Pip: So I sent my pip form off and got... - Fibromyalgia Acti...

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Pip

So I sent my pip form off and got a face to face assessment, I’ve got declined pip an achieved 0 points as the lady basically called me a liar as I looked fine on the day , I explained I was having a good day with my Fibro but she ignored this completely ! she asked how I got to the assessment centre an I said my dad but she concluded on the paper work that I can plan and make journeys on my own ! She said I made good eye contact when I didn’t as I was so nervous ! She said I can prepare meals myself as I got my bank card out my purse with no difficulties . She basically lied about the whole thing

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Ask for an MR, and prepare for an appeal. Start by keeping a diary of EVERYTHING you do, every time you have to stop because of pain or exhaustion, every time you need somebody else to help you finish, complete or continue a task.

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Thank you xx

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I called today for a mr , if they say no again, any idea how long it takes for tribunal? X

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I believe they say within 6 months, but I am not sure.

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I'm in Derbyshire I've been waiting 20 weeks for my appeal tribunal services have told me I'm only half way with another 26 weeks to go yet !!!

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Hi Anna , I was refused pip so sent in MR I was then declined so appealed to the tribunal , it took from January 2019 to August 2019 that I heard back and was awarded the daily living component , when appealing go through everything you can’t do on a bad day and say why , forward copies of any hospital or doctors diagnosis, I would also ask a family member to write a letter and outline how your disability hinders you daily ,

Good Luck with it all , it is stressful but worth it in the long run if you win x

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Hey Angelic, congrats on your award! I’ve also been successful via appeal. Have DWP responded to it yet? Mine was exactly the same wait - Jan to August!x

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Yes I am now in receipt of pip , give them a call and ask for an update , tell them you have received your tribunal letter , fingers crossed you hear soon x

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Remember all the documentation for your PIP assessment will be available to the MR and tribunal hearing who are and will only be interested in how you cope manage the PIP descriptors. They will not be interested or take Ito account a worsening of your health conditions.

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Hello, when applying for or appealing your PIP award do not describe your worst day or days. PIP is based on the majority of days most days not when I have a bad day. Your diagnosis, hospital reports will hopefully have been sent in with your pIP application form and I hope you have copies. The MR or tribunal hearing are only interested in how you cope manage the descriptors in your daily living activities. Moaning, stating comments or remarks made by the HP at your assessment will not be of any interest to the tribunal members or any worsening of your conditions.

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😴

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Hello if you apply for a MR and no change the next step is a tribunal hearing which I am sorry to say is 12 months waiting time and longer in most cases. When preparing for your MR or tribunal remain focused on the PIP descriptors you are contesting and send in several examples of what happened or happens when you try or attempt to the descriptor you are contesting. On no account mention lies or false statements made in your report or assessment as the MR and tribunal are not and will not be interested in these views or your comments.

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That's not true the tribunal will certainly be interested in the medical report and the medical report will be one of the main challenges as the decision is made on the medical report most of the time by the dwp and always complain if medical report is not true and has lots of discrepancies also if it is a rieview and you have no change from last award and medical report is different and you lose or get a reward reduced the tribunal will certainly look at the medical reports.p.s everyonecshoukd get a copy of their medical reports every time esa and pip and if the report is very supportive use that as evidence on any future riviews

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If you put on your MR and tribunal appeal that the assessor said this or that, she , he lied on what I said, didn’t write down this or that. The tribunal will not be interested in the here say of your assessment but the fact of if you can or cannot full fill criteria of the PIP descriptors in your ability to preform them in a safe, repeatable and timely manner, any worsening in your conditions since your original assessment will not be taken into account either .

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That's the point if you cannot do this or that and get help etc and cannot walk 50 metres .then the assessors says you can walk 200 metres and do not get help that is the dwp case and you try cut it to ribbons with the truth to win your appeal .but hey we all have different opinouns

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I am not cutting ribbons, just telling the truth as we at another national charity forum posters know as Disability Game Changers have came to understand how PIP, ESA and other benefits work on appeals and tribunal hearings.

