Apologies for a very long post but my research has uncovered the important role of magnesium and the impact its deficiency has on endo. It's another piece of the jigsaw.
You won't find the drug companies or doctors in their pay recommending supplementation with cheap magnesium. It's deficiency is widespread mainly due to the fact that soil is now not as nutrient rich as it was. I believe that many factors contribute to the development of endo and magnesium deficiency is one that can have an impact. I found a book online called The Magnesium Miracle amazon.co.uk/The-Magnesium-... It was referenced in this article livingthenourishedlife.com/...
Since my last period I have been spraying magnesium oil on my body after a shower and I think it might have helped reduce cramping during my last period last weekend. I have also started taking long baths with magnesium chloride flakes added. I have not started supplementation yet but see that magnesium citrate (easiest form to absorb) 200g daily is recommended.
I haven't bought the book yet (too many other drains on my money!) but the book preview on amazon provides some useful information. I have copied a few points below in inverted commas and added my own comments.
"1. Detoxification. Magnesium is crucial for the removal of toxic substances and heavy metals such as mercury, aluminium, and lead from the body. Magnesium is a cofactor in the production of glutathione and the function of the P450 detoxification systems in the liver."
- The liver also eliminates excess oestrogen. If it cannot properly detoxify then endo will proliferate in the high oestrogen environment. I have been looking into glutathione and another one of its cofactors, N Acetyl Cysteine (NAC). Supplementing with NAC may also be beneficial.
"2. Fatigue. Magnesium-deficient patients commonly experience fatigue because dozens of enzyme systems are underfunctioning. The most important factor in energy production is ATP, adenosine triphosphate, which must be bound to a magnesium ion in order to be biologically active."
- Anyone with endo knows how tired we all are!
"3. Magnesium is intimately involved in muscle function. The mechanisms are varied and include oxygen uptake, electrolyte balance, and energy production. Magnesium makes muscles work properly, allowing calcium to cause muscle contraction and then pushing calcium out of the muscle cells to allow the relaxation phase. In the same way that nerve cells can be “excited to death,” muscle cells stimulated by too much calcium can go into uncontrollable spasm, resulting in tissue damage such as occurs in a heart attack."
- Low magnesium probably contributes to menstrual cramping.
"4. Inflammation. calcium is extremely proinflammatory and magnesium is very anti-inflammatory. the entire inflammatory cascade (substance P, interleukins, tumor necrosis factor, chemokines, and cytokines) escalate when magnesium is deficient.The bottom line is that inflammation is triggered by magnesium deficiency and the relative calcium excess."
- And don't we all know that inflammation is a big issue with endo causing us a great deal of PAIN.
"5. A powerful trigger of inflammation is uncontrolled yeast overgrowth. Yeast produces 178 different chemical antigens in its normal life cycle. These chemicals can be absorbed into the bloodstream and set up a never-ending inflammatory cascade. Acetaldehyde is one of the powerful toxic by-products of yeast, and magnesium is required to break it down. If there isn’t enough magnesium, unopposed acetaldehyde can cause many side effects."
- So with all our endo inflammation we are also susceptible to yeast overgrowth/candidiasis. I know many women on the forum have candidiasis.
IBS is also mentioned in the book as a result of low magnesium and many other conditions such as fibromyalgia, chronic fatigue syndrome etc. have magnesium deficiency at the root. I know many of you have concurrent conditions which we are all convinced are connected to endo in some way. Most probably, the same context gives rise to the development of several conditions and magnesium deficiency could be one of the factors involved.
I also just read that magnesium is a key element in the process of producing PROGESTERONE! Also, the pill depletes our levels of magnesium.
Magnesium won't 'cure' but I believe it could be beneficial for endo, adeno, fibroids etc. If you do decide to take, consult a doctor or someone suitably qualified. Too much magnesium might cause you tummy upsets or...clear out your bowels!!! High doses are used as pre op bowel prep so do take care!
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Brownlow
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Oh I'm so glad that something has helped a bit. I do feel it made a difference for me too. I add drops of essential oils too. Cramping was definitely not as bad last period. Thanks for the chocolate tip...the best tip of all...and did you know that cravings for chocolate indicate a deficiency in....MAGNESIUM!!!
I also rubbed magnesium oil onto my sore hips and it really helped. If you do rub on your uterus area rub in a clockwise direction when you look down on your tummy. This follows the direction of the bowel.
I wonder if my husband would mind if I ate the entire choc easter egg sitting on the table that we bought to share on Easter Sunday. After all, you quite rightly point out it's purely medicinal. I mean, I don't even like chocolate!!...I LOVE IT!!
