More on Vitamin D: relationship to microbiome

[noahware]

Some evidence here that the "usefulness" of supplements may be partly (highly?) dependent on gut biome, and thus on the nature of one's diet and other factors that influence microbial diversity:

"... men with the highest compared to lowest 1,25(OH)2D and activation ratios are more likely to possess butyrate-producing bacteria that are associated with favorable gut microbial health. These results support the underlying hypothesis that the human gut microbiome and vitamin D metabolism are integrally related."

"... while sun exposure may affect the storage form of vitamin D, there appears to be less influence on the active hormone."

"The positive association between diversity metrics and vitamin D activation and catabolism ratios suggests that physiologically normal vitamin D flux is more likely to occur in individuals with healthy microbiomes."

So this study seems to help confirm the common-sense notion that just adding pills to a crap diet may not be all that helpful, and suggests that better biomes not only allow for productive use of stored vitamin D but might help prevent toxicity associated with supplementation! One more reason to eat a heart-healthy, whole-food diet that's plentiful in fiber-rich plant foods.

It also partly helps explain why some vitamin D studies might not show the level of benefit that researchers were expecting or hoping for.

nature.com/articles/s41467-...

From an interview regarding the study:

“We were surprised to find that microbiome diversity — the variety of bacteria types in a person’s gut — was closely associated with active vitamin D but not the precursor form,” says senior author of the study Dr. Deborah Kado.

The correlation between microbial diversity and active vitamin D remained even after adjusting for factors known to determine microbial diversity. These included the participants’ age, where in the United States they lived, their ethnic background, and their antibiotic use. In fact, the participants’ levels of active vitamin D correlated much more strongly with microbiome diversity than any of these other factors (i.e., people who live in sunnier places).

[LearnAll]

Vitamin D level is the number 1 protective factor in cases of Covid19. A study published on Sept03,2020 in Journal of steroid biochemistry and molecular biology concluded that high Vit D level reduces risk of ICU admission by 97% (yes a whopping 97%) in Covid19 patients.The level should be kept above 50 .

[noahware in reply to LearnAll]

Agreed. I think what this study is suggesting is, don't depend on high measured levels alone to see the greatest benefit. Best benefit is with high enough levels PLUS healthy gut biome.

[treedown in reply to noahware]

Good to know gut microbiome has been and will continue to be my focus for better or worse.

[Magnus1964]

I was told by a doctor to take a vitamin D3 supplement. Cancer patients have low D levels. I had mine checked and it was low. I do agree sunlight is the best source of D but not everyone has access to enough sun.

[noahware in reply to Magnus1964]

Yes, especially in northern winters, where full sun exposure does nothing at all for your D levels. I'm sure I get enough in New England summers, but it is literally impossible to get an optimal amount. Beyond that decision to supplement, it seems there might also be a need to keep your gut healthy enough where the D3 can get optimally metabolized and directed to the desired benefit.

[ragnar2020]

Hi Noah,

Interesting. I’ve been taking a Vitamin D supplement for years after the dermatologists told me to stay out of the sun or else die from skin cancer. I can’t count how many growths of whatever have been removed because of years of sun damage. Old Irish white guys with SIS = “Shitty Irish Skin” as defined by my dermatologist, need to take the supplement to avoid a deficiency.

Reading the forum postings discussing the complexities of our hormone balances while trying to figure out how manage ADT using possibly natural estrogen or Pharma ADT products is a challenge. Toss into that mix, diet, supplements, maybe radiation SEs makes one want to have a drink and then take a nap.

All the best,

Jeff

[noahware in reply to ragnar2020]

Haha, yes... alcohol + sleep... both beneficial, "in moderation?"

I have read in a study that drinkers had significantly higher gut microbial biodiversity than non-drinkers, but didn't want to continue reading, because the study probably goes on to say that the microbes that drinkers have in greater numbers are mostly the bad kind.

Cheers!

[pjoshea13]

Inulin for butyrate:

frontiersin.org/articles/10...

-Patrick

[noahware in reply to pjoshea13]

Interesting... I think that was the "active" ingredient in a brand of yogurt I once tried that gave me severe gas and cramps. I wonder if different forms of inulin might have different gastric effects, because that rendition was no fun!