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It is the way the sentence is not you cutting ribbons everyone who has a false report .if my report was left out on my grounds on my they would not represent me

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FRreedman sorry to be a numpty but what does MR mean ?

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That's okay. Mandatory Reconsideration. Basically they just go over what was put down originally, and are supposed to look again to see if there are any points that have been missed. 99 times out of 100, they don't, they appear to just rubber stamp the original decision, which is why we advise appeal to the Tribunal, which has a massive success rate (Ajay probably knows the exact figures better than I do.)

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I ha ha 😊it is now at over 73 % win appeals ESA and PIP 63 % DLA would be higher if claimants went through with appeal who have dropped out for some reason .the MR as it stands the now is over 70% lose MR would be higher if claimants did not take the lower offer .the MR is now not fit for purpose and as thought by senior advisers in this area it is a hurdle in the way to stop appeals

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Hi I would try and get advice and put your mr in writing and all the reasons etc and make a complaint if the report is not true. Your appeal and mr can only be wots on forms and wot you have sent in or any new evidence etc .the mr can take anything from 3 to 8 weeks and appeal 3 to 10 months depending g on area .do make a complaint and try get help with this

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Thank you ! I have already made a mr over the phone today but I may send in a note from my doctor too to support my claim x

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The mr etc you can still do it in writing if you want if you can get help on this as you could have over 15 points at least to raise etc .over the phone you do not know wot they write and cannot trust them

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So shall I still write my own an send it off anyway then x

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Yeh if you cannot get help write in .there are 12 questions example question 1 say b.c.and .d applys to you you put that in writing etc and why so if 8 questions apply to you and say 2 on each question that will be 16 points for you to raise all separate plus raise wot you send in as evidence and raise all the errors on report it is a lot to raise and I'm sure it would not have been recorded on the phone.p.s mind think of appeal all this will be taken into consideration at appeal .

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Thank you ! I love the support on here x

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Hi Anna, do not just do MR over the phone but pick your report to pieces and write on every single thing that you do not agree with; I wrote 26 pages altogether (took me some weeks as very bad swoolen and painful fingers) most get turned down at MR so be prepared to go to tribunal and all that you have written can be used at tribunal, good luck x You have 28 days from date of decision letter to send in your MR ; such a pity you have done it on phone because you could have got an extra 28 days if you had left it until the 28 days were nearly up x

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And if they uphold the original zero points, as they did with my son - request a tribunal hearing. It is a long wait (You can ask where has the shortest wait is nearest you when you get your letter from the tribunal service) but well worth it. They will back date it for a certain amount of weeks. Good luck 😊

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Appeal Appeal Appeal!! Absolutely awful x

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And go to see citizens advice. And photocopy every piece Of evidence you have. X

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Thanks so much! Really appreciate it xx

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Hi, cab, welfare rights or similar organisations can often help with submitting your MR /appealing and some will attend the appeal with you if it comes to that.

If you drop an email to head.office @ fmauk.org (without the spaces) I can email some guidelines on appealing.

I recently used an online link to write my husbands - i can see if I can find it again.

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This was the link we used

advicenow.org.uk/pip-tool

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Thanks so so much xxx

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Be wary of usig CAB as they are under the DWP's thumb and have heard really bad reports about them.

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I second that. I was given wrong advice by CAB regarding PIP. I would not recommend them for this type of form.

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She did not lie. She is working to laid down criteria. You need to find your local charity who give benefit advice. You need to have them explain how the point system works. And then write a letter of appeal explaining why you are deserving of points.

You need help from those who know case law.

I got zero points in my PIP assessment as well. I am now waiting for tribunal date.

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How can you say she did not lie it certainly looks like it and it happens alot

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I know it happens a lot. You say in reason for appeal: "she failed to record this and she failed to record that." She had no stop watch to time how long I took to do an action.

