Hi, I've been on medication, forums, meds for about 2 years now and it's been impossible to lose weight. At first I just educated myself of treating me right to get the right thyroid numbers, adrenal healing, and others but today in spite my numbers I am still not losing weight. So what is going on?
These are my last labs:
Labs Collected: 05/11/2016 10:17
T3, FREE: 5.3 High 2.3-4.2 (pg/mL)
T4, FREE: 0.9 "normal" 0.8-1.8 (ng/dL)
TESTOSTERONE, TOTAL, MALES (ADULT), IA: 881 H 250-827 (ng/dL) (I've been taking testosterone since it was pretty low the last time. So know I dropped from 1 ml to 0.8ml to get the right numbers).
(So according with my Dr. and ppl from forums I am almost near to the right numbers. I was on 3 grains plus 25 mg of t3 by the time I took these labs, so I dropped to 2 grains + t4 50mg of levoythyroxine and nothing of T3 to reduce the high T3 since my NDT already have T3 in it. Now I think my T4 "must" be higher than this and my T3 near to the top. )
I am even not pooling (according with other forums).
Labs Collected: 12/09/2015 09:31
T3 REVERSE=<5 Low 8-25 (ng/dL)
T3, FREE=2.4 Low but on range 2.3-4.2 (pg/mL)
Labs Collected: 05/03/2016 09:34 =
*THYROGLOBULIN ANTIBODIES: 26 high range: < or = 1 IU/mL
(In this one I started recently "one week ago" to take Low Dose Naltrexone 2.5 mg and planning to raise to 4 mg, since I've been on paleo diet for more than 8 months and antibodies only dropped 20, so I ASSUME it is because sometime else since I am not neither celiac nor gluten sensitive even though I am skipping all the gluten just to see if I could lose some weight. But nothing).
I got some positive bands of LYME but my infectious disease specialist assured me I didn't have LYME since it is been needed at least 5 linked bands and I didn't have them. So she even didn't give me any medicine. However, I did buy this MMS protocl (miracle mineral supplement) and finished the 1000 protocol since it's been said to clean the body from lyme and others "just in case".
My insulin is ok too. I am not diabetic and my numbers are good.
My iron is good too:
IRON AND TOTAL IBC
IRON TOTAL = 124 50-180 mcg/dL
IRON BINDING CAPACITY= 302 250-425 mcg/dL
%SATURATION= 41 15-60 % (calc)
FERRITIN = 81 20-380 (ng/mL)
DHEA SULFATE=122 70-495 (mcg/dL)
CORTISOL (BLOOD TESTING)=5.3
Reference Range: For 8 a.m.(7-9 a.m.) Specimen: 4.0-22.0
Reference Range: For 4 p.m.(3-5 p.m.) Specimen: 3.0-17.0
Aldosterone, LC/MS/MS:2
Upright 8:00 - 10:00 am < or = 28 ng/dL
Upright 4:00 - 6:00 pm < or = 21 ng/dL
Supine 8:00 - 10:00 am 3 - 16 ng/dL
(my aldosterone is been low so I've been taking licorice root for this one every time and on).
Labs Collected: 03/29/2016 09:31
My cortisol is ok, even though it was about blood work:
CORTISOL, TOTAL = 8.9 mcg/dL (blood test)
(I've been on the adrenal cocktail for most than 1 years and half. After this bloodwork my numbers were like low in the morning and high in the afternoon but I feel this have changed now.)
Even my labs that I consider they are almost ok though today my temps were 97.2 in the am. and 98 around 3 pm. So I wonder what I am doing wrong? Is it because I dropped my NDT to only 2 grains? is it because I am not taking T3? Is this the reason why I am not losing weight?
Any thoughts would be highly appreciate it. Thank you in advance.
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xanderusa
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xanderusa - the FT3 range doesn't look quite right in that it looks to be a very small range.
Your comments re Lyme are interesting and wondering how you feel about being told you don't have it. Do you think that's the case? Am wondering whether the MMS has messed up your system if you don't have anything to kill off.
Can sympathise with the weight gain, is there anything going on with your gut?
Well, I used to have a chronic gastritis but with this MMS protocol everything seems fine now. And now, the MMS is pretty powerful. It's been said it cures the hashis and thyroid problems. I am still on it. Let's see what happens.
Have you looked into Zeolite ? This helped my newphew who had Lyme disease. It suprised the Dr so much that they took him off antibiotics. It did naturally eliminate my very high mercury toxicity...it went from 216 down to less than 5. It can also help with body Ph.