Any other specific butyrate-boosters, aside from fiber in general?

[pjoshea13 in reply to noahware]

You can take butyrate itself.

When butter goes rancid, the distinctive smell is free butyrate. Tibetans drink countless cups of tea with rancid butter.

Or you can use a s*ppl*m*nt:

nutriessential.com/products...

-Patrick

[PhilipSZacarias in reply to pjoshea13]

You always amaze me with your nuggets of knowledge. I had a good chuckle with this one. Thanks. Phil

[LearnAll]

Some one who eats plenty of vegetables like Eggplant, Okra, Gourd etc. gets a lot of soluble fiber. Also, peaches, plums, berries ,guava etc have lots of soluble fiber.

[kapakahi]

so trying to cover all my bases here (I think there are about a bazillion or so) I take 5,000 Vitamin D, plus sodium butyrate, plus a probiotic, plus eat Fage nonfat Greek yogurt daily, plus all the other stuff (healthy-ish food and an entire kitchen cabinet shelf of supplements - I can distribute the pills for my wife and me blindfolded by now)

[ck722]

Make your own sauerkraut and learn to love it. The store bought, well most of it anyway, tastes horrid. Letting mine ferment for only two weeks it need not be rinsed. Truly, this is a learned flavor. Caraway seeds enhance it greatly but to each his own. The kraut in a can is sterile. You don't want it as it is a "dead" food.

Why sauerkraut? It is one of the most densely populated foods loaded with gut friendly critters.

Some gut bacterium are "resident". They remain and flourish. Others need to be replenished daily. Ferments can keep the gut healthy so vital nutrients can be absorbed rather than making their way to the leachfield and wasted.

Making kraut is fun and easy.

Enjoy.

[ck722]

rawsuprektauts .com is a great living food packed with a lot of gut good things. Visiting the site, a good read too.

Home made kraut can be fermented to the degree that tastes good to you. Those new to kraut might be displeased by an over-intense jar of it. You do learn to love it with time, slowly increasing the intensity.

[Currumpaw]

Hey noahware!

Organic, naturally fermented sauerkraut or "Green Vibrance" are my go to sources for probiotics. Kimchi is also a good source. Kimchi and sauerkraut will be refrigerated if itt is the "real deal".

Currumpaw

[treedown in reply to Currumpaw]

Sauerkraut and Kimchi are 2 of my favorite pro-biotics. Been adding prebiotics as I find them, luckily my local food coop has really good inventory.

[Currumpaw in reply to treedown]

Hey treedown!

You can make your own, however, Whole Foods takes care of my needs.

This is interesting! A friend manages a Vitamin Shoppe. He has quite a bit of experience and customers confide some of their experiences to him. A customer who had -- the past tense of the verb-- GERD and high blood pressure pulled him aside. My friend had suggested some supps that would be helpful but the customer found something more effective. The customer bought organic, fermented sauerkraut at the local Whole Foods market and ate a fork full in the AM and PM. The GERD disappeared! Surprisingly the customer's blood pressure entered the normal ranges without medication--stress from the GERD?

A neighbor called after waking with fire in her throat! I asked if she had any any baking soda -- a quick fix.

Better living through chemistry--our bodies are somewhat our own little chemical labs! A little of this, a little of that but no--no-- NO! None of that!

Currumpaw

[treedown in reply to Currumpaw]

I purchase mine as well. I have made my own in the past and may again in the future but Costco has organic sauerkraut at a great price so no need for now. Funny you mention GERD I sometimes don't eat as often as others and started again last few days and unless mistaken I am seeing it in my BP readings as of last night. Who knows but time will tell.

[Currumpaw in reply to treedown]

Hey treedown!

Is Costco's sauerkraut refrigerated?

Currumpaw

[treedown in reply to Currumpaw]

Yes and organic. Very good price and product.

[j-o-h-n]

Nothing like sauerkraut ice cream except for:

Chocolate chip ice cream (two scoops).....

Good Luck, Good Health and Good Humor.

j-o-h-n Thursday 12/10/2020 7:51 PM EST