2nd Medichecks Results after advice by member to get a full iron panel..., any advice, guidance would be much appreciated.

[jamjar67]

Sorry..., this is a bit long!!!!...

These are my 2nd Medichecks results, done fasting and early morning, took levo after test, also stopped vits for a week prior to testing.... - after posting my 1st Medichecks results (See results at bottom of post fyi)....I was advised by a member to get a full iron panel, I ended up doing the Well Woman Ultravit as it was on special offer and it was a fairly comprehensive test which I thought would give a good picture..., I haven’t put everything on just the bits I thought looked suspect....

I am disappointed to see despite increase in thyroxine my levels have dropped slightly and also despite trying to eat well to help build my ferritin that has also dropped

I cant eat liver or pate but have just started taking Pure Encapsulations Ferritin and Vit C... 1 tablet a day but it says I can go up to 3....? I eat lots of veges and have lemon juice in water and avoid tea straight after eating....

On a positive my Vit D is going up... yaaay but my B12 has dropped....,

I realise I need to increase my levo and was thinking 75mcg....I do keep getting a hoarse, croaky voice... and wonder if that’s my thyroid being attacked !!?? 🥴

I still have ringing in my ears (it has actually cleared up in one ear 👍( I did have it in both) also a slight spacey/balance feeling in my head however it’s much improved to what it was!!

Any comments greatly appreciated 🙏...., I have to say I’m a bit addicted to this site, I would have been lost without it and have learnt so much because of it..., so big thanks to you all !!! xxx

Results on increase to 62.5mcg levo

5/2/19

TSH 2.34. (0.27 - 4.2)

FT3. 4.43. 3.1-6.8

FT4. 15.6 12-22

Active B12. 123. (37.5 - 188)

Folate. 14.48 (3.89 - 26.8)

Vit D. 97.1. (50 -175)

Iron Serum. 22.38. (5.8-34.5)

T.I.B.C. 65.58. (45-72)

U.I.B.C. 43.2. (24.2-70.1)

Transferrin Sat. 34.13. (20-50)

Ferritin. 14.1. (13-150)

HBA1C. 40.17. (20-42)

Cholesterol. 5.13. (0-5)

HDL. 1.97. >1.2

LDL. 2.81. <3

Kidney

Urea. 3.8. (2.5-7.8)

Creative. 71. (44-80)

Estimated GFR. 80.02. >60

These are my previous results on 50mcg levo

14th Dec 1st Medichecks results.

TSH 2.89 (0.27 - 4.2)

Free T4 15.7. (12 - 22)

Free T3. 4.6. (3.10 - 6.8)

Thyroglobulin. 579. (0 - 115)

TPO. 199. (0 - 34)

Active B12. 129. (37.5 - 188)

Folate. 12.58 (3.89 - 26.8)

Vit D. 75.1 (50 - 200)

Ferritin. 22.2. (13 - 150)

Once again thanks for any input, suggestions... x

[jamjar67]

greygoose just tagged you as you had advised me to get the full iron panel :-). I’m a bit confused as to why my body responded so well to 50mcg of levo and the extra 12.5mcg I’ve added has lowered my T4 & T3 and my Ferritin has lowered more? Do I just need to up my dose again and how much would you suggest?...

Many Thanks in advance...

[greygoose in reply to jamjar67]

It's a mistake to expect a linear recovery. Very little in nature goes in a straight line. Just because your TSH came down by x amount on y amount of levo, doesn't mean that you're going to get a similar reduction with a similar increase in levo. Levels fluctuate. And, considering your TSH, an increase of 12.5 mcg was hardly going to do much - when you've looked at as many sets of lab results as I have, you'll realise that. It would have been far better to go the whole hog and increase by 25 mcg. But, I know, doctors are so uneducated! And they seem to find it so very difficult to get their heads around all things thyroid. But the annoying thing is, experience doesn't seem to teach them anything or give them a hint that what they 'learnt' in med school was wrong!

But, I digress. 62.5 mcg levo is a négligeable dose, and wasn't likely to do much, anyway, just further reduce the natural production of your thyroid without being enough to replace it. We see this time and time again. But, whilst your levels haven't increased, the decrease is also negligeable. But will perhaps serve as a lesson to your doctor not to be so mean with his increases in dose! You are not going to 'go hyper', never in a million years. And a little bit of over-dosing - even though you're a long, long way off that! - never did anybody any harm for a mere six weeks to the next blood test. If you see what I mean. So much panic about nothing at all - on your doctor's part, of course, not yours.

I would advise an increase of 25 mcg. You can't increase by more than that. And you wouldn't need to restrict your increase to 12.5 until your FT4 gets up to about 19/21. And, you're a long way off that!

