Has anyone tried Red Sage?

[Zuzuelle]

Hi everyone,

I was wondering if anyone had tried red sage? I think it’s often used in Chinese herbal medicine. I read a scientific study that says it helps raise iron levels in the brain, but can’t find out much about it and am wary of taking too much or any interactions etc.

I’d be very grateful for any advice or experience anyone had with it.

Thank you!

[SueJohnson]

If you have Haemochromatosis I wouldn't take it. Otherwise it is safe. I see pramipexole listed on your profile. Are you taking it and if so, how much?

[Zuzuelle in reply to SueJohnson]

Thanks Sue, I do have haemochromotisis! That’s interesting. Do you know why that would be dangerous? I understand on a basic level, but thought brain iron levels might be different? My iron levels are normal but ferretin is low.

I’m taking 0.88 mg Prami per day, but it’s not really working anymore and I don’t want to take more.

Restless legs is in my back too and it’s driving me bananas.

[Joolsg in reply to Zuzuelle]

Sounds like you are experiencing augmentation on Pramipexole. It's moved to your back.It's the most common issue on this help forum. Pramipexole causes an increase in severity of the RLS & the only solution is to get off it by reducing half a 0.088 pill every 2 weeks. You may need an opioid for the withdrawal symptoms. Read all you can- there are lotsof videos, including the one by Dr. Buchfuhrer on the RLS UK site.

rls-uk.org/augmentation-reb...

[Zuzuelle in reply to Joolsg]

Thank you. I had it before Pramipexole, but it’s definitely coming back and I’m worried about augmentation so don’t want to take more. It’s so frustrating that nothing really seems to last or help.

[Boldgirl45 in reply to Joolsg]

Hi Joolsg - the info on the article link is very interesting. Would love to see the Doc Buchfuhrer video - could you point me in the direction? Thank you!

[Joolsg in reply to Boldgirl45]

sleepreviewmag.com/sleep-di...

This is Dr Buchfuhrer's article on augmentation but he also did a video. I'll try to find it.

[Joolsg in reply to Joolsg]

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The video talk by Dr Buchfuhrer is on rls.org but I suspect only members of rls.org the US RLS foundation can access the full video in the members section.

It is well worth joining as the fees go towards research and education and you get access to quarterly magazines with research updates and webinars by the top RLS experts like Drs Winkelman, Buchfuhrer, Ondo, Earley etc.

[Boldgirl45 in reply to Joolsg]

Thanks you - really appreciate that advice and will join up !

[SueJohnson in reply to Zuzuelle]

If it can raise iron levels in the brain, it can raise iron in the blood which you don't want . I agree with Joolsg. You are experiencing augmentation and need to come off it and switch to gabapentin which is now the first line treatment for RLS. You will have increased symptoms. You may need to reduce more slowly than Joolsg suggested or with a smaller amount. Wait until the increased symptoms from each reduction has settled before going to the next one. You will suffer and may need a low dose opioid temporarily to help out with the symptoms especially as you near the end. But in the long run, you will be glad you came off it. On the gabapentin, beginning dose is usually 300 mg gabapentin. Start it 3 weeks before you are off ropinirole although it won't be fully effective until you are off it for several weeks. After that increase it by 100 mg every couple of days until you find the dose that works for you. Take it 1-2 hours before bedtime. If you need more than 600 mg take the extra 4 hours before bedtime as it is not as well absorbed above 600 mg. If you need more than 1200 mg, take the extra 6 hours before bedtime. Most of the side effects of gabapentin will disappear after a few weeks and the few that don't will usually lessen. Those that remain are usually worth it for the elimination of the RLS symptoms. According to the Mayo Clinic Updated Algorithm on RLS: "Most RLS patients require 1200 to 1800 mg of gabapentin daily." If you take magnesium take it at least 3 hours before taking gabapentin as it will interfere with the absorption of the gabapentin. Check out the Mayo Clinic Updated Algorithm on RLS which will tell you everything you want to know including about its treatment and refer your doctor to it if needed as many doctors do not know much about RLS or are not uptodate on it as yours obviously isn't or s/he would never have prescribed a dopamine agonist at

Https://mayoclinicproceedings.org/a...

[Zuzuelle in reply to SueJohnson]

Thank you so much for taking the time to reply, I really appreciate it. I did try gabapentin before pramipexole, but it didn’t work - but perhaps I just wasn’t taking enough? I’ll go back to my GP and try again I think.