High levels of estrogen.

[shambles]

Graves’, TT 2011 on 100/125mcg. Active and aggressive TED, 52.

Returning from the Endo visit and being dismissed for the second time in two years, I have been told I am hyper despite knowing I am hypo and to reduce my meds.

I had to fight to get back to see an Endo based on bloods I paid for myself in January this year. Waited until April for an appointment. Seen an Endo that showed interest and requested all the tests I could have hoped for and on my return to get the results seen a complete and utter idiot who didn’t look at any of the bloods and kept saying your are over medicated. I see people like you all the time and I know you are over medicated and everything you are feeling is due to being overmedicated. Grrrrhhhhhhhhhhhh…..

So my mother had pituitary failure and I now recognise she had Graves’ that was undiagnosed. I mention this because I fear I will end up with pituitary failure. She also had PA.

Mr Nice Endo ordered and completed the following tests.

24hr Urine Creat. 9.3 mmol (6.0-13.0)

24 Urine Cortisol 54 nmol ( 10-147)

Synacthen Test

Time Cortisol

8.45 549

9.15 844

9.15 927

Oestradiol

Oestradiol reference range : Follicular phase 72-729, Mid cycle 234-1309, Luteal phase 205-786. Post menopause <118pmol

Oestradiol 3595 pmol/l

Luteinising hormone

FSH &LH guide Follicular FSH 3-10, LH 2-13, Mid-cycle FSH 3-33, LH 9-76 Luteal FSH 2-9, LH <17, menopausal FSH >22

LH 36.3 U/L

FSH 169.1 U/L

Thyroid Ab(TPO)

Thyroid antibodies screen is positive

Thyroid Ab (TPO) 177.2

TSH 0.04 (0.5-4.78)

T4 21 (9-23)

T3 4.2 (3.5-6.5)

It is imperative that I try to keep my TSH supressed to help with my eyes. Since having my thyroid out I have been on 150 mcg to 100 mcg and my T4 number alters but my T3 stays roughly the same. Both Endo said no need for T3 meds.

Mr idiot Endo looked at the TSH and said, you are over medicated reduce to 100 mcg. I said but my eyes are bad. He said oh yes, well, reduce when your eyes are better. I said something is wrong and my antibodies are not going down? I asked do I have Hashimoto as well as Graves’. He said you’ve got antibodies, it doesn’t matter which ones!.... He said he was passing me back to the GP.

Also out of range bloods

RBC 3.69 (4.20-5.40)

PCV 0.348 (0370-0.470)

MCH 32.8 (27.0-32.0)

Vit D was low so supplementing. Folate in range but low, ferritin pretty good. B12 active test well in range but supplementing anyway.

What do I do about the high estrogen and how does that affect me? Do have Hashi’s and does that affect things?

[Clutter]

Shambles,

Idiot endo is well out of his depth. You aren't overmedicated. It's likely that low FT3 is making you feel ill and if your FT3 stays low whatever dose you are on it's likely you need some supplementary T3 in addition to T4. eje-online.org/content/161/...

Positive Thyroid Peroxidase antibodies (TPOab) means you have Hashimoto's in addition to Graves. I'm sorry I can't answer your question about high oestrogen.

[shambles in reply to Clutter]

Thank you for the reply.

Yes I wholly agree with you but a little stuck when no one will prescribe T3. I know I have the option of self medicating.

I know that high levels of estrogen will increase levels of thyroid binding protein but not sure what affect that has. Would like to know the cause of the high estrogen and given the link to breast cancer, clearly need to address it somehow.

Keep well

[Clutter in reply to shambles]

Your thyroid absorption will be less then and you may need to increase your dose. PM me if you need a link for T3.

[Hidden]

So did the Endonob provide any opinion on the cause of the high oestrogen? Cos that does seem really high. I take it you're not on the pill or any HRT?

Could it be some kind of adrenal tumour?

[shambles in reply to Hidden]

You made me laugh. He said I should stop taking HRT. I said don't I take HRT and when I said so, he said, oh! That was the end of the that conversation. No, no pill, HRT.

There are some adrenal tests done and perhaps that is what Mr nice endo was looking for. I don't know anything about adrenal tumour, do you? I can have a google.

Thanks for the reply LilyMay.

[mistydog]

Do you eat a lot of soya? That contains a form of oestrogen that can be used by the body? (I think, brain fog here!). Your endo is clearly an idiot - yet another to add to the list!

[shambles in reply to mistydog]

Hi mistydog, thanks for replying.

I eat pretty clean. No soya due to the fact I have Graves'. Don't smoke and don't drink, except on the odd occasion a glass of wine every six months. Porridge for breakfast and salad and protein for dinner most days. I do drink bottled water though and read that can have an affect. I have put 20lbs on since my thyroid was removed but was always pretty skinny, so my current BMI is 23.1. I'm a size 12, so can't say I am overweight either.

