I'm still trying to figure out why Vit D causes me tinnitus, can't even have Almond milk because it contains Vit D, so annoying and it keeps coming back to magnesium deficiency, however my last blood test showed my magnesium was 1.03 (0.7-1.0) so shows its high.
I'm not sure if I was dreaming it but I'm sure someone on here said that there was other measurements for magnesium that should be looked at? I've had a look but I can't find it. Can anyone help me please?
Thank you
Some of us cannot tolerate VitD in any form other than the sun, just the way it is 🤷♀️
I used to take it before I had RAI and it didn't cause me tinnitus then. It's very odd.
I believe, for some people, RAI screws up a lot more than " just " ablating the thyroid.
Oh absolutely. But it does make you wonder as I've read alot of stuff that links low magnesium to graves. Guess we will never really know!
Magnesium is an intracellular cation, blood tests do not reflect intracellular magensium and so are of little use. The best test is to supplement and observe symptoms.
Vitamin D is needed for good absorption of magnesium but too much vitamin D lowers magnesium levels (sorry, can't remember the mechanism). I found that taking the recommended daily amount of vitamin D helped but when I tried two tablets daily my symptoms got worse. This was two decades ago so I can't remember the numbers.
The serum (blood) test for magnesium isn't reliable.
Less than 1% of the body's magnesium is found in the blood. The body prioritises having the necessary magnesium in the blood. So, to make sure that there is always sufficient magnesium in the blood it will get stolen from other tissues if necessary.
So, a blood test for magnesium will almost never show a low level even if the patient has a deficiency in many tissues of the body.
There is another type of magnesium test called a Red Cell Magnesium test. In this test the magnesium level within the red blood cells themselves is tested. For reasons I don't understand I've read that the red cell test is considered (by some) to be a more reliable measurement of magnesium than the serum one. I have seen red cell magnesium tests listed by some testing companies in the past but can't find one now. They are more expensive than the serum test so perhaps the red cell test wasn't popular.
Another thing to bear in mind is that, if the patient has functioning kidneys, any excess magnesium will be excreted in urine. Someone with very poor kidney function should not take magnesium supplements.
You might find some snippets of interest in these links on magnesium :
ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articl...
drjockers.com/best-magnesiu...
naturalnews.com/046401_magn...
Being unable to tolerate vitamin D is fairly common, and has been mentioned on this forum. I don't know of anyone who has ever overcome their intolerance of vitamin D, but the idea that this intolerance could be because of a deficiency in another mineral or vitamin seems to be a strong possibility to me. Whether that cofactor is magnesium I really don't know.
Important point about not taking magnesium if you have poor kidney function. RBC magnesium is better than serum but still not much use as it doesn't tell you how much is within the tissue that need magnesium. The magnesium loading test (take magnesium and monitor the response) is regarded as the gold standard. There are tests using fancy probes but these are limited to research and not generally available.
Humanbean, re your comment "Someone with very poor kidney function should not take magnesium supplements", we used to be wary about magnesium supplementation with CKD but, after significant research, now believe it is OK at least for "relatively" early stage CKD eg 3-4. Indeed it can be beneficial at that stage pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/291....
Consequently my mum (CKD3) has now started to supplement (glycinate at only 26.5% RI) and monitor her muscle aching/sleeplessness symptoms after previously avoiding because of the commonly held view that people with CKD should not supplement.
Her serum level is ~23% through normal range (and we will continue to test) having fallen from 30%, maybe because of vitamin D supplementation and/or increased sunshine.
If you have evidence opposing the above approach, I would appreciate you sending.
I have always been unsure how bad kidneys had to be for magnesium supplementation to become a problem, and I'm not sure what my original source was for the information. I have always deliberately left my statements about poor kidney function and magnesium rather vague hoping that people would do their own research and do their own experimenting and make their own decisions.
I always try to keep in mind what the symptoms are of the supplements I take if I overdo any of them. (I took too much vitamin B6 about 10 years ago and ended up with peripheral neuropathy - luckily I found out the problem quickly enough for it not to become permanent.)
So, for someone taking magnesium they should be aware of the symptoms of hypermagnesemia (excessive magnesium in the blood) for which the symptoms are (according to wikipedia)
Symptoms include weakness, confusion, decreased breathing rate, and decreased reflexes.[1][3] As well as nausea, low blood pressure, low blood calcium,[7] abnormal heart rhythms and asystole, dizziness, and sleepiness.
I had always thought (without having done the research on the issue) that if I had worrying levels of CKD (which I don't), a GFR under 30 would be my personal cut-off point in terms of magnesium supplementation, but I'm glad to know that people can still take it at lower levels of GFR. I've bookmarked your link, thank you, and it is helpful that the whole paper is available for free :
ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articl...
Do you know at what level of CKD people should start reducing their magnesium intake from the maximum dose?