I'm sitting here on my own crying laughing! The best tonic ever! To go with my easter gin of course...oestrogen I mean.
Life as a guinea pig is so hard but someone has to do it. I think you should use your dog Ozzy as the control i.e. mouse/dog/human without endo. Better blindfold yourselves too to make it double-blind!! Hee hee hee! xx
I know that you are joking out of fun and games, but for those of you who have major sweet tooths, that is a pretty reliable sign that you have yeast overgrowth in your body. The yeast love the sugar, and therefore you love it as well.
Sadly, once the yeast is rooted in your body, it is extremely difficult to rid of. I would be willing to guess that the yeast amplifies the pain and symptoms of endo.
Has anyone experimented with colon cleansing in their natural regimens for dealing with endo? I have a friend that I researching about it for. It seems that it can contribute to bowel issues, but I suspect that bowel issues being present also make the symptoms worse.
Nobody ever thinks to get me an Easter egg probably because I am considered to have outgrown them which is totally unfair! ; ) Now there is no excuse this year because a chocolate egg is now a necessity for it's magnesium benefits! Brownlow has suggested that I might also benefit from more magnesium and so I intend to drop as many hints as I can. Either that or I am going to buy the biggest Cadbury's Easter egg that I can myself! I hope you are still getting on ok with your GNRH treatment. I am keeping my fingers crossed that it is the answer for you. Cathy x
All going well with the GNRH. Still have a minor headache but
two paracetamols gets rid of that.
It is really important that we help Brownlow with her research. So you MUST go to your nearest shop and get a large egg (small ones are not acceptable) and report back.
It's important that we research thoroughly and report our findings. Brownlow can not shoulder the burden of research on her own!
I am so glad that it is so far so good for you! That calls for a celebratory glass of wine later I think!
I will definitely do as I am bid regarding this very important research. We must work together on this one that is for sure. As you say, it is too much for Brownlow to cope with on her own. The future of all Endo ladies hangs in the balance otherwise, if we don't assist!
The trouble though will be that after extensive research I may be rendered unable to rise from my bed to report back for a little while due to a tummy even more swollen than usual because of the said research. It will be a case of a weeble wobbling I think....
I have been better. Can't remember when but I know I have at one time. ; ) Thanks for asking. I won't bore you with the details on this thread but if you take a look on today's newsfeed you will see I have been having a convo with / moan to Brownlow that will explain...
Oh dear! I'm getting worried now! Chocolate really isn't the best way to get magnesium ladies. Too much sugar. Just thought I'd better say that in case someone gets the wrong end of the stick! Sorry to spoil the party!
I have visions of shops across the country selling out of chocolate because all us Endo ladies think it is our salvation. Then it turns up on the news that there's a worldwide chocolate crisis all because of Brownlow and her magnesium fixation!!
I tried the salts to, and it think they def helped post op , thanks for the tip x
Hi Girls, and Brownlow - this is so very interesting. Thanks for this.
This makes for very interesting reading, I had researched magnesium before but never linked it with endo!
I find this particularly interesting because I once suffered from tremendous one sided facial pain that was diagnosed at neuralgia. I could not talk or walk and it was not age related because I was young - I was on massive amounts of amitriptyline (50mg in the end), tried beta blockers, anti-convulsants (Carbamazepine) but nothing worked.
Following research at the time, I realised I may be low on magnesium so I purchased liquid magnesium (I thought the liquid would be more 'bio-available' to me than tablet form) - and eventually I recovered. I still, rarely, get the odd stinging in my face and shooting pain that starts through the ear radiating to face. But, it's just odd that my only two illnesses in life have been facial pain and endo - and it makes me wonder about my ability to digest magnesium.
Because us endo ladies have alot of digestive issues, I think we need to find ways to get magnesium into our bodies in a such a way where it will be readily absorbed.
As much as I love the idea of chocolate (I bought 8 Easter Eggs on Saturday for nieces and nephews and we are already down two eggs, so I need to deliver the eggs to family pretty quickly before we are left with 0!)..
coincidentally I have been experimenting with magnesium rich nut milks and I have finally cracked it.
I bought a very very good blender.. not sure I am allowed to say the make here, but I am IN LOVE with it and its incredible. I have been making almond and walnut milks with still mineral water (avoiding tap water due to hormones) - and the milk really is lovely.
WALNUTS are so so healthy and an excellent source of magnesium - and blending them into a milk - it makes it easily digestible for us endo ladies with digestive issues. I also wanted a milk substitute as we endo ladies know milk is packed full of oestrogen and I hate the shop bought ones.
