Just a quick note. I have realised that many people take vit D to correct their vit D deficiency yet despite taking quite high doses of D3 their levels do not raise or they expierience negative, deficiency - like effects.
Do not forget to supplement magnesium while you are taking vit D3. Magnesium is essential for transforming D3 into its active form. Without sufficient amount of magnesium your body won't utilise D3 suplements.
Below link summarises vitD3 and magnesium connection.
I had really bad palps just from being very low in thyroxine. They did ease off once I got my dose much higher from 75mcg to 200mcg of Levo. High blood pressure too can be low thyroxine, I know mine is raised a lot at the moment.
I'm taking Armour with Levo, it has been a really bumpy ride including the Armour, I've even had fainting spells and increased body pain. I'm toughing it out for a while. I've had to take a lot of meds and I've found I've had some really bad side effects, but they have settled eventually. Are you sure you're doing the right thing giving up so soon? If you've been ill for a long time I think it can take ages to see any improvement. I've found Armour seems to really stir things up, and not be the magic wand I was hoping for. But I have more colour in my face and my cheekbones are coming back. The shape of my face is definitely changing. Nothing happened until I got to 2 grains. XXX
I too think the palpitations could b due to you being on too low a dose. When I was under-medicated in December I had a high heart rate of over 90 and was sure my blood test would show I was over-medicated. I was taking a bit more than I had been prescribed back in July. I was totally surprised that actually I was under medicated with below range ft4 and low ft3. I have had to increase 3 times since then - 1/4 of a grain each time.
Now my heart has gone back to normal. I did get some bad effects from the first two increases but not from the last. I have learnt to ride I out for a week or so, and then things start to improve xx
Thank you for reply. I am talking real, freaky jumps in my blood pressure 150/145 and chest pains which get worse after I take my dose of erfa. My heart became sensitive to t3 by the look of it need to take break to see if it will pass.
Exx
in reply to
Ps. I have stopped increasing and went back to 1grain but still chest pains and high bp.
Hi E , I really hope that your feeling much better. The thread raises a few concerns. Especially your blood pressure and chest pains I wonder if your dr has done an ECG to check your heart Rythm further . Everyone is correct about magnesium and calcium etc but they play an important role in heart muscle. Contraction that is electrolytes carry the electrical signals through the heart , if they are low or high imbalances can cause Rythm changes. It's all so complicated with the thyroid being so multi faceted effecting so many organs its really difficult to pinpoint what is leading to what. Vitamin d deficiency can lead to weak heart muscle.
On top of all that the kidneys Also help regulate blood pressure.
So what to do now . I feel that whatever is causing the problems it's really important to protect your heart . And it sounds that this should be taken seriously by your dr for more investigations , I also glad that you shared all this information even though your feeling so all over the place it's really helpful. I wish Drs would just read this page. Certainly if I miss my vitamin. B and vit D I can feel the lag the next day. Recently I started taking the muti vitamins with ginkgo and it give me lots more energy to work nights . Oh I'm sorry I have to finish the children are running riot sorry I will try and add more later . Best of luck to you x
Thank you Pittuco. I know about dangers this situation poses to my heart. The problem is that my GP does not give a s..t !! If i die from heart attack then who cares !! at the end of the day it is all in my head.... as these ***** say. I am distressed but trying to get to used to the thought that one day I can just have heart attack and that's it.
I am too weak to fight GP's in my surgery, at the same time I cannot go private route any longer.
I am a nurse, I have degree in health studies... I know that everything should be carefully monitored but that is the theory, in reality things are different, they do not care.
I am poor and I am a foreigner with no family, additionally I am very weak due to my illness. My status changed, I am unemployed, I needed to give up my second degree, I was diagnosed with depression and that gives them additional argument not to test me, they know i have no energy to fight any longer.
Hi, my dear fellow sufferer I just want to go to you and fight with you straight away. How dare they put you in this position. The frustration . I can't bear it that they write you off with depression caused by the lack of energy to just achieve your life's tasks and ambitions.
The depression as I am sure that everyone on this site will agree tjat the brain,is exactly the same as the heart . Organs of the body lacking the energy to function with an inability to metabolise . I want to help you so much it's a criminal act to lose a nurse to the world because they won't look After you . I am in London. And have up on my gp long ago . I'm sorry to just reply with a rant rather than constructive information but I will have a think of what we can do from here. For now all I can do is send a big jug. Your heart has goodness in it and that will keep it strong . Lol
hi Pittuco. Thank you for reply. I was sad but when I have seen that you are sending me a big 'JUG' ! that really made me laugh xxx
Hi Heloise.
