I just got my results back from BH. I would appreciate if someone could help me make sense of them. I also requested my blood test results from my GP practice covering 2012 to 2016, I realised after readding them that some are missing so will trace the results for October 2015 (when I was feeling like dementors were attacking me) when the surgery opens next week. I will also try and get the results from the tests the endo consultant requested in 2013 (beginning of treatment) and 2014 when I last saw him. GP practice did not have a copy of those.
My previous results if of interest were as follow:
July 2016 THS 1.7 (Range 0.3 - 4.20) and Vitamin D 16.9nmol/L (Range 50 -150)
I am on 1600IU VitD3 daily dose but after speaking to a friend who had same defiency and was given 20000IU x 2 a week x 7 weeks by consultant I decided to supplement my dosage and have been taking 20000IU x 2 a week for the past 4 weeks.
May 2016 THS 1.3 (same range)
April 2014 Free T4 15.7pmol/L (12-22pmol/L)
May 2013 THS 3.4 (0.3-4.2) and Free T4 14.4 (12-22)
I have lost 9 st since I started treatment in 2013, I was 30st (at173cm about 5'8'') and I am now 21st. At first the loss was steady (about 1 or 2lbs a week) with a big loss (about 10lbs in a week) every 12 weeks. But for the past 2 years, since August 2014 I have really struggled to loose weight and have only managed 1.5st over the period.
My main complaints are my inability to loose weight no matter how hard I try. My joints, muscle and bone aches which in my opinion are getting worse despite my VitD going up. I also have mood swings which affect me badly because I feel guilty at lashing out at my family and the pain from my joints, muscles and bones puts me in a bad mood.
I have been reading a lot of the posts on the forum over the past week (old and new) and realise how little I know about hypothyroisim.
I am currently on 100mcg of Levothyroxine and take this first thing in the morning with my VitD and my Co-Tenidone 50/12.5 for high blood pressure.
Should I be taking the Levo on it's own with no other medication? And wait an hour before breakfast?
How should I take my VITD? With food containing some sort of fat?
Is my Levo dose enough? (I read that the dose should be 10mcg per st which would mean that at 21st I should be having 200mcg????) Should I be supplementing my current Levo with T3? If so what would be the benefits? Any major problems of doing this?
Should I up my Vit D. intake? how much should I be taking? Should I be taking it with Vit. K? Where can I get Vit. D. and Vit. K. if my doctor refuses to prescribe it? Should I always take it with food containing fat?
Should I be taking Vit. B12? In what dosage and where can I get it? Also when and how should I take it?
I have seen people mentioning taking prebiotics, probiotics and Selenium. What are the benefits and how much should I be taking? also when and how should I be taking them?
greygoose mentioned myxoedema as a probable reason for my inability to loose weight. And from what I read this week I think he is right. I have also read about the doctor that first described his discovery of myxoedema in a thyroid patient corpse and the different physical signs that were used in the 19th and early 20th century to diagnose the disease, among them the abundance of warts and moles on the torso and back of patients (I have this since I was a child, so does my mum and so did her mother).
Morphologically my body seems to be divided in 2 halves, the top although fat is much slimmer than the bottom, from the waist down I am 6 sizes larger than the top. I seemed to have lost most the weight from the top and backside. I have a huge belly and my legs seem to be constantly swollen, which makes me believe it might be myxoedema. Is there a way to get rid of this or will it be the bain of my life for the rest of it?
Is going wheat free a good idea? Or is gluten free best? Should I go carb free as well? I have also found some info in an American site about "leaky gut" and although I was a bit flumoxed by it the truth is it sounded disguting...but they did recommend no carbs, no gluten etc.
Please bear in mind that I am a total newbie and the past week has been a very steep learning curve. I really welcome any comments and suggestions and I am most grateful for them.
X Anne
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Mordillo
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Firstly in order for you to lose weight you need to be optimally medicated and supplemented.
In regards to your vitamin D being "up" it is still at a completely inadequate level which is why you have bone, muscle and joint pain. If the GP advised you to take your initial dose they are an idiot as that is a maintenance dose for people whose level is around 80. It is safe for people to take up to 10,000IU per day or 70,000IU per week of vitamin D3. So you can safely take vitamin D3 for a 4-6 weeks as long as you know that you don't have any issues with your kidneys or liver.
You need to take the vitamin D with a meal with fat in it so lunch or dinner, and take vitamin K2 and magnesium supplements to ensure it is absorbed properly.
Once your level gets over 50 your pains should decrease. A level of 75 is adequate but you need a level of around 100 to be optimal.
You also need to supplement B12. This is also adding to your pains. Actually it may be worth going to your GP with a copy of the results and point out your vitamin B12 levels are too low to see if the GP takes any action. If they just give you vitamin B12 supplements buy your own as they will give you cobalamin. You want methylcobalamin lozenges - jarrows or Solgar which you can find on Amazon. With a level that low get the highest supplements you can find which I think are 5,000.
Your ferritin is too low buy some ferrous fumerate tablets and take one two times per day with vitamin C and water. Take it 4 hours away from thyroid medication and 2 hours away from other food, drinks and supplements. You can buy the ferrous fumerate on Amazon.