So, today I make the walnut milk with a few added almonds, then blended in a small banana, a few blueberries, and some raw cacao powder (not cocoa powder). It was delicious. A very good source of magnesium with the added benefit of raw pure chocolate. It wasn't that sweet, so you could add a tiny amount more fruit or a little date or honey to it)...
Anyay, thought I'd share my exciting nut milk discovery. I really intend to stick to dairy free now.
I just found out I need another surgery (no 3.), so not very happy. I really need to take this endo crap into my own hands, I'm sick of it.
By the way, after only 3 days of having the nut milks (as well as some fruit juices with greens) I have good energy today - and that's following a horrendous experience of utterly shocking food poisoning on Friday morning that I can only describe as cruel. Then I hurt my back. Now, usually, I would take a week to recover from these, but I honestly can say I feel so so much better today, which is a speedy recovery for me.
Oh, that blender is named the nutribullet - I got it from amazon for £95 - there is a fault with one of the blending lids so I will have to get that replaced but the other milling blender seems to work for every thing else anyway, especially for the nuts. It's better than my £300 juicer. I think ENDO is going to BANKRUPT my fiancé. But seriously that is the best blender ever, so easy to use and to wash. I wanted to share it here because its really very very good. We made a nut milk, half avocado, blueberry and spinach smoothie yesterday - was enough for lunch.
Happy Easter ladies, thanks for entertaining me today with your chocolate stories. I love it. And sorry this post is way tooooo long. xx
in reply to
Hello YellowRose .
Oh no..... More surgery? Is our German doctor operating on you?
in reply to
Hi Barbara - yes, more darned surgery - I am not a happy bunny about it. I tried to talk him out of it but based on the cysts I have on left side - and all the pain over the last 2 months, he thinks I need surgery. Mainly, he will cut out the cysts but did say he would laser any endo off - which is annoying because I really didn't want laser surgery. I questioned him on laser approach and he said there is still alot of debate and controversy about both excision and laser! So he didn't really answer my question.
I have not given the go ahead for surgery yet, but they have provisionally booked me in. I don't know what to do. My gut feel is so just get this cyst out asap, as it's growing and looks either multi septated or it could 3 x endometrioma - he can't really tell - but he seems keen to operate asap.
How are you feeling, and how are the response to the injections? Oh, he said he would give me 3 months of a down reg drug if I were to do IVF 3 months post surgery. Apparently it helps but I need to research more - I am worried it will switch off my tired ovaries altogether and worried they will fall asleep forever
in reply to
Hi YellowRose.
I was told they do not do excision surgery and that they prefer laser! I've had laser surgery before and the Endo has grown back immediately.
Was the German doctor polite? When does he propose to do the surgery?
In your position I think I would opt for the surgery to get out the cyst (s) and to check it out.
So he is proposing a GNRH drug prior to IVF?
in reply to
Haha you make me laugh. I will have to email you the funny situation I had with the doctor. It was all very amusing and all my fault. But he was nothing other than charming.
And yep, you are spot on, it's a type of GNRH treatment before IVF. All women who have IVF have about 4 weeks of it, but there have been studies showing that women with advanced endo have better results with 2 or 3 months of pituitary down reg.
I dread the whole thing. I might opt for the surgery but may tell him to leave the laser in the cupboard.
in reply to
I just hope they sort your pain out.
When we had IVF, I had to use the nasal spray to
switch off my ovaries then inject myself with daily injections to over stimulate my ovaries.
in reply to
Yep, it's still in the form of a nasal spray for most IVF treatment to switch of the pituitary gland - I need to find out whether it will be 3 months of this or via injection.
I also want an MRI scan before this surgery, which was discussed but it fell by the wayside.
So much to think about.
in reply to
An MRI scan is an excellent idea prior to surgery.
How long will you have to wait for the surgery?
in reply to
They booked me in for May 7.. I was shocked. And I have not even agreed to it yet. But I am paying hefty private insurance which I hope will cover it.
Thanks for all the info on nut milks. I had completely forgotten that nuts and seeds are good for magnesium. My brain is too full of endo! I tend to buy unsweetened almond milk because I'm too lazy. I made almond milk once and it was really easy to do in a blender but I'm really pleased to hear of a good review of the nutribullet. I have a juicer too but I was looking for something that didn't waste so much of the fruit and veg. There is a bit of a debate about juicing but I think the availability of soluble fibre and nutrients is much better if you are not in full health. We need all the help we can get!
Nuts can pile on the calories but I'm not bothered if the other benefits are worth it. Personally, I need to make sure my weight doesn't go down!
