I have spent years studying psychopaths, sociopaths, and narcissists (Antisocial Personality Disorder) because my boss, his assistant, and a coworker are a mix of all three. My boss happens to be more than a little incompetent, which is supposedly typical of narcissistic sociopaths, but it was my over-the-top responses to things said and done that would get to me. I wondered why.
After dozens of books, many, many websites and Tubes, I decided I was maxed out on this bunny trail. Then the last Tube I was going to listen to described different types of narcs. One of the descriptions was of my mother (covert). How did I miss that for so long even as I was studying this stuff? Even after being diagnosed with CPTSD, I could not see how messed up things were in my childhood (The only thing that was normal about us was the setting on our clothes dryer that was seldom used). Eventually, I could clearly see strong narc traits in my father and his (also controlling, manipulative, & demanding) father.
The antisocially disordered have a self-centered drive to get all they obviously deserve and their lack of empathy makes hurting people a game. Their motives are too often well hidden under a veil of lies and half-truths.
The alcoholism, sexual abuse by neighbors, incest, and mental illness (unkempt home) going on around me while growing up kept me in therapy off and on for decades. But suddenly, this stuff seems laughable in comparison to the mind-twisting abuse of the narcs who were supposed to nurture and protect me.
It is time to put away childish things. I will start with the childish things my parents said, did, and taught me. All those lies. Then I will put away my childish responses, reactions, actions, attitudes, etc., and at 62, I will grow up. My wife, kids, and grandkids don’t deserve living with this junk anymore.
Uh. Suddenly I’m afraid to post this.
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Iamnothingandnoone
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Wow! Great post. Very inspirational. I can relate to much of what you said. I had a narcissistic childhood too, my father. Being over 50 myself now, I consider him a “recovering narc”. He has changed with age, and especially since my mum died. Or at least his outter behaviors have changed.
That’s great that you can be so mindful and realize what you don’t want to be, and/or cause for your family now. Love that you call those childish things. They can be so powerful in who we become. Thankfully, I was able to chose to leave all of that behind also.
Wondering what the thoughts were that made you “suddenly afraid to post” it? ...if you are comfortable to share. If not, that’s ok. I understand. Prayers and blessings for your road away from all narcissistic childhood things. 🍄 🌸 🌞
I am motivated by two conflicting desires: to be seen, heard, to connect - and to be left alone. It took hours to put that post together, and now I am spent.
How ironic that you responded first. I am planning (everything I do takes way too long) a post about the dissociative epileptic space adventures that have made much of my life experience a thick and murky brain fog - at least what I do remember of it. (And I have studied Japanese martial arts.)
Thank you for responding. I hear you, and I understand. I hear similarities just in your few words...I understand the depth of what “taking too long” means, what “spent” means, what “planning” means. It’s not just “regular person planning”. Lol. None of those words have the same meaning to people who don’t know what this looks like internally, behind the scenes.
Your first sentence hits it better than I have ever heard. It explains what I’ve witnessed my dad struggle with for my whole life...even now, behind the scenes. I know he still gets consumed by it. But he has figured out how to control most of the outward parts of it. And has chosen to enjoy all of us, and be less hard on himself because he has become very ill, and cannot get around much any more. And without my mom here, he has nobody left to verbally put through his never ending ringer.
We have always lived just a few houses away, or right down the road. We’ve both have relocated to live close together. He and I have never discussed any of this. Years ago, I mention a few things, and left that door open for him if he wants to. But that is not likely to happen. How helpful would it have been to better understand his internal conflict all those years ago in my childhood...
For my dad (and the old me), the lists and lists and re-list making of planning, and the consistent paralysis of being cursed with hidden indecisiveness. All = internal exhaustion and nothing to really show for it, in terms of getting things done.
For my dad, I’m not sure if it is wanting to be heard...bc he really just wants to be listened to. My dad is very much the later. He gets offended if we do not take his advice, or don’t do like he thinks, or even buy the same type of grocery items. What? So irrational. But so true.
He’s learned to deal with it bc none of us can do that. Even if it causes problems in his world. That has softened over the years, due to our overall “non-compliance.” For his kids, and grandkids, anyway. It didn’t for my mum. Years ago I recall him not speaking bc we wouldn’t change to the same specialty tooth-paste that he found. Really. It was a problem.
Now talking about “old” me —->
The brain switch from wanting to be heard by my family, and then wanting to be left alone. But expecting them to listen to what I said bc it would blow everything up if they didn’t, etc. It would cause me “planning” problems that would have to be reworked, right?
