To raise or not to raise - case study

[xanderusa]

Hi guys. I've been told in another forum to raise my actual 2 grains to around 3-5 grains gradually since they think I am still hypo due to my symptoms (check end of the post) in despite my numbers being in range from my last lab. My endo which is a TSH chaser things that I am still hyper and wanted to me reduce my dosage. he always check my slightly shaking hands:

Labs 04/17/2017 (Last dose was 12 hours before the labs) . I was on 1 1/2 grain + 75mg levothyroxine

TSH 0.01

T4 FREE: 1.4 in range: 0.8-1.8 ng/dL

T3 FREE: 4.1 in range: 2.3-4.2 pg/mL

However when I was on 3 grains 1 year ago my numbers were high. Even though there is a difference from lab to lab of 12 hours so I am not sure how drastically it changes the lab numbers and who is correct if 12 vs 24hs. For me 12hs has worked until now. These ones were the results:

Labs Collected: 05/11/2016 10:17 ( I was on 3 grains plus 25 mg of t3 by the time I took these labs, so since on May 2016 I dropped to 2 grains + t4 50mg of levoythyroxine and nothing of T3 to reduce the high T3)

T3, FREE: 5.3 High 2.3-4.2 (pg/mL)

T4, FREE: 0.9 "normal" 0.8-1.8 (ng/dL)

At this time I replaced the T4 75mg Levothyroxine for 1 NDT grain since it's being said that's the equivalent two weeks ago for recommendation from that forum. So it means I am on 2 grains of NDT at the moment.

SYMPTOMS:

-Even I lost 10 pounds I got stuck in the same weight again and unable to get rid of another 20 extra pounds.

-Slightly Puffy face. It used to be worse.

-Knees pain when bending only

-Slightly difficulty in getting sleep between 5-6 pm every two or three nights but my sleep is good in general.

-Losing hair all the time

-I have my energy back after taking clomiphene for my Low T, but I know for sure is not optimal.

-97.6 degrees in the morning. My Endo says it is because my AC. (I don't believe in him because he is a TSH chaser btw. Just with him to get the recipes). And normal 98.6 in the pm. I know this is low cortisol in the morning

MED & VIT:

2 NDT grains, 50mg clomiphene for low T daily

3-4 times a week: iron, zinc, selenium, magnesium, D3.

QUESTIONS:

1) Do you think I still should raise to 3-5 grains in despite my numbers being on range? Wouldn't it get me same high numbers as 1 year ago since it will raise up my FT4 and FT3?

OR

2) Do you think I will get the same numbers as my last labs which were in range when replacing T4 75mg levothyroxine for 1 NDT grain?

3) How can I be Hypo when having numbers in range? Because of the symptoms?

Thank you for your answers.

[Hidden]

xanderusa do you believe that your thyroid meds work well despite having Lyme?

[xanderusa in reply to Hidden]

I've been on MMS for a while. I think they should work a bit shouldn't they?

[Hidden in reply to xanderusa]

xanderusa sorry, I'm just being curious as my thyroid meds don't work properly due to having Lyme. Have you felt better since you started taking MMS?

[xanderusa in reply to Hidden]

A lot. And yes, your right. We should address the Lyme thing first. the thing is that my infectious specialist denied me having lyme. But in another forum said lyme specialists are as useless as Endos. But yeah. I've been tons of times better under MMS. My problem is that I don't drink it constantly. I has to be taken 8 hours a day. I sometimes jump a day or two on weekends. Or just take around 3-5 sips. but it surely works a lot. I saved my cat with MMS from an infection. Mom now switched from diabetic to pre-diabetic. (She's inconstant as me. Sight!).

But yeah, you should give it a try. MMS is the best thing I ever experience before. Don't pay attention to all the fluff out there. Just check lyme testimonials on youtube or something. U'll see you will get better.

[Hidden in reply to xanderusa]

xanderusa long may you continue to improve. It's a nightmare trying to remember to take all these potions, I did try some MMS and was sick. The difficulty is timing and possibly took it too close to something else. Great it's working for your Mum, and your cat too!

