Advice on supplementing please

[fiora]

Hi here are vitamin and mineral results.

Please could someone help me to understand what dose of vitamin D I need to take with a low calcium level?

I currently take 800iu vitamin D3 Fultium which I have been taking for 3 years, blood test result below.

25 hydroxy vitamin D2 - <6.0

25 hydroxy vitamin D3 - 33.5

Total 25 OH vitamin D - 33.5

(<25 severe vitamin D deficiency. Patient may need pharmacological preparations

25 - 50 vitamin D deficiency. Supplementation is indicated

50 - 75 vitamin D may be suboptimal, and long-term may lead to clinical effects. Advise on safe sun exposure and diet. Supplementation may be indicated

>75 adequate vitamin D)

Serum calcium - 2.17 (2.2 - 2.6)

Serum calcium adjusted - 2.17 (2.2 - 2.6)

Other results are below:

Serum folate - 3.5 (4.6 - 18.7)

Serum vitamin B12 - 148 (180 - 900)

Serum ferritin - 17 (15 - 150)

Thank you in advance

[SeasideSusie Remembering]

fiora Presumably the Fultium 800iu is prescribed? If you've been taking it for three years at that dose I'm not surprised it's still deficient. Has your GP not said anything?

So, what you need is to get some D3 5000iu like this bodykind.com/product/2463-b... - a small softgel, only two ingredients so no unnecessary rubbish. Take 10,000iu daily for 6 weeks which will boost your level, then reduce to 5000iu daily. Retest in May. If you've reached the recommended level of 100-150nmol/L then take 5000iu alternate days as a maintenance dose.

When taking D3 there are important co-factors needed (which your GP won't know about because they aren't taught nutrition)

vitamindcouncil.org/about-v...

D3 aids absorption of calcium from food and K2-MK7 directs it to bones and teeth where it is needed rather than arteries and soft tissues where it can cause problems like calcification of arteries and kidney stones etc. D3 and K2 are fat soluble so should be taken with the fattiest meal of the day. D3 should be taken four hours away from thyroid meds.

Magnesium comes in different forms, check to see which would suit you best and as it's calming it's best taken in the evening, four hours away from thyroid meds

naturalnews.com/046401_magn...

[fiora in reply to SeasideSusie]

Thanks. I have been taken off vitamin D and put back on them again. I was first prescribed them 3 years ago and I was taking them consistently until 2015. There came a point where the doctor I then saw stopped prescribing them saying my level was fine (it was 58.8). The doctor I now see has put me back on vitamin D after seeing these results.

[SeasideSusie Remembering in reply to fiora]

Once deficient and supplementing it's no use coming off a supplement for levels to plummet again, then be put back on the supplement. Yo-yoing like that doesn't do your health any good. Doctors don't seem to understand this, but all they are interested in is saving money. Once at *optimal* level we need a maintenance dose to stay there.

I got my Vit D level up from severely deficient at 15 to 192 in 2.5 months (not years!) by using the softgels I linked to at the right dose. Follow the suggestion I gave and you will get yours up fairly soon. Don't bother any more with your GP, he won't help you.

You can retest Vit D for £28 with City Assays who do a blood spot fingerprick test, and they are NHS City Hospital in Birmingham so very reliable

vitamindtest.org.uk/index.html

[bluebug in reply to fiora]

I was found to be severely deficient in 2013. The recommendation I was given was once my levels were adequate I needed to supplement vitamin D daily for the rest of my life. Having dug up protocals for people in other NHS areas they state that as well for people who have been diagnosed both severely deficient and insufficient. This is backed up by research articles.

If your GP is too mean to prescribe you vitamin D3 tablets, and a lot of CCGs/healthboards don't want to prescribe them to people due to cost, they should tell you to buy your own to keep your level up. They should only tell you to come off them if they know your lifestyle has changed e.g. you turn up to an appointment with a winter tan and admit you have been on holiday for 4 weeks in the sun.

So the next GP who refuses to prescribe them ask them clearly is it due to cost.

Btw my maintenance dose is 2,000IU per day. This is more than what you are taking to get your level up! So take the advice already given to buy higher strength ones and take the co-factors as having a low level of vitamin D screws up your levo absorption making you more susceptible to infections as well as bone problems.