I'm afraid I can't help with the iron. I don't know the brand you're taking - you probably just aren't taking enough. But, iron does need to be taken two hours away from everything (except vit C) not just a cup of tea. Also, I can't imagine that a drop of lemon juice in a glass of water would give you enough vit C to help you absorb your iron pill. You need something like 1000 mg, which would be an awful lot of lemon juice! And, I don't think you can rely on vegetables to give you enough iron for your needs. If you're thinking of spinach, well, it's a myth that you can get iron from spinach. It may contain a lot but it also contains a substance that blocks absorption in human guts. So, just eating veggies will not have raised your ferritin one iota, I'm afraid.

[jamjar67 in reply to greygoose]

Firstly, thanks again for the brilliant, super well explained response…, you must shake your head at the naivety of us novices lol……. In hindsight I should have taken your initial advice of upping the full 25mcg, but I really couldn’t get my head around how 50mcg could reduce things so drastically so therefore taking ½ that amount again seemed a lot to me and I was worried about overmedication (with my history of anxiety and panic…, which I now know can also be exacerbated due to undermedication!!... no wonder my head is fuzzy lol !!)…. In fairness to my Doctor she went along with my thoughts…, she has been great with me over the years re times when my panic/anxiety was really bad, she has also had her whole thyroid removed so will be up to speed I would have thought…, at my last visit I talked to her about the Scottish Parliament debate and also about the lower ranges in other countries than the UK and also about an Endocrinologist who did a talk with the BTA who advised TSH needs to be 1 or lower, I also mentioned about T3 conversion…. I feel she is supporting my wishes in my journey whilst understanding my fear and anxiety (it makes us a tad controlling!!!!)…… I feel if I’d have asked for an increase of 25mcg she would have given it to me…., she also mentioned that she had another patient who sources her own NDT……(I guess I’m learning that their hands are tied)… but anyway I’m thinking that you have possibly read between the lines with all this lol….. As my daughter is studying medicine I am constantly sending her info and trying to educate her awareness so she can be a good Dr regarding Thyroid!!!

Soooo I will happily be asking for the full 25mcg increase next week (thanks to your reassurance)… but doing the 12.5mcg last time I have made the math a bit complicated but figure if I do 75mcg every day and and extra 25mcg every other day that should pan out….

My iron is Pure Encapsulations OptiFerin C which each tablet is vit C 100mg, Calcium 11mg (calcium ascorbate), Iron 28mg (bis glycinate), Threonic acid (Calcium ascorbate) – it says take 1 tablet 1-3 times a day with meals!!! I have no idea what all the bits means but it is the supplement recommended in the Isabella Wentz book so at the mo I have started on 1 tablet a day away from food…, I haven’t had OJ with it as my blood sugar level is high nearing pre diabetic so maybe the vit c in the tablet with my lemon water will be enough?!?!.....

Now the big one….I have been to the butchers and bought some beef and chicken which is a biggy for me as I have been pescatarian since I was 18…, so as my meat eating daughter has gone vegetarian…., her vegetarian Mother has started eating meat…., funny ol life lol.

Thank you again for taking the time to give such a comprehensive response, it means so much and very much appreciated X

[greygoose in reply to jamjar67]

but doing the 12.5mcg last time I have made the math a bit complicated but figure if I do 75mcg every day and and extra 25mcg every other day that should pan out….

I have no idea what you're talking about, there. What are you trying to calculate? There's nothing to calculate. You need a straight up increase of 25 mcg every day. It is not going to make you over-medicated. And, if, by some freak of nature, it does, so what? You can rectify the situation when you get retested in six weeks time. Why are you so terrified of going a bit over-range?

she has also had her whole thyroid removed so will be up to speed I would have thought…

Well, I would doubt it. Unless she's been doing her own research - which would surprise me because they think they learn everything they need to know in med school. And if she's just going by what she learnt in med school, she doesn't know much at all.

My iron is Pure Encapsulations OptiFerin C which each tablet is vit C 100mg, Calcium 11mg (calcium ascorbate), Iron 28mg (bis glycinate), Threonic acid (Calcium ascorbate)

You're kidding me! How can such a thing exist? One of the first things you learn in basic chemistry is that iron and calcium bind together, so you can't absorb either of them. And, I doubt that amount of iron would help, anyway. And 100 mg vit C, is a long way of the 1000 mg recommended - you don't get much vit C in one lemon - so this supplement is a pure scam.

[jamjar67 in reply to greygoose]

OMG I do confuse myself...., of course I happily blame everything on brain fog now and not my stupidity....!! Yes 75 one day and 100 the next...got it...., no wonder you were scratching your head.....!!

