Advice wanted on supplements to take to try an... - Bone Health

Bone Health

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Advice wanted on supplements to take to try and manage osteoporosis the natural way

Somerset99
Somerset99

I have osteoporosis and don't want to take medication and want to go the natural route to stop bone loss/ possibly increase it slightly.

I am trying to sort out what supplements to take, and am getting confused. A definite bit of advice coming through it to take organic calcium, eg Algecal. This seems to be pretty expensive. So, first question is:

Are there any less expensive, but effective, organic calcium supplement ?

Other supplements. I also read a lot of other minerals and vitamins recommended:

Magnesium, Zinc, Boron, Copper, Manganese, Silicon, Vit D, Vit K2, B vitamins, Vit C, Omega 3 fish oils, Co Q10, (Uniquinol).

I already take a multivamin which gives some coverage but still looks a lot of other tabs to be taken. Second question:

Are there any multi tabs which cover a lot of the above mineral and vitamins ?

Many thanks for reading this

33 Replies
oldestnewest

Not going to advise specifically on supplements, don't feel qualified to do so. But you may find my account of interest: healthunlocked.com/pmrgcauk...

I will say that Vitamin K2 is very important.

Somerset99
Somerset99 in reply to HeronNS

Thank you for your reply and advice. I've been researching on this site and other, hopefully reliable, sites. So much information around so it is great to get feedback from members of with experience, and no commercial loyalties

I have gone for Pure Nutrition Ultra Calcium Citrate for the moment. I need to top this up with vits A and C , I think.

Have also upped the exercise- aiming for 10,000 with my new smartwatch. My main exercise is normally cycling but I realise that altho i may cycle 50 plus miles a week, this is not useful exercise for bone building.

I have also joined the Save Trainer online exercise programme. For 14 dollars a month you get access to a wide variety of exercise videos which I find are very good. There is a lot of information on the site for people like me who are new to trying to combat this condition without drugs. Various 'programs' on subscription, but I'm not sure how much benefit or additional information they would provide.

Thanks again for responding

HeronNS
HeronNS in reply to Somerset99

All the best. Looking good!

Improving your balance, agility and thigh muscle strength will help protect you from falling and breaking a hip. Doing Sinaki's study proven 'back extension' exercise once or twice a week will strengthen, help protect your spine/vertebrae. Learning to fall harmlessly (not straight onto your side/hip) by sort of crouching and rolling as you fall might also protect your hip. Starting this month, individuals can now order an airbag belt (inflates when the software detects you're falling, another way to protect your hips, @$1,000+).

Supplements: well, I take BioSil (2 capsules/day), very pricey, to boost my silicon intake (elderly residents of China have an unusually low incidence of hip breakage -- their dietary silicon intake's double that of westerners and that's thought largely the cause. I take some of the other usual supplements just as a matter of form and have little confidence in their usefulness.

See my profile for my topic about (kitchen spice) thyme, a proven (just to me, so far) way to boost bone mineral density.

Beware ingesting too much calcium, there's a sweet spot: 600-900 mg/day, go higher or lower and you risk calcium actually causing osteoporosis (there's a video on my profile, skip ahead to the 30 minute point for the graph).

ratoncita
ratoncita in reply to wbiC

You can also get silica from Spring Horsetail. There’s really good supplement called Florasil and it’s cheaper than BioSil.

wbiC
wbiC in reply to ratoncita

Interesting, very different from BioSil which promotes itself as having a chemical composition with targeted impact, vs merely adding silicon in the form of water soluble silica.

How much silicon equivalent is in their 'capsules'? I'm not finding any information on that aspect. BioSil capsules contain 6 mg Si.

I'm confident BioSil does something for me, at least for my finger/toe nails.

Florasil's may not even be cheaper other than at first glance, $23/90 capsules vs BioSil's $55/120 capsules, BUT, (a) we'd need to know how much Silicon is in Florasil, and, (b) if plain soluble silica has a similar impact to BioSil's chemical containing silicon. Not finding any 'studies' for Florasil, BioSil appears better supported: biosilusa.com/science/

~wbiC, member bonehealth

editted to add: found ca.iherb.com/pr/flora-flora... 9 mg silicon per capsule. Perhaps I'll give it a try -- my finger/toe nails will tell me in a month or two, if it's not working as well as BioSil. I'd use a comparable dose, 2 x 6 mg Si BioSil (84 mg/week), vs 9 x 9 mg Si per week of Florasil (81 mg/week).

My favourite vitamin supply shop downtown has Forasil for $34/180 capsules (modest sale on just now) as a senior I get 5% off and they've $2 coupons widely published for any store stock almost always, so $30.50 for 20 weeks' worth. I'll definitely give it a try for a few months.