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She did lie! there’s following guidelines that saying the complete opposite to what actually happened /: I feel bad for people who are even worse off than myself . It’s such a stressful process

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It is a very stressful process. You have one criteria and they have another. You say in reason for appeal: "she failed to record this and she failed to record that." She had no stop watch to time how long I took to do an action.

Lying is one person's word against another. It does not go very far if at all at a tribunal. You need representation and you need to present sound reasons why the assessment was wrong. At the mandatory re-assessment they will ignore your sound reasons. At the tribunal you need to present yourself as a reasonable person.

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Thank you !

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My assessor absolutely did lie - regardless of them following different criteria. She wrote the opposite of what I said throughout most of it - my partner was with me & witnessed it all. According to her report I was all singing & dancing - for example she claimed no breathing difficulties when the day before my inhaler was increased (doubled) in dose due to worsening breathing difficulties..! Also had a consultant assessment where lots of my movement around arms & neck etc was recorded at no higher than 70% - which she recorded was 100% movement a day later- such a shame I didn’t feel this miraculous recovery.. She claimed no signs of anxiety despite several times stopping to check I was ok as she noticed & commented on the fact that I was sweating, trembling, becoming increasingly panicked etc. - she actually then stated in report - ‘no signs of anxiety - did not appear to be sweating, agitated, trembling’ etc. So a total lie to what actually happened. The list honestly goes on but it was In October so I can’t remember any more finer details. I’ve backed up each of her ‘mistakes’ with sound arguments relative to the criteria, but to say they don’t lie is frustrating when that’s what happened! 0 points awarded - same at MR. They are also disputing my appeal. All decisions fully relying on her report.

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As you were not at the assessment how can you make this statement ? They lie to make you fit the criteria. Thats a fact

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What are the meaning of words? Different peer groups determine what words mean. There is also the issue of two different people looking at different subtleties.

The assessor is looking at best performance as an indicator as to lower point scoring. The assessored is looking at their difficulty at doing a request. The two give different recorded results.

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What do you mean she did not lie ? my assessor lied about everythng.

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Appeal. The person assessing only has to be a “health care professional” That’s not the same as a doctor so you could end up with a nurse or physio. Each professional in their own right but they may not have expertise in your condition. Also the system has been set up to be a tick box process. There’s little room for qualitative information rather than yes/no answers. Lots of people assessed are set up to fail before they even get to a face to face assessment.

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The PIP ascessment is not about your illnesses, disability or diagnosis, its about your ability to preform the PIP descriptiors in a safe, repeatable and timely manner, the HP who does the assessment dose not need specific training about your illnesses but will have enough knowledge and experience to know what symptoms and difficulties each and every claiment is likely to have that will impact on their abilities to preform the descriptiors.

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The problem is they dont have any knowledge of specific illnesses / disabilities. Thats why assessments are a farce

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Why would and should they they ate not there to diagnosis your illnesses or give a prescription, no they are there to access your abilities in relation to the PIP descriptiors, the fact that you we or I have a illness or disability the acessor has enough knowledge to know what your mine illnesses, disability has on our ability to to preform the PIP descriptiors in a safley repearable and timely manner, they the acessor knows more about our disability and illnesses than you and I. I'm not a car mechanic yet I know what they're talking about form my personal knowledge and experience.

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That's not true there are many assessors some are good lots are not .there is also nurses and ot and physio s and pt and if you have multi and complex issiues some assessors are not an expert in some issues specially mental health and fnd and autoimmune disease etc

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Yes I fully agree on the me tel health issues a very complex health issue, but the PIP ascessment is not about your illnesses disability diagnosis or mental health. When you we and I filled in our PIP application form we where asked questions in relation to the PIP descriptiors of why we can't preform each task, activity the descriptiors. The acessor at the F2F ascessment checked your written answers, with questions to asatain that your answers submitted are in line with what is, could be excepted of someone with your, illness, diagnosis or disability. Mental health is the new health problem for the UK, I can't cope, stress, worry, bereavement, dedt problems relationships, marriage, work where does it end.