The supplement is annoying as it was bloomin expensive!, and many people on the site mention The Thyroid Pharmacist and her books - Hashimotos Root Cause... so very disappointed and amazed to learn that this supplement is no good....

I guess everyone wants to trust their Dr, they cant be experts in everything but I guess best hope is one that will listen and work and learn with you..... so I live in hope with that one.

[greygoose in reply to jamjar67]

Well, to be honest, as you said, that silly increase of 12.5 has complicated things. And your doctor should have known better than to agree to it. She should have know that an increase of 25 wasn't going to send you over-range. It's all very well giving patients what they want, but when you see they're going to make a big boo-boo, you should advise them against it. I really hope she does learn something from you, because I can't imagine how she manages her own hypothyroidism, knowing so little.

Yes, people do go on about Izabella Wentz. I think some people are taken in by her calling herself 'a thyroid pharmacist', and think that means she knows what she's talking about. I used to follow her on Facebook, but soon had my doubts about the depths of her knowledge. Why would someone who's deficient in iron what calcium, anyway? Calcium supplements are something we warn people against. I can imagine, you must be very annoyed.

[jamjar67 in reply to greygoose]

I guess I’m living and learning..., I was however quite pleased to read that a small glass of red wine helps absorb iron which has cheered me up

[greygoose in reply to jamjar67]

Does it? Not sure I've ever heard that… But, perhaps I have, but forgotten. But, I should imagine that's with a meal. Don't take your iron pills with a glass of wine. 1000 mg vit C is still the best for help absorbing iron.

[jamjar67 in reply to greygoose]

Lol..., I did mean with my meal 😂 👍

[LAHs in reply to greygoose]

Yep, it's the Resveratrol that comes out of the red grapes. That's why it's good to drink red wine with red meat... or just drink red wine.

[jamjar67 in reply to greygoose]

Just out of interest is there a particular book you would recommend to someone like me..., I was looking at the one by Paul Robinson ?

[greygoose in reply to jamjar67]

I haven't read any books by Paul Robinson. But, aren't they just about T3?

The first book I read, that gave me a clue what I was dealing with, was Mary Shomon's 'Living Well with Hypothyroidism'. The second was Dr Broda Barnes 'Hypothyroidism: The Unexpected Illness'. I though both were quite good. Easy to understand.

[jamjar67 in reply to greygoose]

The write up on Paul Robinson’s book...

The Thyroid Patient's Manual is a practical, easy-to-read book, which provides an excellent resource for people who are trying to understand hypothyroidism.

It is aimed at patients who suspect they have low thyroid hormone levels, those who have just been diagnosed and are beginning treatment and those who are on thyroid treatment already, but are still feeling ill.

The Thyroid Patient's Manual gives you the tools needed to gain some control of your health, and be able to work productively with your doctor, so that you can recover your health as quickly as possible.

Thought it sounded good but I’d rather spend money on something recommended by someone with experience and understanding....

I’ll look at the two you’ve recommended...

Thanks....again!!

[greygoose in reply to jamjar67]

You're welcome.

[Nefatiti40]

Hi there

I took thyroxine for 20 years and have Hashimoto's disease (auto-immune thyroditis).

I am now taking natural thyroid from Thailand and feel better on it and my TSH level is much lower than it was. I found in later years that I needed to take adrenal supplements as well as thyroxine but I don't need them any more on the NDT. I also take Biocare Iron, B Vitamins and selenium and Vit C daily plus other vitamins.

Sorry I can't be more help

[jamjar67 in reply to Nefatiti40]

Thank you for replying...., I am really grateful for all input!!! There is so much to come to terms with...., atleast if I do need NDT I know who to message !!!!!.... At the moment I am taking the following

AM - Probiotic, Reservatrol, Selenium, B Vits (although I have just started taking something called Hydro-Zyme by Biotics to increase my stomach acid to help digest and absorb more food) this product I notice has B6 in so now I'm worried that taking the B complex and the Hydro-Zyme may overdose me in B6 so I was thinking of getting some B12 and having a rest from the B Complex whilst I do this course of Hydro-Zyme....

Mid morning - my Iron tablet

Lunch - Vit D, Magnesium, Omega 3

Dinner time - Goat Kefir, Hydrozyme

I take my Thyroxine between 4am and 6am depends when I wake up....

I did take 2 courses of Innate Adrenal Response - but I'm going to do a cortisol test to see if I need it.....

Did your Thyroxine work for so many years and then become less effective hence switching to NDT, or was it because you just put up with things before learning about the different options?

Thanks again for your input x