Oxidative Stress (ROS), Sleep and the... - Advanced Prostate...

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Oxidative Stress (ROS), Sleep and the Gut Microbiome: Staying Alive

MateoBeach profile image
20 Replies

 I am just back from a challenging (humbling) multiday backpack in the High Sierras of California. Very beautiful but drought conditions, dry stream water sources made it more difficult. 

Here is a pre-note on my own regimen: After completing my two phase radiation treatments for oligometastatic PC: SBRT in April, followed a month later with two doses of Lu-PSMA-J591 radioligand treatments in May. Now, six weeks out from that, I am going on a 3-day Senolytic regimen. This is hopefully to "clear" treatment emergent senolytic cancer cells. These may make trouble down the line as "Senescence Associated Secretory Phenotypes", SASPs. My chosen senolytic regimen is Dasatinib 100mg, plus Quercetin 1600 mg, plus Fisetin 1000 mg daily for just three days.

 On the long drive back to Oregon, I had downloaded a new and very good science podcast called "The Joy of Why" by Quanta online magazine. Every episode was excellent. One that especially engaged me was about why we (and every animal species) die if sufficiently sleep deprived. One experiment deprived fruit flies of sleep until they died. The normal controls lived 40 days average. Sleep deprived fruit flies started dying at 10 days and the average survival was just 20 days.

Then they did full microscopic autopsies on the dead flies and found that the major injury and cause of death was in the gut. Their stomach and intestines had severe injury from reactive oxygen species (ROS) causing widespread cellular injury, inflammation and death. In subsequent experiments they gave antioxidants (unspecified in the interview) to the flies being sleep deprived. This restored normal lifespan protecting them from the oxidative stress of sleep deprivation. How amazing.

It got me thinking about the role of excess ROS stress damaging our healthy cells as part of aging. And many other causes besides sleep loss. As many here are well aware, ROS play an important role also in the mechanisms of killing cancer cells in the through the of action of treatments such as radiation and chemotherapy. So we generally do not use anti-oxidants while actively undergoing these treatments. Not important with hormonal treatments such as ADT. We do not want to let ROS run rampant in our bodies causing cellular degradation and destruction when we are not actively on those cytoxic treatments. 

What is the role of the gut microbiome (the types and activities of the various stomach and intestinal bacteria) in protecting against ROS? What probiotics are most helpful. Pro-biotics are the actual living bacteria that can form new colonies by the billions (CFU or colony forming units). And which prebiotics are most beneficial? Pre-biotics being nutritional supports to feed the most beneficial gut bacteria. And most mysteriously, what is the relationship to good sleep?I

I remembered great posts from our esteemed pjoshea13 on the gut bacterium called Akkermansia municiphila (A.mun). (Thank you Patrick.) This is a very favorable sub-population that is actually a marker of good microbiome health. It is associated with thicker intestinal mucin layer, protects against abnormal gut permeability, and is anti-inflammatory. Low counts of A.mun are associated with metabolic syndrome, obesity and type II diabetes. It seems a very good thing. However, there is curently only one probiotic product on the market that specifically provides high levels (CFUs) of A.mun. That is from Pendulum and is rather expensive, $115 for single month or $74 on subscription. 

However, it turns out that you don't have to actually take A.mun as a probiotic to substantially increase their levels in the gut. Probiotics containing Lactobacilus rhamnosus, and most especially Bifidobacterium lactis (animalis, subspecies lactis) also strongly support building high A.mun counts, just as well as actually taking the A.mun product. These are much more common in good probiotics. Read the labels. 

As for prebiotic support. By far the most effective dietary support for the favorable gut microbiome, including A.mun, is called FOS, fructo-oligosacharides. These are small polymer chains of fructose. But the bonds cannot be broken down by our human digestion. So we don't have to worry about the excess fructose. Rather, the bacteria ferment them for food. The most inexpensive and widely available form of FOS is inulin (not insulin!) that is derived from Chicory root fiber which is almost all inulin. There are some shorter chain FOS that might have advantages over the somewhat longer chain inulin, but these are harder to find. 

Another interesting fact is that our old pal, Metformin, also strongly increases A.mun populations. And perhaps might mediate some of Metformin's beneficial effects on metabolism, glucose, insulin sensitivity and improving lipopolysaccharides. Rhubarb extract containing anthraquinones is another agent that increases A.mun.

The oral antibiotic Vancomycin also seems to preferentially favor A.mun whereas doxycycline is detrimental and degradess the microbiome even in low doses. We certainly don't want to take Vancomycin for this purpose due to emerging resistance of C. dificil and also renal toxicity.

A High Fat Diet is detrimental to the A.mun population. -Problematic for me on my ketogenic cycles. Also alcohol is detrimental to the gut microbiome. 

Finally, I want to mention anti-oxidants that may be helpful. And I am not talking about the much studied and sometimes problematic Vitamins C, E and selenium. Rather, I am more interested in alpha-Lipoic Acid, a widely occuring natural substance called "the master antioxidant. It is widely distributed intracellularly to protect against ROS from mitochondrial "leakage". It restores Vitamin C activity, increases glutathione and SOD levels. I include it as part of my own supplement regimen, just hoping it does me some good. Poorly absorbed antioxidant phytochemicals such as Resveratrol, might be providing good gut antioxidants even though their absorption and bioavailability is notoriously low. I note that Melatonin also is aneffective antioxidant as well as being a regulator of circadian rhythms and sleep. Perhaps that is part of the complex interactions between sleep and oxidative stress recovery?   -Paul

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/304...