[SeasideSusie Remembering]

fiora

Serum folate - 3.5 (4.6 - 18.7)

Serum vitamin B12 - 148 (180 - 900)

B12 and folate work together. Yours are absolutely dire and if your GP knows about these and done nothing he should be shot! He is being very negligent. Please post these results on the Pernicious Anaemia Society forum here on Health Unlocked for further advice. You will probably be advised to ask for testing for Pernicious Anaemia, and you will probably need B12 injections.

healthunlocked.com/pasoc

Serum ferritin - 17 (15 - 150)

You should ask your GP to do a full iron panel to check for iron deficiency anaemia. Your ferritin is so low you might need iron infusions, bit at the very least iron tablets. If prescribed tablets then take each one with 1000mg Vit C to aid absorption and help prevent constipation. Take iron four hours away from thyroid meds and any other supplements and medication as it will affect their absorption.

[fiora in reply to SeasideSusie]

Thanks my haematologist has told me I have positive Intrinsic Factor antibodies which he says means I have Pernicious Anaemia? I had a full iron panel done some time ago, no idea what the results are but I have microcytic anaemia. I am meant to be taking iron tablets and I am meant to be taking them 3 times a day but the haematologist has said the Pernicious Anaemia complicates this.

[SeasideSusie Remembering in reply to fiora]

Well, they must get their act together and sort this out. They can't leave you with B12 deficiency, it causes so many problems.

Take a look at the first few minutes of the first video in this link then get them to do something for you

b12deficiency.info/films/

Again, put this information on the Pernicious Anaemia forum and see what they say. They have experience and have probably come across this sort of thing before.

[bluebug in reply to fiora]

It means your red blood cells are too small. This is due to lack of iron.

Vitamin B12 deficiency/PA according to the literature gives you macrocytic anaemia (bigger red blood cells than normal) which is why your haemotolgist is saying your iron deficiency complicates things.

If you have issues with the iron tablets prescribed then you need to tell the haemotolgist or even your GP clearly. They can prescribe you ferrous sulphate instead of ferrous fumerate or vice versa as they are the same price. If that doesn't work they can prescribe ferrous gluconate. You may also be advised to cut the number down from 3 to 2 a day to have less bowel and stomach issues.

If the haemotolgist/GP refuse to prescribe a different iron salt then you can buy your own from a pharmacy in person or online without a prescription. If in person go to a different pharmacy to where you get the rest of your prescriptions, then tell the pharmacist you are iron deficient and have been told by your GP to buy iron rather than get a prescription. It is then the pharmacist discretion whether they will give them to you or not. Boots apparently can be difficult but the supermarkets are normally fine.

*Don't ignore your iron or B12 problems*.

As I know people who have collapsed due to low iron levels and needed to go to A&E.

[silverfox7]

I found out from the Vit D group on Facebook that fultium is not a good brand to take. It has things in it that are bi products of something else so cheaply sourced but are carcinogenic. Buying a better brand is better as it's not expensive and most probably better for you.

[Scouser58]

Hello fiora,,,if you are going to take a supplement, I always start with the recommended dose from the bottle,,your body can only process so much each day and taking a very high dose can result in your body expelling it out and therefore 'wasting' your effort to improve things for your whole body and health,,,,if you feel more is needed then increase slowly and maybe every other day,,,again giving your body chance to use the supplement,,,,I take D3 as this is a better supplement,,,,hope this is a little help to your progress,,,,,ttfn from karen.

[judburke]

Its clear that your levels are chronically low. Has your Dr done any tests to establish why they are low? You might have a gut absorption problem such as Coeliac which causes damage to your gut meaning nutrition cannot be absorbed properly even if you take supplements levels don't go up.

This is what happened to me - All my levels were low despite taking supplements -eventually I asked the question - why aren't levels going up and then I was tested for Coeliac which proved to be my issue. I didn't have the well known symptoms of toilet issues and stomach cramps - the only indicator was unexplained low levels of ferritin and vitamins and generally a whole host of general symptoms such as tiredness, hair loss, bone aches etc

Have a look at Coeliac UK website for more information.

Good luck getting an answer

coeliac.org.uk/home/