In addition you have antibodies so you have autoimmune thyroid disease so you need to change your diet to heal your gut. Go gluten free and avoid eating refined carbohydrates instead try and eat real food as the website you found states.
Finally you should congratulate yourself on learning and understanding a lot in a week. It's impressive that you have finally realised your GP hasn't been helping you so you have taken steps to help yourself, managed to read and comprehend a lot while feeling like carp. I will add some links in another post on vitamin D and ferritin.
These two links are ones you can point out to your GP. Also read through the research papers they are based on in the links in the articles. Though there is more recent research you will find out on your own.
In regards to vitamin B12 there is a pernious anaemia group on healthunlocked. You should join them and share your results with them. They will direct you more information on B12 and help you increase your levels if the initial way you try doesn't work.
I'm still impressed that a new poster has read through the forum AND done their own research.
First, yes you absolutely must take Levo on its own, with no other medication. Many of us take on waking. Some of us find taking at bedtime suits better, or recent research says it may be more effective. The only way to find out if it suits you is to try it.
Either way, Levo must be taken on empty stomach, and no food or drink (apart from water) for an hour after.
Vitamin D - yes take with food ( at least four hours away from Levo). Lunch time may be better than evening, if you find it keeps you awake.
Vitamin K2 (Mk7) - readily available on Amazon etc. Your Dr is unlikely to have even heard of it, let alone prescribe it. It helps increased calcium go in your bones where it should be.
Selenium - from Amazon or similar
Can take these at time that suits you (at least 2 hours away from Levo)
Only introduce one new supplement at a time. Wait at least a week, or 10 days, to check it agrees with you before adding another.
Vitamin b12 is far too low - ask GP to check for pernicious anemia before supplementing. Jarrows or Solgar methycolabamin 5000mcg daily lozenges, to slowly melt under tongue.
When supplementing B12 always good idea to take a good quality vitamin B complex to "keep the B's in balance" Good quality one, like Thorne Basic B - will have folate in (rather than cheaper folic acid) . This will improve your low folate level too
Lastly, yes going gluten free - no wheat, barley, rye (also no malt vinegar or hidden gluten in lots of things - really have to check labels )
Don't take the B complex or any B12 until GP has checked you for pernicious anemia as it skews the blood results and they won't treat you for PA then....
Oh I forgot to say your raised CRP is an indication that all isn't well. It commonly signifies inflammation or infection, and it is clear you have inflammation. I also think your FT3 is too low but as you have so many issues with nutrients these needed to be sorted out asap by supplementation and diet. This may help the thyroid hormones but may not.
Also you should get 84 ferrous fumerate and have a ferritin 5-7 days after finishing those. This is very important as iron can be toxic.
Vitamin D you can get tested at City Assays for £28. As it rises slowly you should get tested after 6 months as your previous test rises show that you can absorb vitamin D. Link - thyroiduk.org.uk/tuk/testin... The websites Grassroots health and the vitamin D council can help you work out what level of supplementation you want to take. Just be careful of the units and make sure you do the conversions where necessary.
Wow Anne, you've been doing your homework, you made me smile with all the questions you have asked, see how much you have taken in in such a short time.
Bluebug has answered many of your points so I wont repeat everything, will just add my two penn'orth here and there
Your TG antibodies confirm Hashimoto's where the antibodies attack and eventually destory the thyroid. As Bluebug suggests you should now adopt a gluten free diet which should help to reduce the antibody attacks. Gluten contains gliadin (a protein) which is thought to trigger autoimmune attacks so eliminating gluten can help reduce these attacks. Some people also need to be dairy free. Also, keeping TSH low and supplementing selenium will help reduce the attacks. Some reading about Hashi's should help:
Don't expect your doctor to know much about Hashi's.
Vit D at 37 is, as mentioned, very low. Mine was 15 and my loading doses were more than Bluebug suggests, but go along with the 10,000iu daily BB mentions and you should get that up to a decent level fairly soon. 100-150 is recommended. If you want to retest Vit D alone, City Assays will do that for £28 with a fingerprick bloodspot test vitamindtest.org.uk/ They recommend testing twice a year when supplementing. Take with dietary fat as BB says, also the K2.
The Vit D I took is this one bodykind.com/product/brand/... and I buy a few things from there, excellent company to deal with and good prices and great service.
K2-MK7 is needed to go with Vit D. A bit trickier to find with so few ingredients and more expensive. Have a look round. I've just bought a K2-MK7 with D3 and Vit A all combined now that my Vit D level is excellent so I wont recommend that one as it will be my maintenance dose, and you will be better with higher dose Vit D for now. Doctors Best also do a K2-MK7 bodykind.com/product/brand/... but you could do a google search and see what you come up with. Take with dietary fat (maybe fattiest meal of the day, or cracker and butter).
We also need magnesium when taking Vit D as this is another co-factor. There are many types, here is a list you can look at naturalnews.com/046401_magn... Magnesium citrate is recommended but can have a laxative effect. I take it in powder form, less fillers and stuff that way. Magnesium should be taken before bed as it is calming.
