On going through my papers re 'hypo' I came aross a letter from Dr Barry Peatfield whom I was fortunate to consult. This is what he stated and I thought members might like to read:-
"If thyroxine isn't being properly processed and taken up by the tissues. the unused thyroxine builds up and causes toxity - heart problems and palps almost invariably. You need to consider again - adrenal function and the use of natural thyroid and/or T3.
Hoping to see you again.
All good wishes."
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That became a turning point in my recovery.
Unfortunately the majority of doctors worldwide who were trained as Dr P and Dr Skinner have now long since retired or died.
When Big Pharma brought in 'blood tests' that's where the skill of many doctors was reduced and the reliance upon a TSH alone became the replacement for symptoms.
Also in the UK, Dr Gordon Skinner was another who put patients first and had to appear in front of the GMC more than once to defend his method of diagnosing/treating.
‘Diagnosis and Management of Hypothyroidism’ by Gordon R B Skinner MD DSc FRCPath FRCO
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Dr Skinner covers hypothyroidism diagnosis, management, difficulties and a very interesting chapter called, “The Faux-Pas of the Decade”. He also covers areas that are linked to hypothyroidism such as B12 deficiency and diabetes.
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shaws
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I have said this before ... Dr Skinner was the only doctor who actually gave me a physical examination to looks for signs of thyroid disease. He also persuaded my GP to give me Levothyroxine to help me recover my health. I wish there were more doctors like him because he genuinely cared about his patients.
....and when you shaws and others here referred me to the words of Dr P, Dr S and Dr JL et al that was the turning point in my recovery and my discovery that I have a type of RTH. Thank you again.....you all know who you are.
When will we see their like again! Without them the present surge of sick thyroid patients will keep building as the knowledge of how to treat them fades behind computer screens....it is heartbreaking to read here of so much unnecessary suffering at the hands of badly educated medics.
When will 21st century doctors come to recognise that every cell in the body is dependent on T3 and that a quick glance at a TSH level barely begins to reveal the complexity of so many underlying problems. That is before we come to nutrients!
Ah! But most thyroid patients are (hysterical) women! Rubbish! Time and again, researchers of medical history point to evidence that hysteria was little more than a way to describe and pathologize “everything that men found mysterious or unmanageable in women.”
" You need antidepressants" or one or more other pills and potions to treat the symptoms....but not the cause. Rubbish!
No, we do not, we need correct thyroid treatment by well informed medics. We should not have to trawl the internet for sometimes dubious supplies of T3 in order to self medicate. My lovely GP knows I do this and referred to it as accepting "patient autonomy".....enough to make Aneurin Bevan turn in his grave!
When indeed!
First, educate the medics...
Sorry I'm ranting again ....maybe there is a pill for that too!
How hard-hearted the 'professionals' seem to be when they've withdrawn NDTs, T3s without notice and without a care for those who had taken either. They don't seem to have any 'vocation'.
I feel for those doctors who have to keep to the guidelines, otherwise their jobs are in peril and they may be dismissed.
After all, both Dr Skinner and Dr Peatfield were treated as criminals for assisting their patients to good health and symptom-free despite their training in diagnosing patients when there was no blood tests at that time. Dr Peatfield resigned from the NHS but helped patient recover due to his advice.
Both appeared before the GMC (Dr S more than once) and found as not doing anything wrong, but the stress and strain must surely have been awful. There's probably others of which we're unaware . Dr John Lowe resigned his Licence so that he could treat patients as he thought and not be constrained.
Surely we are mature enough to trial 'options' when levo isn't working.
Also we should not be driven to source our own thyroid hormone replacements due to the terrible 'guidelines' and cruelty due to the gradual reduction/withdrawal of alternatives (NDTs - due to False Statements - or T3).
Over the last few years that has become abundantly clear.... good medics retreat for cover when T3 is mentioned.I actually feel sorry for some of them because they do want to help but cannot.
I have the most dreadful nails on my right hand ( posted here in the past)....now very slowly improving.