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Mental health severe depression severe anxiety disorder autism etc the list goes on .example needs prompting on nearly every question because of their severe depression etc (gets you 2 points on each question if that applys )so it does come into it diagnosis .so no I still disagree with you we all have diff views .wots the point off putting any diagnossis then if that was the case .some do not get a face to face when there is not enough evidence or them not reading or and discrepancies then a f2f comes along lots do not get a f2f or should not .

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You must be having a joke here mate ???? saying that the assessors know more about our conditions than us ; mine knew sweet f...all about any of my 10 plus life changing severly painful conditions that keep me housbound and isolated from society; you are def working for the DWP.

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Sorry you got refused PIP, when you put in for your MR do not or make any accusations about the assessor, the MR or if you continue on to a tribunal hearing will not and are not interested in your personal assessment details. Firstly when preparing your MR concentrate on how your conditions effect you in your daily living activities in relation to the PIP descriptors giving examples of the difficulty you experience when you try, do or attempt to preform the individual PIP descriptor you are describing for your MR application.

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I totally disagree ; I said the assessor lied about everything and wrote 26 pages (over several weeks ) to go with my MR . They lied and should not get away with it; they are doing this th a lot of people and it is up to us all to say it like it is.

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The PIP ascessment is not about your illnesses, disability or diagnosis, its about your ability to preform the PIP descriptiors in a safe, repeatable and timely manner, the HP who does the assessment dose not need specific training about your illnesses but will have enough knowledge and experience to know what symptoms and difficulties each and every claiment is likely to have that will impact on their abilities to preform the descriptiors

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I know all this; your reply has nothing to do with what I replied about the assessor lying; it it up to all of us really ill people to call them out on their lies or nothing will ever change. And most of the assessors no NOTHING about our illnesses; do you work for the DWP ?

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No I don’t work for the DWP, not knowing your actual concerns referring to the inaccuracies in your report of your assessment. May I recommend that you take your complaint up with the assessment company as I am sure they may be interested in your concerns, but be warned very few people get a positive outcome to their complaints.

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Yes I already have complained to asos and also complained to the NMC and the assessor I had should be dismissed and I will not rest until he is; and I would like to add I have had a positive outcome to all my complaints but it does not stop here for me as I will fight on for everyone else against the blatant lies they tell making us even more unwell because of the stress they make us suffer when we are already dealing with soooooooo much ill health.

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makes me wonder if farmerboy is an assessor

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Yes VERY FISHY; and I suspect he/she is not here to help us.

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Always make a complaint about the assessor it is to help stop this the more the merrier specially if there is fabrication etc .more people are now getting compensation etc and also refuse a second assessment from that assessors company and there has been cases at MR where an award has been issued because of this and the assessor cannot keep getting complaints against them there are so many complaints now so always make a complaint if there is errors or fabrication in report .there has just been a case where a nurse and doctor got assessed and they complained and actually did say they lied on report they got compensation and an award and no reassessments

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Hi, I’ve been through this too. I’m currently awaiting appeal with my 18 year old sons pip. Been waiting over a year, I’m told it depends where you live, as to how long waiting time is. He was awarded 0 points even though he had been receiving DLA for many years. His problems are far worse now and 0 points. so unfair.