I wish I wouldn't have to stop but my bp went sky high 150/145, got chest pains and palpitations. It gets worse after I take erfa. I needed to call Tony to stay with me today as I am worried. I need to stop erfa for now until I figure out what's causing problems.
and yes:)! Magnesium is very important
E xx
in reply to
Hi Edysia,
WOW that's some reading!
Why don't you order the adrenal testing kit? Mine arrived today, I can't get my head around it. I definitely need to go through it with someone who can think clearly. I think I'm very anxious about anything new and that doesn't help! It could be the key to why you are so ill and not improving. It's another £71 though
I will definitely get magnesium, I'm taking the D3 for months now and just not feeling any improvement in my body pain. Hopefully this may do the trick! XXX
in reply to
Hope magnesium will do the trick I am not able to order test just yet at this point £71 is not affordable. Maybe in the future.
Good luck with your test. You will manage, I am sure
E xx
in reply to
It is really hard affording all this when you can't work I've been wanting this test for a long time. It's a shame we can't get it on the NHS. I'll let you know if adrenals is an issue for me, like you, I just want to get better!
Hugs, Edysia. XXX
in reply to
I am sorry Helcaster, I have just called you Heloise!!! Another proof that my blood pressure is too high !
I wish you the best health outcome you can possibly get. NHS is often not very helpful, unfortunately
E xx
in reply to
I answer to anything lol!! NHS? Tell me about it! XXX
The gp checks mg usually with the run of the mill bloods you get a result , you can ask what the last ones were. But it's like your blood sugar for example And can change levels throughout the day. So I can't say it's worth spending that much money on. If the chest pains came back I think best place would be to be seen in a and e . They would do all those checks and probably be the safe est thing to do. As it all sounds stressful with the combination of symptoms chest pain and palpitations . They would be only too happy to asses you
With those symptoms. . I'm not saying that to alarm you but I know that it's just not worth anything to go to the gp the next day or week when the chest aim has gone and he /she makes you feel like a hupochondriac. Lol
I was very confused back in December that I felt worse after taking my 11am dose of Armour, which is one of the reasons why I (mistakenly) felt I migh be over medicated.
It turned out I was very under medicated and the feeling I was getting must have been from the armour wearing off and the next dose not happening quick enough/being enough for my needs.
An increase of 3/4 of a grain, spread over a couple of months has made me feel so much better. Xxx
Hi Clarebear,
You really sound like you've got it sorted!
I felt like giving up on Armour I admit, the constant headache and eyeball pain was awful. As I've increased my foot pain and calf pain has become much worse. It really is stopping me from sleeping. I'm going to hang on in though because I can see changes in my swollen face, and I'm not sweating and weak in the evening craving my next dose. The last week also I'm not getting up feeling drunk. wobbly and very sweaty. Still feel I have a hell of a way to go though.
When you feel terrible it's so hard to work out if you are under or over. I'm sure being over medicated must feel very unpleasant though. XXX
I have wondered so many times When i am feeling awful whether it is due to over medication o under medication. Even now I still find it hard and this is after 15 month on armour for the last 8 weeks though I have felt so much better, but even so have the odd blip with either anxiety/fast pulse/headaches. Xx
I'm begining to think we're going to get bad days whatever we do. I'm trying to pace myself more, but end up feeling like I'm not helping myself as I don't exercise enough
It's impossible to find the right dose without experimentation! I think lack of sleep contributes to my anxiety and brain fog too. If I could get some sleep I even think my body pain would improve.
We've just got to keep trying! You do sound like you're doing really well though
Try reducing your dose. I had heart palps and high bp bad enough for my gp to think I was about to have a heart attack and insist I cancel travel to the US last Christmas. I cut my own dose from 3 grains to one per day (with Dr S's approval) and have been totally fine on that ever since - detailed blood work recently confirmed it - and all the heart symptoms are now fine including bp. I didn't need three+ grains - ie., the normal dose - to get the desired results: on three+ I actually became toxic enough to nearly cause an attack or stroke. It now appears all heart symptoms were caused by taking more ERFA than my body needed, and were sorted. Taking less gives me a perfect result.
I am on a very low dose ladywell. only 1 grain. I do think my heart is too sensitive to have raw T3 supplied at the moment. I am thinking that the ratio of T4 to T3 is not suitable for me. I am having really bad time. the only thing I can do ( whenever I get to see a proper doctor) is to mix synthetic T4 with synthetic T3 ( this way i will have control over the ratio).
Unfortunately it is not that easy to do. I am not sure if I will be able to take other brands of levothyroxine ( i tried some and it did disagree with me - lactose) and I am not sure if I will be able to tolerate synthetic T3 either.
Thanks, another building block in my knowledge! Will get the magnesiun to go with the Vit D as I am on the low side of the normal range and st my age osteoporosis could loom!