(sigh! I stocked up on BioSil (a year's worth), so will need to use that up before completely switching to Florasil, if that starts working out comparably.)

ratoncita
ratoncita in reply to wbiC

How often do you get a dexascan?

wbiC
wbiC in reply to ratoncita

Jan 2018, Mar 2020 (results posted on my Profile's thyme topic), upcoming April 2021

~wbiC, member bonehealth forum

It's recommended to get calcium from diet if at all possible, but if you do need to supplement, organic calcium like Algaecal is still calcium carbonate. Calcium citrate is more readily absorbed. I get calcium and most of my magnesium from diet, together with a high protein intake. I take the following supplements: Vitamin D3 (I take 4000iu because I need that much to keep my blood level over 100nmol/litre, but many people need far less than this so you can only find out your own needs through blood tests); K2-MK7 180mcg; boron 6mg; zinc 15mg; Vit C 500-1000mg; magnesium 200mg about 3-4 times a week when my stomach will tolerate it. I do take omega 3 fish oils, 1000mg twice a week, but not specifically for bone health. I did drink bottled water that was high in silica, but have now stopped this (too much plastic waste!) and have read that it's perfectly possible to get sufficient silica in your diet. I eat cucumber fairly regularly, which is supposed to be a good source. I've never taken a multi-vitamin because I've yet to find one that has the right balance of the above to suit my personal needs!

M3745
M3745 in reply to Met00

After reading your post, it brought to mind a question I have been wrestling with for myself. I’m a smaller person, 5ft, 1/2in , 109 lbs. The dosages for most things, are for the average person. I hesitate to use the analogy, but for my dogs, everything is prescribed according to their weight. Wouldn’t this hold true for humans also. My dermatologist prescribes a medication for me at half the dose that she said she prescribes for most of her patients because of my size. She said the majority of her women patients weigh approximately 150lbs so she takes that into consideration. Supplements are never listed according to weight. I find myself using less of these things because I don’t want to overdo anything. Thoughts?

Met00
Met00 in reply to M3745

Many adult medications are suitable for children over 16, so I don't think weight is usually an issue, but I have to admit, like you, it is something I wonder about at times. I took risedronate for a while and, bearing in mind that the same dose is given to men who weigh considerably more than me, I was concerned that the dose might be too high for me. At 126lbs I weigh more than you, but below average.

M3745
M3745 in reply to Met00

I think what triggered my response was you mentioned boron 6 mg a day I have been afraid to take 6 mg I take 3 mg because of my size. I don’t want to overload myself, I don’t know that is something I should be concerned about or not. I’m just using the boron has an example

Met00
Met00 in reply to M3745

The safe upper limit for boron is 20mg, so I don't think taking 6mg would be a problem. However, 3mg is the recommended dose, I just take double to be certain of getting enough, having ascertained that it's perfectly safe at that level.

karmel
karmel in reply to M3745

I have never heard of dosages specifically for smaller people. I am 98 lbs and have never been prescribed a smaller dose of medication by any medical practitioner and it would make sense for medication to go by body weight, but I think it is a one size fits all attitude. Are you being treated in either in the US/Canada as you mentioned your weight n lbs rather than stones and lbs or being treated in the UK under the NHS?

M3745
M3745 in reply to karmel

I’m in the United States. Medications aren’t prescribed by weight but some should be. The medication I mentioned was for cystic acne and she said she usually prescribes 100mg but in my case gave 50mg because of my size. It has been working quite well for me. That is the only time a doctor prescribed by my weight

karmel
karmel in reply to M3745

Very impressed by your forward thinking doctor.

ratoncita
ratoncita in reply to Met00

I use Calcium Bisglysonate

Met00
Met00 in reply to ratoncita

I've not heard of that form of calcium but do take magnesium bisglycinate. I get my calcium from diet.

ratoncita
ratoncita in reply to Met00

I apologize, the mag is bisglycinate, the calcium is bone meal MCHA

I don’t take multivitamins - I don’t think they provide the right amounts of anything really and you don’t necessarily need everything in them nor do you want to take the combination of vitamins and minerals provided at the same time.

I take pretty much the same as met00 only I take magnesium every day, I really didn’t get on well with any kind of calcium carbonate that I was prescribed but I’ve settled on calcium citrate, i worked out how much calcium I get from my diet so I only take 300mcg to top up my dietary intake. When my present calcium citrate is finished I’m going to try Biocare Calcium Citrate Vegetable capsules but I’m ok with regular calcium citrate at the moment.

I looked into taking algaecal when I was first diagnosed but from what I’ve read algaecal is very expensive and I’m not sure it is worth it - it comes from the US and I think you probably pay a surcharge

I take omega 3 algae oil originally for my bones but I’ve discovered it really helps my very dry eyes, also take vitamin D3 - I vary it from 1000 - 3000 mcg depending on my vitamin D levels (I do regular blood tests). I take K2- Mk7 Natto, high strength vitamin C with zinc and I take boron. I eat a lot of green leafy vegetables, nuts and seeds and other calcium and vitamin D containing foods.

I do pilates aimed at balance and strengthening my bones, I do squats to strengthen my thighs, plus weight bearing exercise, I try to walk briskly every day and I’ve got a couple of Margaret Martins exercise DVDs that I use if I can’t get out.