[steviecat]

Hi, Xan. Have you had your mins and vits tested: B12, D3, Folate and Ferritin? These guys are very important to us hypos. Optimum is what you are looking for - not just 'normal'. Have you been tested for antibodies: TPO and TG? Do you have Hashimoto's? I'm no expert but, frankly, your latest numbers look fine to me. Can't help wondering why you are mixing NDT with Levo... Bit of a contradiction, that. Hopefully, one of the really knowledgable peeps here will pile in and advise.

[xanderusa in reply to steviecat]

Hi, Yes, I have D3 deficiency and working it. The Ferritin was normal. Iron was "in range" but not optimal. For men has to be around 140. And in regarding TPO and TG Yes. I have tested them:

Labs Collected: 05/03/2016 09:34 =

*THYROGLOBULIN ANTIBODIES: 26 high range: < or = 1 IU/mL (used to be in 42.0 on Nov 2015, but 29.0 on Feb 2015 so not sure what made it raise during the months of Feb-Nov 2015)

*THYROID PEROXIDASE ANTIBODIES: 36 High. range: <9 (IU/mL) (Used to be in 46.0 on Feb 2015)

When my Endo saw this results he said it was normal to have "some" antibodies. Not sure if he's right.

I am on gluten free (no stricly even tho), and was taking NAC to lower antibodies but because I am also on MMS it could be counterproductive since NAC is a powerful antioxidant and MMS is far the contrary. A powerful oxidant.

[Clutter in reply to xanderusa]

Xanderusa,

It is normal to have 'some' antibodies but antibodies over range mean you have autoimmune thyroiditis (Hashimoto's). There is no cure for Hashimoto's which causes 90% of hypothyroidism. Treatment is for the low thyroid levels it causes. Many people have found that 100% gluten-free diet is helpful in reducing Hashi flares, symptoms and eventually antibodies.

chriskresser.com/the-gluten...

thyroiduk.org.uk/tuk/about_...

[xanderusa in reply to Clutter]

Do you think I got Hashimoto's or do you think the LYME disease it's mimicking as if I had Hashis?

[Clutter in reply to xanderusa]

Xanderusa,

Elevated thyroglobulin and thyroid peroxidase antibodies confirms Hashimoto's.

thyroiduk.org.uk/tuk/about_...

[Clutter]

Xanderusa,

Most of the T3 from NDT will be out of your blood after 6 hours so 8-12 hours is long enough between last dose and blood draw.

Your FT3 is top of the range so you don't need to increase your current dose of 1.5 grains + 75mcg T4.

You were over medicated on 3 grains because FT3 was over range so I think the advice to raise to 3-5 grains is plain wrong.

Have you checked that ferritin, vitamin D, B12 and folate are good? Hair loss can be due to low ferritin/iron and low zinc, and joint pain can be due to low vitD.

The average normal body temperature is generally accepted as 98.6°F (37°C). Some studies have shown that the "normal" body temperature can have a wide range, from 97°F (36.1°C) to 99°F (37.2°C). A temperature over 100.4°F (38°C) most often means you have a fever caused by an infection or illness.31 Jan 2015

Body temperature norms: MedlinePlus Medical Encyclopedia

medlineplus.gov/ency/articl...

[xanderusa in reply to Clutter]

Excellent Clutter. You are very diligent and smart. Yes, I have D3 defficiency and I am working on it taking 10000UI daily. The iron thing was normal one year ago. Never took the B12 nor folate.. I think I should take those labs. Thank you!

[steviecat in reply to xanderusa]

Xan. Do make sure you take Vit K2 Mk 7 with D3. D helps your bod better absorb calcium and you need that to go to bones and teeth. D on it's own can cause excess calcium to deposit in arteries. Calcification; not to be desired. Also, D hoovers up magnesium, so a good idea to supplement this, too.

[xanderusa in reply to steviecat]

Oh wow. Thanks!

[steviecat in reply to xanderusa]

You are welcome. One thing: do make sure you take D at least four hours away from any thyroid meds.

[steviecat]

Extract from Wiki. We are not monkeys, however...

'MMS is not approved for the treatment of any disease and according to the United States Environmental Protection Agency, chronic exposure to small doses of chlorine dioxide could cause reproductive and neurodevelopmental damage.[28] While studies of chlorine dioxide effects in humans are rare, studies on animal subjects are more common; chlorine dioxide has been shown to impair thyroid function and reduce CD4+ helper T cell count in grivet monkeys after 6 months'.

[steviecat]

exposingtruth.com/mms-mirac...