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MateoBeach
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20 Replies
Seasid profile image
Seasid

I don't drink alcohol, don't smoke and stopped drinking coffee (i still drink hot chocolate) just to sleep better. I have a sleep apnea, had an overnight sleep study in a hospital and using ResMed CPAP machine. I also believe that the bright light kills melatonin and that is an powerful natural antioxidant. The best would be to sleep when it is dark and during the day to enjoy the sunshine in order to get serotonin production. Professor Epstein didn't recommend taking vitamin d supplements only exposure to the sunshine. I also believe that we should maximize our melatonin production and avoid bright light in our toilet. I keep my room dark, only natural light is allowed. (Of course you need some light with the dimmer occasionally.) I sleep ok now. Sleep is very important. I agree, but I would avoid paying for the supplements.

KocoPr profile image
KocoPr

Thanks for the info on gut health. I new some of this and it is always good to have refreshers. You can also get inulin from sun choke roots which can be bought at dome grocery stores. Burdock root is also high in inilin and also can be found in grocery stores.

MateoBeach profile image
MateoBeach

Cool! Thank you.

spw1 profile image
spw1

Thank you for a very interesting post. Will look out for the Joy of Why podcast too.

Mischa1111111 profile image
Mischa1111111

Thanks for the mechanics of the the gut.

d3is4me profile image
d3is4me

Thank you very interesting information

Captain_Dave profile image
Captain_Dave

I have taken a probiotic called Elixa. They have a website by that name. They are a little pricey, but not bad. The good thing is you don't take all the time, just a cycle here and there. I have read up on them and I am impressed, but I am no expert. Just thought that I would toss my suggestion out there.

MateoBeach profile image
MateoBeach in reply toCaptain_Dave

Checked out Elixa and looks good to me. Will give it a try. Thanks.

jdm3 profile image
jdm3

Great post. Thanks for the information!

Cooolone profile image
Cooolone

Interesting dive into the gut microbiome... Thanks for posting.

Blueslover profile image
Blueslover

Gut microbiome information gets more interesting year by year. Thank you for the very interesting information Paul.

monte1111 profile image
monte1111

LOL

j-o-h-n profile image
j-o-h-n

Thank you!!! I showed it to my wife and she said "I don't care what it said, no way will I increase your daily two scoops of chocolate chip ice cream"...... (mean machine)......

Good Luck, Good Health and Good Humor.

j-o-h-n Saturday 07/16/2022 4:46 PM DST

monte1111 profile image
monte1111

Thanks for reminding me about the probiotic I have in the fridge. I'm not a yogurt person. I do have Alpha Lipoic Acid but can't remember why I got it. Probably thinking it might help neuropathy. (I bought a foot massager and now have a beautiful ganglion cyst.) So happy you are able to do some backpacking. My camping days on on hold. They call me Motel Monte now. Doing some day camping next weekend, but way below the tree line. Sounds like you are on top of everything. Thanks for all the great info you share.

Spyder54 profile image
Spyder54

Paul, thanks. How do we test for A.mun & FOS?I had always read that yogurt has cultures of good bacteria.

Lot of trendy advertising all over the Net on GutBiome.

Dr Gundry and other marketeers cannot stop talking about Gut Biome. Crazy. Mike

Nous profile image
Nous

really appreciate you sharing this MateoBeach ... thanks and best wishes ... Nous :)

Purple-Bike profile image
Purple-Bike

This is much food for thought, Paul. I am doing pro- and prebiotics but have never studied them thoroughly and your post propels me to take action.

May I ask, what brand of Fisetin have you arrived at and are you taking it with some substance to improve its poor absorption? Brands which apparently are better in this regard have very low dosage.

jdm3 profile image
jdm3

I have been looking into this a little lately - not nearly the deep dive you have taken - but I had a consult with a naturopathic physician about gut health a couple months ago. Not surprisingly, she did not have much to add that is not already provided by the crowdsourcing and braintrust of HealthUnlocked. But, for what it's worth, she did suggest a pre-biotic called FiberMend (Thorne Research) that contains arabinogalactan from larch instead of inulin. I googled inulin vs. arabinogalactan and found this..."Arabinogalactan is an efficient prebiotic – it feeds good bacteria, especially Bifidobacteria, helping them thrive. Unlike inulin, it does NOT feed Clostridia, E. coli, or Klebsiella organisms, nor does it cause gas or abdominal discomfort."

drnealsmoller.com/blog/preb....

All of this is beyond my pay grade, but I completely agree that a healthy gut microbiome is very important to good health and fighting PCa.

rocket09 profile image
rocket09

Eating apples, berries and veggies are really good prebiotics to increase good gut health .

Scout4answers profile image
Scout4answers

Another great post Paul.Love the way you think through these ideas and come up with actionable plans.

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