About 3 years ago I was seen by a med student who was on placement at our practice, he saw me alone and was given the task of examining my nails and making a diagnosis. He muttered a few things and then said that could be thyroid related! My thought, I said ! Bingo....he's got it. I could have hugged him
He then had to go and report his findings to the GP before I was given the outcome. He came back with the GP who said , "yes, it appears to be blah blah." But, I replied J (the student) suggested a thyroid connection.... which made sense given my history. Much blustering and I was told no, not possible....but the GP didn't have a definitive or better suggestion.
Meanwhile student looked crestfallen and I was speechless....we could only exchange meaningful looks! Today I would have waded in but then I felt unwell and not particularly assertive. ....maybe would have done more harm than good anyway.
I really hope they didn't succeed in turning that bright young lad into another product of the medical sausage machine.....
There were people who travelled the length and breadth of the UK, to consult with Dr Skinner and Dr Peatfield - the last of those who were trained upon clinical symptoms alone before blood tests were introduced. Also both of them were - towards the end of their careers, were pursued by the GMC and Dr Skinner had to appear before the GMC more than once
Dr Peatfield resigned his licence due to the strain and so that he could advise people privately.
I just came across this letter you linked above. It is heartbreaking. Why did this person take their life if they were on t3 only? I’m dismayed by that.
As far as I'm aware she wasn't taking T3. I think it was the way she was treated by medical professionals who didn'tgive her proper care and attention that she could no longer live her life being so unwell and not being helped by the professionals..
Thanks for your reply. I've been in a thyroid hole this morning, reading through everything... It's just such an unknowable tragedy. I wonder how many lives have been lost to thyroid and they didn't even know it.
I thought I read at the end of her letter she was taking 280mcg of T3, but maybe I am mistaken. In any case, very sad indeed.
Dr Skinner's staff, since his demise, have collated all of their scientific work and they said it would 'shake up the medial profession'. They were hoping to do so when they had sufficient monies. I don't know how far they've got yet.
There is a study being carried out by Colin Dayan's team which should see some progress later this year. Patients will be given an opportunity to exclude their data from the study (which is anonymous) if they wish. I think it has been delayed because so many clinicians have been reassigned to COVID-19 support.
Hi jimh111, Had a quick look at the VCT. Would still like to make a donation but wonder if better to make it via thyroid UK? Did notice that their VCT accounts posted a significant deficit for 2019 and there is not much left in the coffers for research.
The trust no longer carries out vaccine research which is very expensive and not practical since Dr Skinner died. Their only project is the thyroid study and I believe the money is spent on collating the data for Prof Dayan's team.
Thanks for getting back to me. Hadn't made the connection that since Dr Skinner died that this research had probably ended. It appears we are relying on Prof Dayan and his team to carry the baton....
Thanks for the link. Have now made a donation but a thought occurred to me that many new members may not be aware of this work and the need for funds to store the body of data securely for future use..
Since Dr Skinner died, all of his staff have been collating all of their research work in order to publish it. The problem is that they needed about £10,000 to achieve this. They stated it would shake the medical world.
Hi Shaws, £10k is a lot of money but I can't see them raising that amount soon, despite having made a small donation. It is very likely that this very important research material will lie unpublished gathering dust and will be largely forgotten. How sad for all of us thyroid sufferers who may benefit from new, or revised treatment regimes. Thyroid disease in all its manifestations, is largely a forgotten disease because the medical profession believes it is sorted out...it has 'moved on' It is not 'sexy' to research it. One day people will look back and think how badly those suffering with thyroid issues were treat.
Thanks for update about Professor Dayan and I hope his research will change attitudes of many of the professionals and permit patients to have optimum medication which helps them recover their health.
Heartbreaking shaws ! And still - dare I say - what is tantamount to criminal neglect persists. Lorraine Cleaver was close to ending her life too.....and how many others have quietly slipped away!
Hopefully Colin Dayan's study ( thanks for update jimh111 ) and the work of the late Gordon Skinner's staff will find listening ears and open minds....it's beyond high time something did!
Re The poor ladies letter after taking her own life. How must she have suffered . It's a bloody scandal alright. So sad. She certainly still had a good brain to write all that. Poor woman.