You mention digestion which is crucial. If it's not working properly it doesn't matter how well we eat, we simply won't absorb all the good nutrients we need. Juice or nut milks I believe make it easier for our digestion to absorb. Also, I'm more in favour of trying to get the nutrients we need without resorting to supplementation so thanks for this idea!
I'm going to bankrupt my husband too! I feel like I've turned into a moneypit! x
Thanks for this ladies - just catching up! Funnily enough I have also recently discovered magnesium and have started using the oil and bath soaks. Very interesting to read your findings Brownlow. Thanks.
I do think that you are on the right track re magnesium / estrogen dominance which may have a big role to play in exacerbating endo (which is thought to mainly be laid down during gestation and triggered at puberty - but can have other rare causes) and all the conditions mentioned above and in the books I have read regarding estrogen dominance (such as PMS, menstrual migraines, miscarriage (due to low progesterone needed to sustain pregnancy), fibromyalgia, osteoporosis, cervical dysplasia, endo, pituitary adenoma, female cancers etc). Apparently we have estrogen receptors throughout the body and it depends upon where the receptors are dominant/active as to how estrogen dominance would/would not affect you. Hence it can have multiple effects, as with ladies who have more than one condition, and affects each person differently.
Obviously we need highly skilled and knowledgeable surgeons to excise the endo that we already have but I think the wholesome way to help manage this chronic condition (and others), and to look after health once endo is removed (and to help prevent other conditions developing) is by way of this kind of supplementation, bio-identical progesterone, endo diet as this helps liver function and elimination of excess estrogens and also cutting out the xenoestrogens and nasty chemicals in toiletries/cosmetics/household cleaning stuff/laundry powder and switching to glass for heating food and china for hot drinks - moving away from plastics. The latter i think is very important as, although ingestion of phytoestrogens from food is a consideration, phytoestrogens do pass through the liver and are so not as potent as xenoestrogens which are absorbed through the skin and which completely bypass the liver. Good liver function is obviously vital.
I find it very annoying that most doctors do not take this wholesome approach. They just treat symptoms and tend to view symptoms individually rather than making any connections. Someone said to me that this is because standard medical training is based upon symptoms and what the pharmaceutical companies can produce relating to those symptoms. Surgery is also based on treating symptoms. There is not a preventative approach but waiting for something to happen and treating it.
Dr Andrew S Cook is an eminent endo surgeon in the US and it is refreshing that he takes a wholistic approach alongside advocating removal of all endo, he also goes much further than that with his patients in taking a wider approach to healing. This has to be the way medicine needs to go.
I agree with you 100%. Your post looks like something I would write.
I actually think it's negligent and ignorant of doctors not to alert patients to oestrogen dominance and point them in the direction of steps they can take to alleviate it. Surgery and drugs have their place in endo treatment but they are only an element and not the mainstay of treatment. This is the error I think many of us and the doctors are making and I believe that success rates in treatment would be higher if other measures were adopted. Alas, doctors rely too heavily on the framework they have inherited and the propaganda of the drug companies to even begin to correct this. It's lazy and sloppy in my opinion and we deserve far better. Fortunately, with the internet, a huge amount of valuable information is available so there is at least something we can do for ourselves.
I'm off to have my magnesium chloride bath now! I buy it in bulk from Peacock Salt in a 25kg bag peacocksalt.com/products-in... and decant it into double ziploc bags. It's far cheaper than buying on the high street.
I'm going to order N Acetylcysteine today which works with magnesium to produce glutathione.
Ha ha! Yes I wondered that too. I got in touch with them to ask if it was ok for baths and they said it was. When it arrived it was in a large plastic bag and it was mag chloride from the dead sea exactly the same as the stuff you can buy on the high street. I'd say it's safer than any of the drugs handed out like smarties by the doctors!
I might have to give it a go then. How much do you put in your bath at a time? Been at work this morning and they were fantastic about me cancelling the latest op. The head is a lovely man- so I'm feeling a bit less stressed now. I'm very lucky to have such understanding at work. Can you give me a bit more info on the magnesium? X
About the magnesium. I'd always known about Epsom Salt baths which is magnesium sulphate. Magnesium Chloride is supposedly better absorbed than magnesium sulphate. But there are others who don't buy into this idea at all citing lack of scientific evidence. Personally I don't require evidence and often the 'old wives remedy' is sufficient or even sometimes superior for me. Many drugs are formulated on folk remedies. Also, many people use dead sea mud for skin conditions which is where we get the magnesium chloride.
Here's a good guide to get the best out of it m.wikihow.com/Take-a-Detox-... just exchange the epsom salts for magnesium chloride flakes. The 2 cups they recommend is about 400g I think. I use about 250g and I don't use the sodium bicarbonate. Maybe I should! Peacock Salts also sell that. The flakes absorb moisture so that's why I decanted mine into the double ziploc bags.