Actually I don't have LYME. But it is good to know about the Zeolite. I am taking MMS protocol which it also flush your metals from your body like bromide, mercury and others. It also cures the LYME. For me has worked with my chronic gastritis. Let's see if it fixed other stuffs.
Weight loss is a very complex issue. Have you been overly restricting your eating as that will have a negative effect on losing weight. I have learnt that to lose weight you have to be eating a moderate amount. Three meals a day of the food you most enjoy is a good guide. I am currently losing weight with a app called myfitnesspal. Taking too much medication can also stop you losing weight as can too little it can take a while to get the balance right as you have been doing. Also try to lose weight slowly 4 pounds a month is plently. Do I sound patronising sorry if I do. Wish I had a magic cure for weight problems.
I have found I need to be quite high in T3 to lose weight. Could be because you dropped your meds. Also I know it is controversial but I cannot lose weight if I eat carbs. Dr Peatfield recommended low carb years ago for thyroid problems and he suffered himself. I am slowly getting mine down. Eat fresh, clean food and no processed at all! Hope you have better luck x
Well, when I was under almost 150 mg of T3 I was unable to lose any pound either. I read on tiredthyroid.com that taking too much T3 is counter productive and it leads you to a severe insulin resistance so I am kind of very cautious about taking too much T3. It is also already contained in my NDT anyway so.. Ty
I'm a bit dubious about the TiredThyroid site, although it is interesting reading. I have much the same problem as you, minus the testosterone.
During a recent consultation with my doctor, she told me that insulin resistance and peripheral thyroid resistance tend to occur in the same patients, and they can't lose weight. She thinks these problems may have the same cause, but until more is known more all she can do is recommend intermittent fasting on a ketogenic diet, e.g 5:2. I do keto anyway (most of the time) but I haven't felt well enough yet to try fasting.
That's really interesting Hillwoman. My Endocrinologist recommended low carb diet to me too. It has really helped have lost one and half stone. I feel really well on it. I do once a week introduce high connect carbs once a week as apparent However seem to have plateaued a bit. Thinks it's part because have become a bit relaxed around my new diet but the fasting is interesting. How long did he recommend you fast for? Xx
Hi waveylines. She recommended in my case only fasting for 24 hours, every now and then, rather than sticking strictly to a diet like the 5:2 every week - I'm too unwell for that. When I try it, I plan to start the 24 hr fast part way through the day, so that no day passes without a meal in it. Easier to tolerate, I think.
Wish low carb helped me shed the thyroid and menopause weight gain, but at least giving up sugar and grains has improved my digestion (no churning) and dispensed with the post-meal coma I used to fall into.
Thanks Hillman. Sorry to hear that you are so unwell. Hope you start to feel better soon
I had head of 24hr fasting -watched a programme about a doc visiting a family to help them -can't remember it's name...lol. Anyway he did the fasting with a male diabetic amongst other stuff. Was very successful. He had to also do intensity training -am not sure whether that was to counteract the drop in metabolism that occurs with fasting?
I'm with you on the weight loss bud. I've tried everything and all that ever happens is large fluid fluctuations. I've tried, low carb, zero carb, gluten free, ldn, low fat, extremely low cals, lots of cardio, weight training, Sensible clean eating with moderate cardio and I've tried it all in different combinations and nothing makes any difference. I believe there is some other mechanism in our bodies that blocks weight loss some how when we're hypo/hashi and nobody knows what it is. I'm left considering extreme measures because I'm so sick of being over weight. I hate it and it's extremely depressing/frustrating. It doesn't help when your endo just says something like, "oh it's not just you, it's a global pandemic"
Someone else told me that she's doing the ketogenic diet after trying tons of stuffs and even having their thyroid stabilize, and now losing tons of weight. It seems it's working for a lot of people. Have you tried it before? I am kind of bending toward this new diet. It seems that when we cut fat it affects the adrenals, so that's why. Adrenals are the culprit of producing too much cortisol when stressed so maybe it is because we have been cutting the fats. We need fats. I've been reading interesting results on ketogenic. I found a group on facebook called: "Ketogenic adaptation" it has more than 13000 users. And ppl told me that Pinterest is full of ketogenic recipes. Let's see. Good luck!
Thanks for the advice. I haven't ever followed any specific ketogenic diet but I have tried zero carb which basically is the same. Once all the carbs are depleted you enter ketosis which means your body starts making keytones from fat for energy. Maybe I should retry it because it was a while ago before I was anywhere near optimum levels.