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I had my face to face last week and I'm awaiting a decision. The lady I saw was really nice and understanding but it's very hard to judge it in that environment as there face can be saying one thing and fingers typing another. I have severe anxiety depression and PTSD alongside my fibro and was an absolute mess on the day! The advice given above sounds spot on always appeal it's just sad that even in this modern day fibromyalgia is still not recognized by some as the debilitating condition that it is 😞 good luck x

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It’s happening quite a lot, I’m sure they must pick names out of a hat or something. They do, the exact same thing happened to me last November/ December. I knew it was a load of cr*p because even before I had fibro I had/have mental health problems that previously I’d been scored 11. Appeal it! Citizens advice can help with the process

Edited by admin

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Same scenario as mine im afraid, go to mandatory reconsideration, if the same then to tribuneral. The tribuneral is the only way to get justice but it s a long wait. I have fibro arthritis depression/ anx and diabeties . Got 0 points as well at tribuneral I got 16 points.

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I'm in Derbyshire I've been waiting 20 weeks for my appeal tribunal services have told me I'm only half way with another 26 weeks to go yet !!!

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Unfortunately there have been many assessments made where PIP has been refused only to be overturned on appeal. Something that costs money that could be better used to get it right first time. Yes there will be people who try to cheat the system. They are a very small percentage of the claimants. Nobody wants to claim PIP because in reality that means they have a disability. I’m sure we would all prefer to be contributing able bodied people. I have CRPS and have had issues with it being understood by doctors as to how it affects me on a daily basis so what chance do I have with a face to face assessment? We have to become our own experts and learn the language they use to describe descriptors so that we stand a chance of being understood. It may be nuances or semantics but that is probably a bigger issue in the assessment process than people think. Unfortunately the assessment centres also are contracted to the government and not controlled by it. There’s too many management levels. The assessment centres are under pressure to get the job done quickly. Mistakes will be made.

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This MR is another hurdle to drop appeal and a hit on the disabled over 73 % win appeal would be higher as this does not count how many drop appeals and get some lower awards at mr (21%)

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please don`t give up hope, i was awarded 0 points for following a route etc, my husband who is my appointee put in for a mr over the phone, followed up by a letter and i was then awarded 10 points for the same descriptor, i know i was a lucky one so i feel for the rest of you and wish you hope

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Sorry to hear that. It is so infuriating when that happens. I had a similar thing for ESA, so have an idea how you must feel.

I hope you are going to appeal the decision and best of luck.

Ax

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That's exactly what happened to me, only difference was I had a home assessment (I didn't ask for one but was given one anyway). I explained I was having a good day. I was dressed in pull on joggers and t-shirt, the report said I had no difficulty dressing because I looked neat and tidy (not sure how I was supposed to look?...), my daughter makes and freezes meals for me because I can't prepare a meal, but the report said I had no problem making a meal. I was asked to stand on one leg, which I managed briefly when holding onto the windowsill. The report said I did it unaided! It was full of lies! Because I could do certain things on that day, they've ignored the fact that I can't do it repeatedly and safely, even though I explained this to her many times! That the week before I couldn't walk to my bathroom without stopping to rest! I've requested a mandatory reconsideration but I'm not holding out much hope for it. They stick together and won't like to admit their assessors lie through their teeth!

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Hey, people have pushed and pushed me the last 12 months to apply for pip and this is the reason why I haven’t. I’ve heard that they make you feel like a liar and worthless. People don’t understand that we’re living with an invisible illness, yeah we have good days and days. Days and we can’t get out of bed and dahs where we can shower, a bit of make up and maybe even be able to do our hair, but inside it’s not the same story. This is what makes me confused and angry about the whole thing. I really hope you appeal everything and get what you deserve x

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Appeal you have to ring pip and ask to appeal they do lie they lied about me I've been disabled for 23 years and the assessor said in 18 months I would be fit and well lol he must know of a wonderful cure for osteo arthritis and severe depression ect that my own doctors don't know about x good luck and

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I’m so so sorry that you had a bad assessment outcome, the horror stories some people face on here is terrible. I received today my answer and I got enhanced on both thank god. The lady I had was lovely and seemed to really care and was quick from applying in may. It seems to be a bit like a driving test to me...so many fails and a few passes a day etc . Please don’t give up ...keep fighting Sending gentle hugs your way xxxx

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