New user of NDT

[Georgie2386]

Hi

I was diagnosed with an underactivity Thyroid in Sept 2006 and since then have been taking 100 mcg Levothyroxine. Over the years I have been feeling very tired, and escalting weight gain. My GP is always telling me that my Thyroid blood tests are normal.

Through consulting with a private UK based doctor, I have recently started to take Armour Thyroid NDT 1 grain (60 mg) each tablet contains Levothyroxine 30mcg and Liothyronine 9mcg. Instructions are to take half a tablet twice a day. This is because after blood tests it looked like my body struggles to convert T4 to T3.

Before I was only taking 100 mcg Levothyroxine one tablet once a day.

When I only took the Armour Thyroid prescription after around 3 weeks I started to feel really tired and have now energy. I also started supplementing with I am supplementing with D3 &K2, B12 and Selenium and Zinc.

I then stopped taking Armour and reverted back to only taking 100mcg Levothyroxine. I do feel a bit better only taking Levothyroxine, but still feel tired and my weight issues are getting worse.

Any ideas on what I could do would be appreciated.

Thanks in advance.

Here is my Thyroid Function Blood Test which I gave to the Private doctor who then prescribed the above Armour Thyroid

Thyroid function test (X77Wg)

Serum free T4 level (XaERr) Result: 10.2 pmol/L [7.7 - 15.1]

Serum free triiodothyronine level (XaERq) Result: 4.7 pmol/L [4.3 - 6.8]

Serum TSH level (XaELV) Result: 0.916 miu/L [0.34 - 5.6]

#t3 #armourthyroid #t4 #liothyronine #levothroxine

[Jaydee1507 Administrator]

Before you switched back to Levo did you get a blood test or talk to your private doctor about your dose of NDT? You probbaly just needed to increase. 1 grain of NDT is a low starting dose so you should have increased at that point.

You could try adding some T3 via your private doctor now.

Are all key vitamins at OPTIMAL levels - ferritin, folate, B12 & D3?

What are you supplementing with?

[Georgie2386 in reply to Jaydee1507]

Hi

Thanks for all the responses.

I am supplementing with D3 &K2, B12 and Selenium and Zinc.

I was unable to go back to the private doctor as I was made redundant and could not afford to pay the fees to get bloods checked and adapt the NDT prescription. The best I could do was to ask my GP to refer me to my hospital endocrinologist but as it's the NHS I will have to go on the waiting list for an appointment.

[Jaydee1507 Administrator in reply to Georgie2386]

Your FT4 is only 34% of range. If you could get it to 70%+ then you might feel well on Levo alone, you just need enough of it.

Levo+ T3 is a cheaper option than NDT.

[Brightness14]

I think that you needed an increase to at least 1.5 grains per day. I don't think that 1 grain is the same as 100 Levo but 1.5 is. Only my opinion.

[Georgie2386 in reply to Brightness14]

Thanks.

[pennyannie]

Hello Georgie and welcome to the forum :

Can you please share a little more information with forum members so we an try and help you better -

What is your diagnosis - how long have you been hypothyroid and can you please share these blood test results and ranges that show you not able convert well the T4 into T3.

Armour is the leading brand of Natural Desiccated Thyroid - are your tablets/grains in an Armour bottle as that should state the known content as 9 mcg T3 + 38 mcg T4 :

It's suggested that you start by running a TSH+T3 and T4 blood test before switching to NDT

as then you have bench mark readings to compare to - and then you stop T4 one day and start NDT the next - and you start building up your dose by 1/4 grain increases weekly/fortnightly -- and as one support system decreases in your body ( T4 ) another ( NDT ) builds.

It's generally suggested that if you reach 2 grains you stay on this dose 6-8 weeks and then run a blood test to see if your T3 has improved/moved - from bench mark readings -

There comes a week where you feel you have gone a bit backwards and likely a bit anxious and uncomfortable in your skin - so you drop back to the previous dose where you felt well - stay on this dose 6-8 weeks and then run a blood test so see where your T3 and T4 sit.

This happened to me at 1 + 3/4 grains - so I dropped back down to 1 + 1/2 grains and let this dose ' bed in ' for 8 weeks and then ran my blood test and my T3 and T4 had swooped positions from when being on synthetic T4 and now my T3 is around 90/ 110% with my T4 at around 25/30% through it's range and I am feeling very well and pleased I switched treatment options.

I also monitored physical symptoms of blood pressure, pulse and body temperature twice daily - AM and PM - and whilst these first 2 remained constant my temperature slowly rose from 35.4 to 36.6 where it is today some 6 years later.

I also ensure my core strength vitamins and minerals - those of ferritin, folate, B12 and vitamin D are up and maintained at optimal levels -

as no thyroid hormone treatment option works well if any of these are not at a good healthy levels - which we can advise on - if you care to share more information.

So - anyway - that's how I did it - if you want to try again -

[Georgie2386 in reply to pennyannie]

Hi

I was diagnosed with an underactivity Thyroid in Sept 2006 and since then have been taking 100 mcg Levothyroxine.

Here is my Thyroid function blood test results Nov 2023 that the private doctor had to then give me the NDT prescription Armour Thyroid 1 grain (60 mg) each tablet contains Levothyroxine 30mcg and Liothyronine 9mcg. Instructions are to take half a tablet twice a day.

Thyroid function test (X77Wg)

Serum free T4 level (XaERr) Result: 10.2 pmol/L [7.7 - 15.1]

Serum free triiodothyronine level (XaERq) Result: 4.7 pmol/L [4.3 - 6.8]

Serum TSH level (XaELV) Result: 0.916 miu/L [0.34 - 5.6]

[pennyannie in reply to Georgie2386]

OK - so these results were when you were taking 100 mcg T4 -

So your T4 was at around 34% with your T3 at around 16% - through the ranges :

We generally feel best on T4 only medication when the T4 is up in the top quadrant of its range at around 80% with the T3 tracking just behind at around 60/70% through its range.

Do you have the option of increasing your Levothyroxine further than 100 mcg daily as just doing this might well solve these symptoms of tiredness and weigh gain as your T3 and T4 thyroid hormones are not at a high enough level within the ranges.

You will not be prescribe Armour on the NHS and suggest while you wait for your NHS appointment you stay on the Levothyroxine and try and get dose increases in Levothyroxine - so your T3 and T4 thyroid hormones build up in the range which will hopefully alleviate some of the symptoms being tolerated.

No thyroid hormone replacement works well until your core strength vitamins and minerals are optimal - and these are ferritin, folate, B12 and vitamin D which often are low when hypothyroid as we tend to have low stomach acid and have trouble extracting key nutrients from our food no matter how well and clean we eat - so in preparation for your NHS appointment see if you can get these blood tests run and we can advise where these need to be to support thyroid hormone conversion.

Similarly when hypothyroid loosing weight and dieting are not recommended as conversion of T4 into T3 can be down regulated by any physiological stress ( emotional or physical ) inflammation, antibodies depression, dieting and ageing.

Do you know if you ever had your thyroid antibodies run and they were found over range meaning your hypothyroidism is caused by a thyroid Auto Immune disease ?

So 1 grain Armour contains 9 mcg T3 + 38 mcg T4 - and said to be around the same as taking 75mcg/100 mcg T4 - but personally - I find these 2 treatment options totally different and it all depends how your body accepts, converts and utilises each treatment option.

[Georgie2386 in reply to pennyannie]

Thank you somuch.