I don't know anything about your test results but I do know that since I have had chronic illness with many different medications it is nigh on impossible to lose weight. In fact I am steadily putting it on. If you read some of the side effects of most drugs including statins and heart medication and especially ones for Fibro they all indicate that weight gain is a side effect. Very depressing and feel as though I am fighting a losing battle!
Have you tried MMS protocol. I mean, the weight loss is happening when everything is on the right trail. It kills all diseases. I am still on it. I mean, I say it because I can see you must have lot of problems. I just have hashis. My mom got arthritis and other conditions and she's taking the MMS and her health has improved tremendously. Don't lose your faith, and keep fighting.
Weight gain caused by a hormonal imbalance requires balanced hormones to lose it.
Your thyroid antibodies are still high and the immune system needs balanced thyroid hormone to modulate Th-1 & Th-2. Paleo is good but don’t forget it is not just about gluten /dairy (sugar ? ) but cross reactive proteins (when your body sees other foods as gluten and reacts accordingly.
You have changed your meds and dose so much and although high T3 is destructive, it shouldn’t be routinely started & stopped. The T4 result is often low in people medicating T3 so shouldn’t be considered above the T3 result.. What is your TSH ? ? …
I haven’t supplemented LDN but constantly read beneficial things. Iron is ok but ferritin could be higher so keep supplementing as is needed for thyroid hormone production. Adrenal cocktail & liquorice is good. I have found 3 grams of daily Vit C & liquorice appear to have given my adrenals the best improvement.
The HPA axis is complex and any hormone excess/deficiency will have consequences further up the line. Your testosterone is now too high and cortisol still too low. I read that low testosterone can result in lower tissue levels of T3 as it suppresses D1 activity, perpetuating weight gain or inability to lose weight.
Have you had Leutinising Hormone tested ? (LH stimulates the testes to produce testosterone). Thyroid binding globulin (TBG) is the protein that transports thyroid hormone through the blood. (Present) elevated testosterone can lower TBG levels creating too much free thyroid hormone in the bloodstream and the cells to develop a resistance to it, causing hypothyroid symptoms & so weight gain. Chris Kresser says in this situation your bloods would show normal TSH and T4 but elevated and unusable T3.
High levels of Sex Hormone Binding Globulin (SHBG) caused by elevated thyroid hormones causes more hormone (supplemented testosterone ? ? ) to become bound leaving less free available for use. Low thyroid hormone decreases SHBG.
Test results are only a guide and thyroid hormones can take months to achieve their full potential. You constantly change your meds and dose(s) so your body won’t know what is going on ! ! ...
Apart from being over weight, how do you feel well ? ? …
Hi, reed. As always thank you so much for your insights. Well, I feel with more energy to be honest than my latter posts. It seems the testosterone is working or not sure what else.
Let me show my labs before taking testosterone:
Labs Collected: 03/29/2016 09:31 (took thyroid-s 2 grains am/pm; T3 12.5 am and 12.5 pm the day before)
FT4 0.8 range: 0.8-1.8 ng/dL
FT3 4.1 range: 2.3-4.2 pg/mL
CORTISOL, TOTAL = 8.9 mcg/dL (blood test)
Reference Range: For 8 a.m.(7-9 a.m.) Specimen: 4.0-22.0
Reference Range: For 4 p.m.(3-5 p.m.) Specimen: 3.0-17.0
FSH = 2.6 1.6-8.0 (mIU/mL)
LH = 4.0 1.5-9.3 (mIU/mL)
PROLACTIN = 4.9 2.0-18.0 (ng/mL)
TESTOSTERONE, TOTAL, MALES (ADULT), IA= 252 250-827 (ng/dL) (in range but still low)
Then after testosterone 1 mil:
Labs Collected: 05/11/2016 10:17
T3, FREE: 5.3 High 2.3-4.2 (pg/mL)
T4, FREE: 0.9 "normal" 0.8-1.8 (ng/dL)
TESTOSTERONE, TOTAL, MALES (ADULT), IA: 881 H 250-827 (ng/dL)
(That's why I am reducing to only 0.8ml of testosterone to reduce it a bit).
On the other hand these are my antibodies after trying the gluten free. They only dropped 20. That's why I am now trying the LDN.
Labs Collected: 05/03/2016 09:34 =
*THYROGLOBULIN ANTIBODIES: 26 high range: < or = 1 IU/mL
So now I am on 2 grains of NDT + T4 of levothyroxine and no T3 at all since it's already contained on the NDT. And the reason why is because I am trying to recreate a normal thyroid production finding the right amount as this graphic shows:
And to be honest with the Paleo diet I am not following 100% to the foot. Only like 50% since my family cooks mostly with flour and others so sometimes I just don't have anything to eat so I have to feed myself with that. I am not celiac nor gluten sensitive even though. I was just restricting at some level but just for my weight. I think my antibodies are high for another reason, but I don't think is the gluten thing.