I think another point worth mentioning, Dr Skinner didn’t start out as being a thyroid doctor. He was asked to look at some fibro results and realised from that what could be muddying the waters do to speak. He did a lot of digging and asking questions and concluded that thyroid issues were not always treated well. So he made it his mission to learn all he could and help us. I was his patient and he was a breath of fresh air. I always made my appointment as I lived a distance away and one day tgey was the extra worry of snow on the ground. So I turned up a little early. He was pleased to see me as expected I wouldn’t have got there and he also offered to make me some lunch. Then saw me straight away so I could hopefully get nearer home sooner. He really cared about his patients well being. I last saw him about three weeks before his untimely death. We were both at the same meeting and in the food queue together and never stopped talking. He was generally interested in his patients, not a job, a vocation so very much missed by many. A few months after his death his family came down from Scotland and invited us to spend time with them remembering there father. It was a few hours of joy and laughter hearing about his life and family and I suppose his dreams he tried so hard to make happen. He was a very special person and I’m sure sadly missed.
We need more doctors like him who're unafraid of the consequences as their desire to heal their patients is stronger.
It is a very difficult decision as they would be putting their livelihoods at peril.
Dr Skinner appeared before the GMC several times, so it must have had the consequences of immense strain and distracting Dr S from his 'profession'.
Who were the anonymous complainers about him not 'toeing' the line? I think we'd all like to know.
I think at his last appearance before the GMC that they did take account of people who travelled the length of the UK to listen and in support of Dr S.
These patients (whom Dr, S healed) many of them travelled from all over the UK to show their support.
I cannot remember the actual numbers, but one of Dr S's Admirers did a calculation of how many times he had to appear before the GMC and it was astronomical.
The fact is that the patients were healed by being offered alternatives to levothyroxine. Isn't it strange, now, that the alternatives have also been removed from being prescribed.
How many hypothyroid patients in the UK are still very symptomatic and given 'extras' to try to relieve them instead of options of thyroid hormones After all - just recently - NDT was also removed through misinformation and despite it being a 'grandfathered' replacement and T3 now too expensive.
Drugs that were already on the market were "grandfathered" and allowed to remain on the market without further regulatory approval if they were labeled with the same conditions of use.
It’s shocking really that they aren’t allowed to say what they think especially as it worked! I think something was also rather telling, the fact that he had to check up on treatment. I doubt many on any level of expertise would think of doing that. So many could still be working in the dark ages! Yes it may have worked in 1960’s but also it could have made a fantastic discovery in the 1980’s and so on. Medicine evolves so skills need updating and is not a bad move to chase up the latest ideas etc, for us and the likes it’s a good move! How we get round that I don’t know and money would be needed. I once thought when surgeries we manned by several doctors then they should split the different areas of expertise between them and take the patients accordingly as that should speed things up and encourage learning more which should be beneficial all round. We go to our doctor in good faith but there are more treatments to learn about, medications, etc. It must be a nightmare at times not knowing what the next patient could bring! We may well have a brilliant NHS but may be it needs streamlined more.
I sometimes think we ask too much of GPs, they are after all "general practitioners "not specialists. I agree with what you say.
GPs of my childhood were like Dr S (I'm 75) but it was a different time lived at a different pace without the wonderful life saving modern interventions available today.
"Vocation" has been replaced with "work"!
We find ourselves blaming GPs and endos for their lack of knowledge. But, who can blame us when we experience wrong diagnoses and wrong medication which often we only discover ( along with what restores our health) by doing the digging ourselves - as Dr S did so well!
In the 21st century we need change and those in high places fear that, it undermines their perceived authority.
My grandfather was offered a place at university to study medicine but his family insisted he remain a farmer like previous generations.....they didn't like change either!
He was a lovely man and would have been a wonderful doctor.....he " doctored" his horses instead and became a respected Horse Whisperer as well as a farmer!
Such a lot they have to take on board these days, may be that has triggered my thought of streamlining but of course money is always going to be a problem.
If T3 was the same price as it is in other countries, would the NHS be so reticent. If the doctors measured free T3 and looked at the ratio with T4 and the conversion like we do, would that help, I think so. If they measured more than just TPO antibodies and measured Thyroglobulin antibodies that would of certainly made my case as only the latter was raised very high?
Sad state of affairs trying to educate ourselves when brainfog is such a damn nuisance! Keep on keeping on admin you are wonderful 😀
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