I'm at a loss and sort hit a brick wall (new word for Endo). The doctor doesn't know what to do and Endo is well..........

Keep well

[mistydog in reply to shambles]

Linseed and some other seeds can also up your oestrogen level. Have a bit of a Google and see if anything rings bells with you? I'm out this evening or I'd have a look myself. I try to avoid these foods as I have had breast cancer already and it was hormone fed.

[Silver_Fairy]

Do you eat a lot of animal fats ie meat, milk, butter, cheese? Apparently, a high fibre, low fat diet is the best for bringing down oestrogen levels. Also being constipated is detrimental. Thyroxine levels need to be optimal so that oestrogen levels are kept lower by improving the liver’s ability to excrete it.

[shambles in reply to Silver_Fairy]

Hi Silver_Fairy. Thanks for replying.

I would say yes my diet is probably high in fat content albeit, I eat very little if that makes sense? Fibre is something I definitely need as I am under medicated, although not according to the Endo. I am going to order a fibre supplement now. I take a pre and probiotic but I can't say that it has help with constipation. I have been back and forth to the breast clinic for the past five years with lumps that all turned out to be benign and that was before the thyroid came out.

I feel my thyroxine is not doing what it should do......... like so many here.

Hope are well.

[1973GB]

Hi All

I have read your posts with much interest. I am hypo and have fibro. I recently saw my doctor because i had developed a lump in my armpit. The long and short of it is i was referred to a breast clinic who scanned my armpit and said it was excess breast tissue. I asked the consultant how that got there and she basically told me it was because i was overweight and this was producing more estrogen and that i should lose weight! I currently take 125mcg levothyroxine. I do not take any form of HRT or birth control and am still having periods ( for a day!) I told the consultant that i walk the dogs twice a day, play badminton 3 times a week (despite the pain) and i eat healthily so i was rather peeved that she thought it might be self inflicted overindulgence! She has told me to see my doctor about getting my weight managed but i am wondering if i am in some viscous hormone and adrenal trap? I used to be 4 stone lighter than i am today, run a lot and have a lot more energy. I have lots of other niggling health complaints like plantar fasciitis, achiles tendonitis, periodontal disease, deviated septum the list goes on! I guess what i should do is see my doctor and get my female hormones checked out and possibly get cortisol tested but i am really fed up of keep going to the doctor as i feel i am becoming a hypochondriac! By the way my thyroid is within range but is probably not optimised and i do need to get this re-tested as well!. Is anyone else experiencing similar problems?

[Hidden]

Hi Shambles,

I know this is really late in the piece but I happened on your post due to estrogen in the label. You're estrogen dominant for sure, and with that amount in your blood, you can pretty much guarantee you'll be severely progesterone deficient, which is the natural counter-balance.

I've just finished reading Dr John Lee's book, What your doctor won't tell you about menopause, which is actually a bit of a misleading title, cos its not all about menopause. Highly recommend it though (easy to get on Amazon/Kindle). He describes in detail what can cause estrogen dominance, how common it is, and how to go about treating it naturally (also ridiculously easily), and progesterone's role in our endocrine system at large, with chapters paying specific attention to common women's health problems - breast cancer, fibrocystic breasts, endometriosis, menstrual irregularities, PCOS, PMT, cervical and uterine cancer, etc.

I really hope this helps. Its another one of those medical scandals where Big Pharma has pushed out genuine life changing medical knowledge.

[shambles in reply to Hidden]

Greatly appreciate your input Kimarina.

I have since been retested and my estrogen had reduced significantly but as you say my progesterone was low. I then tried to supplement with natural progesterone cream bt this lead to terrible panic attacks.

I have recently tested my cortisol and testosterone and found both of these to be high which is leading to me thinking I have PCOS or Cushings. Something is still completely off and not receiving any help from either GP or Endo.

Thanks again.

[Hidden in reply to shambles]

Oh no! Panic attacks? I'm no doctor, but perhaps you were using too much? Basically the average application is about 1/4 tsp rotated around different parts of the body to prevent saturation (avoiding breasts and abdomen), and only from days 12-26 of your cycle. That works with when your body would naturally produce progesterone, and at a physiological amount that best emulates what your body should be producing. He did say something about the effects of too much cream, but I didn't really pay too much attention to that bit... Sorry.

I have PCOS, and what really surprised me is Dr Lee also said in his book, that in his experience, young women who developed ovarian cysts, with a diet change of less refined sugar and starches, often saw the cysts disappear of their own accord. Its the first time I've seen a statement like that in regards to PCOS, but it fits in with everything else I've been reading about overall health and what I wasn't doing in my own younger years. I had a sweet tooth from hell, that I now understand was due to imbalances in my gut microbiome, and systemic candida overgrowth.

I'm also trying to dodge the fates of my grandmother, mother and aunt as well, all undiagnosed hypothyroids and the myriad of related conditions that brings when left untreated.