Hi It is true that vit D and magnesium are vital. D must only be taken if calcium in ranges as an electrolytes, tests before and during D treatment. Magnesium, is also an electrolyte, like calcium and must always be in range. There is a blood test with a tiny range, that is not perfect, but works for me as I have to have massive doses on a script and therefore weekly blood tests. In food totally safe. Magnesium is an electrolyte and sodium, ( U`s and E`, kidney function ), that test is not as good as the one in cells either but Potassium is especially effected by magnesium, and the 4 electrolytes effect each other and must always be in range ,no matter what. The potassium test is better if it is the one in the cells. However, the blood tests which I have weekly are essential if on treatment that effects these. I have weekly tests for them all . This has, so far saved my life on numerous occasions. I now have had to stop taking my massive dose of D, which I had on a script,as my calcium has gone too high, this can happen in anyone.There is no way of knowing without frequent blood tests.
Of course, it is entirely up to an individual what they do, however, I think it is vital to be informed. Ignorant doctors re these tests, caused me 4 cardiac arrests, 3 lots of acute renal failure, coma etc.Also MI`s.
I f this helps someone I am happy but it is entirely up to the person concerned, I would not dream of telling some one what to do. Most doctors even some cardio are unaware of this as I know to my cost. I have been lucky.
Jackie I just seen this after writing above , this is what I was trying to touch on but you've explained it do clearly . I'm sorry this all happened to you . What misfortune. Your experience is indicative of how we are not managed by Drs just left to feel like a shadow and must try and manage our own condition
. It makes me so cross that the symptoms we are trying to manage are not even attributed to our thyroid. I hope that you have recovered jackie are they looking after you better now .
That is kind of you, actually as you ask many doctors have caused some of my many problems( We are all human!) Too late for me, but I do like to try and warn other people. even now even cardio`s do not understand.Actually my cardio` now is brilliant, after many , many bad ones. He says hat I have to know more than them, which he says I do, to protect myself especially from ignorant hospitals doctors. I have emergencies every few months ( coma,blue light etc) so not always easy!It just makes me sad when some people are putting themselves at risk.
Edysia, are you going to stop ERFA entirely or just cut back? It may be true that you need only 1/2 grain. I took that for years and then went up to one grain. That is much lower than most people it seems. Do you think your other supplements and improved levels are causing your ERFA to become too rich?
Hi Heloise. I did freeze my dose on 1 grain. I cannot go up at all, due to terrible chest pains and dizziness. I am becoming a complex case so ... I do not know what is going to happen. I know that I am undermedicated. My blood tests did show that but as I have said I just cannot increase..
LOL, I guess we are sending hugs AND jugs now. Both good.
Well, I am in the same boat about the dose. My FT3 and FT4 are at the bottom of normal and I cannot raise without getting all fluttery and breathless. I have to get the ferritin test and the adrenal test. Iron is really important so I'm hoping I test low and can start supplementing but don't want to until I know for sure since high iron isn't good either. If that doesn't work, I'm going to go for the saliva test. I can't recall if you have had all those or not.
I wish, oh wish, you could get on with your career.
Panic attacks, sometimes adrenal glands that can't produce enough cortisol end up producing adrenaline instead and this leads to panic attacks in some people
Shakiness and flu type symptoms, often able to be "slept off"
Difficulty getting to sleep, this is a high cortisol symptom
Inability to tolerate Thyroid Meds, they can cause anxiety or panic attacks when you take them and yet you are not hyper, temperature is still low
Uneven heart beat or missing heart beats, sometimes brought on when you take thyroid meds
Strange temperature instability effects, this has a page of it's own here
There are lots more symptoms of low cortisol, there is a page on the adrenals group site here that is full of them.
Another excerpt: your adrenals are low causing unstable temperatures then they need support, Isocort can help in mild cases or Hydrocortisone in more severe cases. If temperature tests indicate that you have an adrenal problem DO NOT START thyroid treatment until it is sorted. Go and have a look at the adrenals group web site, read through it, Join the adrenals group, the links section of their Yahoo group has links to labs where you can get the Saliva test done, this is the gold standard and can be done without a Dr's prescription, when you have the results of the saliva test post them on the Yahoo group and people will help you interpret them.
Just to back up what Heloise says....I took NDT and my symptoms grew worse very quickly....read about having to treat adrenals first from at least three different sources...Dr Barry's book was one. I have now started to take Natural hydrocortisone which you can buy from France...( Had saliva test a while back when still in UK which showed it was low).Early days but already have managed to have a busy day without a rest and not have adrenal crash ( ppts, shortness of breath...panicky feelings).
Am thinking though that I now need to provide my body with the minerals it has been issing so thanks for the reminder re mag and vit D......
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I am stuck
xx
for the last 8 weeks though I have felt so much better, but even so have the odd blip with either anxiety/fast pulse/headaches. Xx
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