My hormones were totally ****** and I have had to keep thyroid hormones low in order for my body to tolerate them well but they work and I am slim. Thyroid hormones rely on adrenal hormones for much deiodinase activity so you may not lose weight until your cortisol is higher but the answer is not to keep taking more & varying thyroid hormones..
Usually testosterone is produced in the testes but when this fails the adrenals take over but in compromised adrenals, obviously this won't be possible. Low LH, FSH & testosterone induced by hypothyroidism (hypothalamus//pituitary issue ? ? ..) is called secondary hypogonadism. I don’t know how this is treated apart from hormone replacement. Is your doctor monitoring the supplementation of testosterone ? ? .
Diet is hugely important and I have just ordered a book on the ketogenic diet called “ The Art & Science Of Low Carbohydrate Living” by Jeff S Volek.
My Husband is the worlds healthiest insulin dependant diabetic and we constantly look for ways of better eating. I have found protein hugely beneficial (even though I don’t particularly like meat but have to cook for a big family anyway so eat it.) Proteins perform a vast array of functions including transporting hormones and building the immune system.
Without any carbs the body breaks down fats and will raise ketone bodies but I am not sure about a total ketogenic diet until I read the science because thyroid hormone depends on a certain amount of calories and fat calories are processed differently to whole-food carbs.
Also T3 controls the sub-cellular mitochondria metabolism and I understand must be matched with protein, for digestion into amino acids that reassembles as muscle (not fat). This was my way of losing weight as muscle then uses thyroid hormone far more efficiently and is probably why I can get away with thyroid blood test results literally just within range. (I am a case study for my endo who has just reduced my T3 further to see what happens ! ! ... but I am confident.) Think of body builders who use protein and T3 to eliminate fat and build muscle.
A catabolic state occurs when there is a calorie or protein deficit and lowers T3 to protect against muscle loss, so encouraging fat. We need to be careful because we are medicating thyroid hormone which won’t adjust naturally to these varying states. Too much T3 decreases ketosis and increases the insulin-glucagon ratio encouraging gluconeogenesis. Be aware that if you try the ketogenic diet, gut flora may suffer, requiring probiotics and digestive enzymes to be supplemented.
Protein stimulates insulin release as much as carbohydrate (because one of insulin's jobs is to send amino acids into lean tissues such as muscle). Interestingly when my diabetic husband (who is slim) eats the fats//protein diet he ends up with such low blood sugar levels he has to eat some carbs just to balance the injected insulin (the exact opposite problem to most diabetics) as insulin is necessary to break down the proteins (and balance PH levels).. Also this shows that for some, eating a high-protein meal could cause hypoglycaemia because the insulin release would suppress blood glucose too much. Glucagon release counterbalances insulin, preventing hypoglycaemia when we eat a high-protein meal.
Also Leptin is a hormone that is made in your fat cells and involved in maintaining body weight. It controls and influences the immune system (similar to inflammatory cytokine lL-6 (proteins) ) often elevated in Hashi sufferers who commonly have excess accumulated fat around the middle. This is why you need to lower thyroid antibodies as more fat means higher leptin which can result in leptin resistance when your metabolism and fat breakdown (lipolysis) will slow.
How do you know it is not a gluten thing ? You say above you have had "chronic gastritis". I would urge you to stick with the gluten free diet and be mindful of reactions to all other foods. Your high antibodies show your body’s very reactive state is being triggered by something ! ! Hashi sufferers commonly have food intolerances which decrease together with thyroid antibodies as it appears one perpetuates the other.
I feel reducing the T3 might have been enough as stopping completely, whilst starting T4 with your NDT is a double whammy. The T3 in the NDT will now have to stretch further as is required to convert the additional T4 but lets hope it's enough because you don't want any further med changes just yet.
It is good you are feeling slightly better and maybe things are on the up now. When my health turned around I experienced much improved symptoms but many smaller issues continued, that have since ironed out and still continue to do so, even after a year since adding T3. I am sure all the years of damage caused by being misdiagnosed take as many to repair.
My endo now has me on 125 mcg of T3 and although my other symptoms have improved, there is 10-11 pounds of water weight that will not budge. My heart rate is about 82. You had mentioned that it was not until you reached 150 mcg that weight came off. Are you still taking the 150 mcg? If not, why? Thank you.
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