Need support for T3 only

[Way2tired]

Hello again. Much has changed since my last post and sadly not for the better. Just a reminder - I am 62; female; had Hashis for 27 years; on synthroid for 25 years with ongoing symptoms.

For most of last year I worked with Erfa, NDT, at different doses. No matter what I did I eventually went hyperthyroid - still with hypo symptoms but also with heart palpitations, agitation, even more sleep problems, hair loss, hoarse, etc. The doctor I am working with said she thought I might have thyroid "resistance" and that the T3 was likely pooling in my blood and she wondered about my cortisol/Adrenals. We decided to reduce the ERFA to 120 mcg late October in order to stabilize even tho we knew I would be hypo at that dose.

Late November I had the DUTCH test done. It showed:

low early cortisol at 9 (range 12-40);

low mid-day cortisol 57 (range 38 - 120);

high afternoon cortisol at 25 (range 7-21)

mid range late cortisol 5 (range 0-10). It also showed that I am a poor methylator.

My reverse T3 was mid range at 17 (range 9-24). my FT4 was low (13.7 range 10-25) as was my FT3 at 4.2 (range 3.5 to 6.5). Not surprisingly I felt pretty terrible. TPOs were 88 (range - normal less than 35) they have slowly been decreasing over past two years.

I spoke to Janie Bowthorpe just after Christmas, and she recommended I get off the sleeping pills I was taking (long history of insomnia) reduce the ERFA to 60 mcg (one grain) to reduce my T4 and clear some of the reverse T3, and then once two weeks clear of the sleeping pills start circadian T3 program with Holy Basil in the Afternoon and at night to reduce cortisol.

I have now been doing that for four weeks and I'm not feeling very well. Currently I take 20 mcg of T3 at 4:30 a.m.; 15 mcg at 10:00 and 15 mcg at 3:00. Not taking any Erfa ( for about a week now - I had been taking 60 Erfa in the afternoon but then switched to 15 mcg T3) as I had not been having a good response.

Resting pulse usually between 58 and 62. Body temp fluctuating -now sometimes get up to 37 degrees but mostly around 36.5 Blood pressure no higher than 101/67 and usually quite a bit lower (systolic usually around 92 and diastolic between 56 and 68)

My recent labs (I had taken my early morning T3 at 4:30 and the lab was done at 8:00) were FT3 7.5 (range 3.5-6.5) and the FT4 was 5.8 (range 20-25). My doc was not thrilled that the T3 was above range but I think it is still too low.

I had a paradoxical response to the Holy Basil as it made the chest tightness much worse so stopped that (I tend to have opposite reactions to quite a bit of stuff).

I am gluten free, egg free, very low dairy, caffeine free and do lots of supplements. Iron is all ok; B12 and Vit D good; going to get my glucose tolerance tested.

I have been reading Paul Robinson's books but still don't quite know what to do. Hoping to get connected to him on Facebook but that may take a bit as I don't have a Facebook page.

Still feeling VERY hypothyroid and can hardly get out of bed in the morning.

Wondering if my dosages are still too low ? Is the timing off? Any other suggestions to help with the Cortisol issues?

ANY ideas would be gratefully received.

Thanks!!!

Barb

[greygoose]

If you took your T3 at 4.30 am, and had the test at 8.00, then all you were testing there, was your last dose. It's a false high. You should leave 12 hours between your last dose and the test.

If you have hormone resistance, it might be a good idea to take your whole dose of T3 in one go, to flood the receptors. If you were hypo for a long time before diagnosis, a lot of your receptors will still be switched off. You need to flood them to switch them on again.

You have Hashi's, so have you tried a gluten-free diet? Do you take selenium to reduce antibodies?

Rather than trying to lower the night-time cortisol, you would be better off trying to raise the morning cortisol - then it would not get high in the evening. Do you have a high protein breakfast as soon as you rise? Adrenals need plenty of protein, vit C, B vits and don't skimp on the salt. Have you tried the adrenal cocktail?

Do you always take your thyroid hormone on an empty stomach, and hour before eating, and four hours away from vit D?

Other things will probably come to me, but that will do for starters.

[Jose651 in reply to greygoose]

Brilliant gg,

Clear and Concise,

J 👍🍀

[greygoose in reply to Jose651]

Thank you J.

[Way2tired in reply to greygoose]

Thanks Grey Goose for the thorough response!