B12 - do get one of those recommended by Bluebug. The sublingual ones are just dissolved under your tongue, in under a minute, and the little blood vessels will get the B12 directly into your bloodstream therefore bypassing your stomach. Much the best way. Stay on 5000mcg daily for a while and when levels are nice and high you can reduce to a maintenance dose of 1000mcg. The Pernicious Anaemia Society recommends a level of 1000. Anything under 500 may cause neurological problems so you need to get that up ASAP.
When taking B12 we also need a B Complex to balance the B vits. Highly recommended is Thorne Basic B, also Jarrows B Right. Both contain 400mcg methylfolate (the best form) which will boost your Folate level as it is too low. Folate needs to be at least half way through range which with Blue Horizon is about 26.
B vits are best in the morning or no later than lunch time. They can be stimulating so you don't want them keeping you awake.
Ferritin has been mentioned by Bluebug and the supplement you need. If you find it gives you constipation or upset tummy, try the more gentle Iron Bisglycinate, Solgar Gentle Iron is one. Take each iron tablet with 1000mg Vit C to aid absorption and help prevent constipation.
As for your thyroid results FT4 is top of range at 21.79 (12-22) but look at that poor FT3 at 3.59 (3.1-6.8). You don't seem to be converting well at all. For good conversion the FT4:FT3 ration should be 4:1 or less. Yours is 6.06 : 1. This is fairly similar to what mine was.
Your results indicate that you don't need any more Levo, that would take you way over the top of the range. It seems that you just need your FT3 in a better place.
Take your Levo first thing in the morning or at night, or middle of the night, whatever suits, as long as it's on an empty stomach (one hour before, or two hours after food), take with water only and keep 4 hours away from iron and a couple of hours away from any other supplements. That will ensure maximum absorption.
What you can do is optimise all your vitamins and minerals and see whether that makes a difference. It should, it will help your thyroid hormone to be able to do it's job properly. However, if your FT3 still stays low and the ratio too high for proper conversion to take place, then you may need to add a little T3 like I do.
Selenium for your Hashi's and also to help conversion of T4 to T3. Probiotics for a healthy gut. Get a good multistrain one like Biokult Advanced Multistrain or Cytoplan Acidophilus Plus. Probiotics don't stay in the gut forever, and they need feeding. Prebiotics will feed them. You shouldn't take prebiotics whilst taking antibiotics for a bacterial infection as prebiotics will feed the bad bacteria as well as the good. Probiotics I've read should be taken on an empty stomach so either at night or before breakfast to fit in with other supplements.
I can't help with myxodema or leaky gut, hopefully someone will come along with some information for you.
Ummm... I don't think greygoose did mentioned myxoedema, that word isn't part of my vocabulary. But I did talk extensively about why you can't lose weight.
Why does everyone assume I'm a man? That would be greygander! lol
I would just like to add that you do have a serious conversion problem, there. You will never get well on T4 only, it will probably just make you worse. You don't necessarily need NDT - that might have too much T4 in it for you - but adding some T3 to a reduced dose of T4 would be a good idea.
Sorry I mistook you for a gander. From your plumage, wit, wisdom and handle I should have realised you were a goose. 😆😯🙊💐
I went back to my firsy post and realised my mistake. You did not mention myxoedema but said in one of your replies that the fat accumulated through hypo might not be fat at all. I added that to all the stuff I have been reading on this forum and just amalgamated the lot and thought you were talking about myxoedema.
Yes that's what struck me with the results you put up Mordillo. the T3 was on the low side, very similar to mine at 3.6 similar ref range. I never got well on T4 alone but have blossomed with T3. T4 is not usable it has to be converted to T3 before the body can use it. Therein lies a problem, the Medical minds of the country do not think T3 does very much ???!!!! Lots of people seem to get T3 from overseas.
Excellent advice from everyone. Just wanted to mention that once you are supplementing B12 - further testing is of little or no value. Your GP is likely to say you do not need any more if the result has improved - sadly this is not the case. You cannot overdose as excesses are excreted. The blood test only reveals the circulating B12 - and not the amount in your cells. Only 20% of the result can reach the cells where it is needed. Hence the result is needed to be around 1000.
I think you should look into why your B12 is so low and there are additional tests you can have - like Homocysteine and MMA. If the former is raised then that is a good indicator of B12 deficiency. Please have a good look around the website below to read more about testing. The book - Could it Be B12 ? - is a must read for everyone. As Dr Carr says in one of the videos below - What your GP does not know about B12 can harm you ....
I agree with everyones comments about being low in D3, B12 and Ferritin. You should ask your doctor as to why he thinks you might be low. Low vitamins and minerals can be a sign of Coeliac Disease which is another auto-immune disease and it can be common for us to have more than one of them sadly. If you are taking supplements and the levels are not going up you need to ask your Dr why you are not absorbing them. Not everyone who is Coeliac has weight loss and stomach cramps, bowel issues (I didn't - I just had unexplained low levels and felt awful).
If there is a possibility of being Coeliac then you should tell your doctor before you for Gluten Free as the blood tests won't work unless you have been consuming Gluten for 6 weeks before the tests.
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