3 is added back in there's no need to alter your dose of Levo. Follow the advice and link Scazzoh has given you about reinstating your T3.

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