My need to be in control of everything for my then very young family was huge. There was a cycle, including an uncontrollable, steam-shooting out of the top of my head kind of explosion, in between. Didn’t last long for me. For my dad....it would last days and weeks from one episode.
I later learned this is the only way I could transition, and get people to really hear me, and of course leave me alone somewhat. They had no idea that was what I needed that to help myself, regroup, and to help them.
About 20+ years now have passed, since I had to make a decision, a fork in the road. Either be like him, and lose the most valuable parts of my own young family (their hearts, respect, and friendship), or to stop it all cold turkey, and immediately. So I did.
No more lists for me. Not for 20+ years. Look, I’m successful, and not falling apart. Lol. Maybe one for the day, with no details. That’s it. If it’s important it will get done. I’m allergic to lists, they don’t work for me. It goes against every fiber in my being...but it’s what I choose daily.
Controlling is long gone. I really didn’t want to control anybody, or anything anyway. I just didn't know how to incorporate all of the unknowns into what I had in my mind. My dad taught me valuable lessons, one of the most important was what I didn’t want to be. So, I changed it.
You are brave to question, and go against your fibers. And it sounds like you’re not too late, as far as your family goes. So double bonus there. My dad has said the one thing he regrets is how “ugly” he was to my mom. That’s sad to me, bc now he can’t “fix” it, or take it back with her in person.
You are the only one who knows your situation, and no matter who, or how many respond, your posts help many other people see things in themselves as well. As far as people responding, take what applies, and leave the rest.
I haven’t been on this site long, but have found it a great place for self-improvement, to “anonymously” explore, and work things out with myself. Try to respond to others’ posts whenever you recognize something familiar. Amazing what I have realized with myself by responding to another. That was kinda scary to me at first. That’s how this all seems to work. Keep posting, even if they must be thoroughly planned out. It’s worth it...
Wondering if you “believe” in therapy (CBT)? My dad has never believed, and bad-mouths any form of it, and always has. Lol. 🍄 🌸 🌞
Seems people who need counseling the most are the least likely to get it or benefit from it. They are afraid of it. And for good reason. It takes courage and work to face yourself, as you have, and change.
On a side note, some people go into the helping professions because they don’t like people and want to “fix” them, not help them.
True. I agree with all you said. Truth is nobody can”fix” anybody. All professionals can do is help you to get out of your own way. That was my problem, and that’s how it helped me. I had to do the fixing part, but it was great having somebody there to force me to be accountable, know what to do next, and help me listen to what my own-self was telling me I needed to do to get “fixed”.
Over the years, I have been able to benefit from many “spurts” of great counseling; and spent great efforts to chose professionals that I thought my family could benefit from. I’ve also run into my share of quack-heads. Said no thank you, this isn’t what I need...and kept looking for the right fit.
I also discovered that facing myself wasn’t nearly as bad as I had thought it was going to be. Possibly bc I already knew what the alternative looked like—-and that would have been way worse on me, and everybody I loved.
Truth is the truth...even if it isn’t acknowledged by us—it’s still there. Hiding it won’t work, and is a joke. Shining a light on it, our own light...at our own speed, and a soft light at first, is scary and complicated, but it can be done. Any hard work to get to our authentic self is worth it. 🍄 🌞 🌸
Getting to my authentic self didn’t work out so well for me. Turns out my inner child is a selfish, stubborn, and rebellious brat!
I’ve recently adapted something I saw on the Tube. When thinking through an emotional issue, I imagine sitting in a chair with my parents standing close together to one side behind me. When needed one or the other and sometimes both would give advice, encouragement, etc. Of course, I “hear” them talking in the voices I am familiar with, but the words and tone are that of what I needed to hear while growing up. This works for present situations as well.
I have a sense that this can give the brat I have become the stability and calm he needs to relax a bit and start to trust me in the situations I put us in.
However, while my inner child is selfish, stubborn, and rebellious, his adult is chronically dissociated and distracted. I cannot benefit from this technique if I never use it. You’ve maybe heard the lament of the Attention Deficit Disordered: “How do I remember to take the pill that helps me remember to take my pill?” What brain do I think clearly with to stop being distracted and dissociated if the only brain I’ve ever had has always been distracted and dissociated?
Ya know, it is a good thing I write, copy and paste these posts in my phone. I could use this stuff at therapy to remember the big stuff that came up during the week instead of sitting on my hands attempting to remember...? That is such a good idea, Ninja! I’m glad you thought of it!😲
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Not a good day or night 😢
Its been a battle but i have done it !!!!