According to the Wiki page on magnesium the maximum intake (presumably for healthy people) should be :
Dietary recommendations
In the UK, the recommended daily values for magnesium are 300 mg for men and 270 mg for women.[60] In the U.S. the Recommended Dietary Allowances (RDAs) are 400 mg for men ages 19–30 and 420 mg for older; for women 310 mg for ages 19–30 and 320 mg for older.[61]
Re: "Do you know at what level of CKD people should start reducing their magnesium intake from the maximum dose?"
I suspect there is no precise figure otherwise I would hope it would be included in links like kidney.org/blog/ask-doctor/.... Another link appears to indicate caution at creatinine clearance levels under 30ml/min pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/260....
Mum's appears stable at ~53.
In mum's case, we are being cautious by:
1. Only allowing 500mg/day glycinate (26.5% RI) supplementation initially.
2. Monitoring her muscle ache symptom, in particular, at that dose.
3. Regularly testing/monitoring her serum magnesium.
4. Only considering an increase in supplementation, if required, then repeating above.
Note:
(i) Her diet includes significant magnesium e.g. leafy greens, as well.
(ii) We will consider RBC magnesium testing also but are more focused on symptom monitoring at present and assume an increase in serum level also increases cell level.
Tinnitus is sometimes blamed on low vitamin B12 or low vitamin E or low vitamin D, apparently :
livestrong.com/article/4220...
Another possibility...
Low vitamin D reduces calcium absorption in the diet, so both your calcium and your vitamin D could be low.
I found this previous post of yours where some nutrient levels are given :
healthunlocked.com/thyroidu...
Your folate is quite good, optimal for folate is upper half of the range. This link on it is worth reading :
chriskresser.com/folate-vs-...
Your ferritin (iron stores) is rather low too. Optimal for ferritin is mid-range or a bit over so with the range you were given this is something like 85 - 120. However, ferritin and anything iron-related can be complicated, and great care should be taken in supplementing it. The reasons for the care required are discussed in this thread :
healthunlocked.com/thyroidu...
But your serum B12 is poor. B12 is the only nutrient I know of that doesn't cause problems if it goes above range. And the ranges I see from UK testing are abysmally low.
For what its worth, I keep my own level of serum B12 at over 1000 ng/L, and my active B12 is usually at the top of the range or even a little bit over.
Some links :
stichtingb12tekort.nl/engli...
stichtingb12tekort.nl/our-e...
If you ever decide to supplement B12 the best one is methylcobalamin which can be bought in various doses from supplement sites and also Amazon.
This product has been recommended by SeasideSusie - it contains two active forms of vitamin B12 :
Hi humanbean, thank you so much for all that information. I will have a look through it all.I have been supplementing with a B complex for sometime but I am still struggling with ferritin but
I feel so much better now I'm taking lactose free Aristo so am really trying to focus on everything else now.
Thanks again, really appreciate it.
If you ever have an iron panel done you can post your results in a new thread and ask for feedback.
Medichecks does an iron panel test :
medichecks.com/iron-tests/i...
and you can get 10% off with the discount code given in this link :
When you improve vitamin D levels it can exacerbate low B vitamins
What vitamin supplements are you currently taking
Low B vitamins, especially B12 often linked to tinnitus
Low vitamin D and low B vitamins may be linked as explained here
drgominak.com/sleep/vitamin...
drgominak.com/rightsleep-me...
In YouTube video when Dr Gominak talks about vitamin D levels ...vitamin D at 40ng/ml (USA units) is equal to 100nmol (UK units)
Your B12 at 300 is too low
Low B12 symptoms
b12deficiency.info/signs-an...
With serum B12 result below 500, (Or active B12 below 70) recommended to be taking a B12 supplement as well as a B Complex (to balance all the B vitamins) initially for first 2-4 months, then once your serum B12 is over 500 (or Active B12 level has reached 70), stop the B12 and just carry on with the B Complex.
B12 sublingual lozenges
amazon.co.uk/Jarrow-Methylc...
cytoplan.co.uk/shop-by-prod...
healthunlocked.com/thyroidu...
Vitamin B complex
supplementing a good quality daily vitamin B complex, one with folate in (not folic acid) may be beneficial.
This can help keep all B vitamins in balance and will help improve B12 levels too
Difference between folate and folic acid
chriskresser.com/folate-vs-...
B vitamins best taken after breakfast
Thorne Basic B is an option that contain folate, but is large capsule. You can tip powder out if can’t swallow capsule
Igennus Super B is good quality and cheap vitamin B complex. Contains folate. Full dose is two tablets per day. Many/most people may only need one tablet per day. Certainly only start on one per day (or even half tablet per day for first couple of weeks)
IMPORTANT......If you are taking vitamin B complex, or any supplements containing biotin, remember to stop these 7 days before ALL BLOOD TESTS , as biotin can falsely affect test results
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