I started off with the high street bought flakes to see if I liked it before buying in bulk. I use the baths as a way to force me to switch off and relax so if anything they are useful for that! And if it is all rubbish at least all the neighbours will love me next winter for deicing the road!
I also dry skin brush every day and after a shower or bath I apply magnesium spray and coconut oil. But I won't be doing that to icy roads.
I highly recommend the period repair manual by Lara Briden. She talks about endo along with lots of other period problems. She is a big fan of magnesium supplementation but talks about lots and lots of other useful tips.
This is quite an old post so I hope if anyone sees, they'll find it helpful:
I take magnesium supplements when I am on my period experiencing bad cramping. I take the powdered kind that can be mixed with water; I use the brand Calm and it helps a lot!
I mean, I still take pain killers of course but my pain is never completely gone so this is a big help. Magnesium is supposed to be a natural muscle relaxer so drinking it immediately makes my uterine contractions feel better (for a short period of time but still!) Maybe this is linked to the research above.
For the record, I have not been diagnosed with endo however I have a whole slew of symptoms and feel as though I have it. So YES, magnesium good!
Nahh it not just magnesium. Its a 1:1 ratio of calcium and magnesium. They work together. I was at the end of my wire.. about to have a hysterectomy. However I found after having hair mineral test I was low in calcium and magnesium.
Calcium plays a massive role in regulating hormones for women. Magnesium works with cramping. Together they work well. Calcium does not cause inflammation in endo in my personal opinion. In fact teachers at some schools were know to hand out calcium supplements to young girls having period and then when they went home they were pain free. Parents asked oh what did you give the girls they said calcium supplements. Also you can read this article done my doctor be nice if they told the world...
I am day 17 in supplementation and my pain has reduced by 70%..and still dropping... so if I get my periods back to one pain day per month like when I was younger i will be doing lots of videos on the topic to tell as many women as possible. if you want to ask me any questions you can katie@antiagingscience.today ( i will probably forget to do an update) anyway here is an article you can read which further validates using them both together.... oh I am dairy intolerant which caused the mineral deficiencies.... (also dairy is known to interfere with your hormones as well). you can google it....
Recent studies have shown that calcium has a positive role to play in treating pre-menstrual syndrome especially for treating menstrual cramps. It has been known by women for some time that menstrual cramps can sometimes be treated effectively and reduced by increased intake of calcium and magnesium. Calcium is also being seen as a potentially effective treatment for PMDD (Premenstrual Dysphoric Disorder).
It seems that magnesium in conjunction with calcium is much more effective for pms and PMDD than is calcium by itself. “In the largest study, women took 1200mg per day and had almost a 50% reduction in their symptoms.”
There have been studies that seem to indicate that a deficiency in calcium might even be causative for pms and PMDD. A lack of calcium might be responsible for hypertension and some forms of cancer as well as pms symptoms.
Most adults do not ingest enough calcium through the food we eat and this is particularly true of women. Calcium to prevent osteoporosis has been recommended to women of menopausal years for some time. Adults should get up to 1000 mg every day but most only get 600 mg or so.
There is a study done by J. Tian, P. Bernstein, P. Starkey and S. Thys-Jacobs from St. Luke’s-Roosevelt Hospital Center, College of Physicians and Surgeons, Columbia University in New York that showed a major reduction in the pms symptoms with an increase in calcium. This is particularly true of the symptoms that occur in the third phase of the menstrual cycle – the luteal phase. In this phase the women’s body is flooded with progesterone and this counter balances the increase in estrogen that occurs in the second or follicular phase.
“Seven hundred twenty women were screened for this trial; 497 women were enrolled; 466 were valid for the efficacy analysis. There was no difference in age, weight, height, use of oral contraceptives, or menstrual cycle length between treatment groups. There were no differences between groups in the mean screening symptom complex score of the luteal (P = .659), menstrual (P = .818), or intermenstrual phase (P = .726) of the menstrual cycle.
During the luteal phase of the treatment cycle, a significantly lower mean symptom complex score was observed in the calcium-treated group for both the second (P = .007) and third (P < .001) treatment cycles. By the third treatment cycle calcium effectively resulted in an overall 48% reduction in total symptom scores from baseline compared with a 30% reduction in placebo. All 4 symptom factors were significantly reduced by the third treatment cycle.
CONCLUSIONS: Calcium supplementation is a simple and effective treatment in premenstrual syndrome, resulting in a major reduction in overall luteal phase symptoms.” algaecal.com/pms-treatment
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I shall definitely have a read about it x
x
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