I am gluten free; egg free; mostly dairy free

always take thyroid meds away from food and Vit D;

I take 200 selenium daily;

1500 mg Vit C daily;

5 mg 7-Keto DHEA

10 mg pregnenelone (it was below range when tested last Oct)

Bioidentical estrogen; 100 mg progesterone 6 days week as prescribed

good Vit B supplement with methyl B 12, methylfolate etc;

protein with every meal;

usually start day with close to 1/2 teaspoon Real Salt in water ( will start doing that daily) followed by cup of homemade chicken bone broth followed by veggie and protein stir/fry.

What is the adrenal cocktail ?

You are right, GG, and I usually do my lab tests leaving 12 hours after the last dose of thyroid meds. I took my early morning T3 this time as I wanted to see how high the T3 was getting after my biggest dose of the day. Pretty nervous about getting to hyperthyroid after my experiences as last year.

I have read about Paul's theory of flooding the receptors but just didn't know how high I should go in the T3. My doc has warned me about atrial fibrillation should the T3 get too high (tho at this point my pulse and BP are consistently pretty low.)

I am dosing all on my own as no one here (Calgary, Canada) seems to know much about the T3 only method.

Is 50 mcg of T3 at one time considered a high dose or do people often start there and then adjust?

I do have some Thorne Cortex I could take in the morning (long story there) but was thinking it might be too stimulating on top of the T3. Or should I get some Ashwaganda?

As you can probably here - pretty confused and a bit overwhelmed.

B.

[greygoose in reply to Way2tired]

The adrenal cocktail is half a tsp salt and half a tsp cream of tartar in a glass of orange juice. That gives you vit C, sodium and potassium all in one go.

You're taking a B complex, but have you had your B12 tested? If not, you won't know if you're getting enough B12. Normally, there is not enough B12 in a B complex to treat a real deficiency.

I cannot see the point of taking your T3 before the test to see what the result is. That's just a waste of a test. It's got nothing to do with 'going hyper', because it will only be in the blood for a short while. 'Going hyper' is when your serum level is high throughout the day, every day. Although, you can't actually 'go hyper' because you have Hashi's, and are hypo. The best way to see if you are over-medicated is to leave 12 hours between your last dose of T3 and the blood draw.

Your doctor is being silly. You won't be struck with AF the instant your FT3 goes over-range. AF is a risk if you are consistantly over-medicated during a long period of time. The 12+ weeks you need to be on a high dose of T3 to clear rT3 is not going to harm you. But, I wasn't even talking about that, I was talking about not splitting your dose of T3, but taking it all in one go. Splitting the dose doesn't give you enough T3 at any one time, to actually flood the receptors.

You would never start T3 at 50 mcg. You would start at something like 5/6 mcg and work up slowly until your symptoms are gone. Myself, at the moment, I take 100 mcg, all at the same time, but when I was clearing my rT3, I took as much as 225 mcg in one go, before bed, and slept like a log.

T3 is not stimulating. But ashwagandha, being an adaptogen, works better at lowering cortisol, than raising it. And it doesn't agree with everyone, so be careful if you decide to try it. Same goes for the Thorne Cortex. You could increase your dose of vit C. You can safely go up to 5000 mg - stomach permitting. I take 4000 mg.

Have you had your vit D, vit B12, folate and ferritin tested? If so, what were the results? Oh, and why are you egg-free? Are you allergic to them? There's a lot of good nourishment in eggs.

[Way2tired]

Thanks for all that. I get what you mean now about the labs and the T3. Doing another lab in about 4 weeks so will make sure I don't dose before.

And I will try the adrenal cocktail and up the Vit C.

Given that I tend to have weird reactions to many typical supplements, I have held off on most of the adaptogens and the Cortex. Maybe I should start with upping the T3 and see how it goes first?

I have had my B12 tested - it was in the middle of the range - around 800 (don't have my labs on hand as I am now at work). Also my iron tests were all well within range or at the higher end (folate; ferritin; saturation, etc) and my Vit D was around 90 which was good.

I do seem to have a sensitivity to eggs as my gut goes nuts if I eat them as a meal☹️. I don't do much baked goods so not an issue there.

I had no idea you could go that high with T3! And hadn't realized the importance of flooding with the high dose to start and to clear RT3 (thought cutting out the T4 would do that).

how did you figure out your dosing and what dose did you start at?

Again many thanks for taking the time to respond 😀