I’ve also got a weighted vest that I tend to use when I’m doing housework, I do a lot of heel drops through the day - such as when I’m waiting for a kettle to boil or waiting for my husband - that sort of thing and I often stomp on the floor - my Pilates teacher tells us to imagine we’re treading grapes in a vat.

wbiC
wbiC in reply to Fruitandnutcase

Did you ever think that maybe soft carpets and cushy walking shoes, have been very harmful to our bones?

With bare feet and hardwood floors or old style leather soles in shoes when walking, just seems we'd be getting thousands of useful impacts almost on a par with full heel drops.

Fruitandnutcase
Fruitandnutcase in reply to wbiC

I’m sure you’ve got a point there. I know I prefer my daily walk to be on a hard surface because of that - I’m sure I’ve been told it doesn’t make any difference.On the other hand I’m sure if I had landed on a nice soft carpet instead of a laminate floor I might not have broken my wrist, so we’ve now got a nice soft bedroom carpet. Life just isn’t easy at times is it?

wbiC
wbiC in reply to Fruitandnutcase

Actually, soft flooring doesn't help prevent breaks (according to a study, amongst a 1,000+ overall that I've seen). It was one done in a seniors' home and body tissue plus industrial rubber padding made no difference vs body tissue alone as a cushion.

Which, is why I like the concept of an air bag belt (only just this month available to purchase via individuals, albeit @ $1,000+, but still I'm considering it). [works like car air bags, sensor triggers it as we're falling]

AnnieW55
AnnieW55 in reply to wbiC

Good thought. Added to that the fact that many people are not that active, using transport in stead of walking.

I do have a barefoot/slipper sock habit which combined with our uncarpeted hard wood floors may be doing me some good! Thanks for giving me that thought.

HeronNS
HeronNS in reply to AnnieW55

And if you have stairs - walking upstairs is good for our cardiovascular system, walking downstairs is good for our skeleton!

AnnieW55
AnnieW55 in reply to HeronNS

Unfortunately, in this instance, I live in a bungalow - single storey home. When at work I did take the stairs, 4 flights up and down, several times a day. I’m retired as of the recent surgery so will need to find replacement exercises (on top of those I normally do!)

HeronNS
HeronNS in reply to AnnieW55

I moved to a condo a couple of years ago and made a point of walking up and down stairs a few times a day. With lockdown this spring that became once a day. Then I hurt my knee, which has never been the same since, and can't even manage proper walks on level ground. If you are able to do something akin to step climbing, especially once covid isn't a big issue any more, please do so. I blame my knee injury on loss of muscle tone from not doing the stairs any more because at that point I was still getting out for a walk, albeit one longish walk rather than a couple of shorter ones.

AnnieW55
AnnieW55 in reply to HeronNS

I live in a hilly area so upper, downy walks are a factor in my walks. At the moment short walks are the order of the day and I am using my Nordic Walking poles every time as my balance is affected and I tend to veer to the left if not concentrating 😀

HeronNS
HeronNS in reply to AnnieW55

Nordic poles are the best! Right now I'm using a different kind of walking pole which enables me to take some of the weight off my legs by pressing down with my hands - totally not what you do with Nordic walking! I had tried a brace but it did nothing for me, it was always a relief to get it off.

I like to take my supplements separately as I can change what I take as my diet changes through the seasons. Generally I take the usual suspects of K2 (M7), D3, Boron, Magnesium bisglycinate and Vit C. At the moment the Vit C is liposomal as recovering from major surgery. I get my calcium from diet with the occasional supplement if I’ve not been so good with my diet.

As an aside I believe AlgaeCal contains strontium which can affect Dexa scan results (making bone appear denser than it actually is) as DEXA’s are not calibrated for strontium.

HeronNS
HeronNS in reply to AnnieW55

Good point. Strontium actually replaces calcium and as it's heavier than calcium makes it appear the bones have become more dense.

Regarding medication by weight - chemotherapy is given by weight. I was weighed by nurse before every infusion.

Thanks to everyone who replied to my query on supplements to take to try and combat osteo without drugs. Great to have input from those who have been on this journey and have become wise !

I've been researching on this site and other, hopefully reliable, sites. So much information around so it is great to get feedback from members of with experience, and no commercial loyalties

I have gone for Pure Nutrition Ultra Calcium Citrate for the moment. I need to top this up with vits A and C , I think.

Have also upped the exercise- aiming for 10,000 with my new smartwatch. My main exercise is normally cycling but I realise that altho i may cycle 50 plus miles a week, this is not useful exercise for bone building.

I have also joined the Save Trainer online exercise programme. For 14 dollars a month you get access to a wide variety of exercise videos which I find are very good. There is a lot of information on the site for people like me who are new to trying to combat this condition without drugs. Various 'programs' on subscription, but I'm not sure how much benefit or additional information they would provide.

Thanks again for responding

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