Another possible chemical :(

[Esb27]

Hi guys,

Apologies in advance for the long post…

I think I'm having my 4th chemical pregnancy (1st with IVF after 3 natural chemicals). Had my FET on 19th Dec and OTD was yesterday at 11dp5dt. Got a few positive tests and a 1-2 weeks CB yesterday.

Really tried to feel positive about the tests but found myself feeling off as I've had such bad luck so far (2 ectopics and 3 chemicals naturally) despite my boyf being super positive. I tested again this morning and the tests are a little bit lighter.

I've attached a photo of yesterday morning and this morning's first responses next to each other, though the individual photos of the tests I also took are a slightly better comparison as I took them as soon as they were 'ready' aka after 3 mins - where as the attached photo is an hour after doing the test today and over 24hours after yesterdays so they look slightly less different (HU won't let me upload two photos so I had to attach this one)

Will obviously wait until tomorrow to properly compare, which is 48 hrs after the first tests to see if they are considerably lighter, but I just have that feeling you know, the same feeling I had when I had my last chemical in August 21. I've had no bleeding but am crampy especially around my back.

Quite frustrating as all I want to do is confirm it with a blood test but a) my clinic don't do HCG tests and are closed and b) the EPU near me is also closed for the weekend/NYE. I tried to do the home blood test but the in-store version but the pharmacy needed 24 hours notice and to order the courier and the next available date is 3rd Jan so I might as well just wait for the EPU to open on 3rd so I can do it for free (if I even last that long!).

I know I should be happy that I can get pregnant but this is so so frustrating and disappointing. We will of course just move on as we always do and hopefully do another FET when my period returns so grateful for another 4 chances (we had 5 frozen embryos) but scared it will keep happening.

Are the reason behind chemicals just because the embryo has chromosomal problems or are there other reasons? I know they are super common but it feels sucky that we keep having them (that or ectopics!) and that it's my body/wombs fault. I just feels there's something else that is wrong that we haven't discovered yet or something.

We're going through NHS funded treatment so they don't offer genetic testing but weirdly the other clinic that's attached to my clinic (where I get the transfer done) does offer it (plus my embryos are being stored there which is useful) so I am going to ask my clinic if we can maybe get the remaining ones tested mid way through NHS funding (obvs we we would pay) so that could be an option.

Just feeling so deflated. It took us 8 months to get to transfer from starting IVF as I has OHSS after ER and lining issues when preparing for my FET, plus I've had fertility issues for 3 years prior to that.

Sorry to go on, I just needed to rant to this wonderful and understanding community.

[Redbadger]

Sending you lots of positivity...Did you test again?

Xx

[Esb27 in reply to Redbadger]

Thanks Redbadger.

Yes just tested, it’s sooo faint now so disappointing.

Guessing I should stop the progesterone? It’s so hard when you can’t speak to your clinic due to a national holiday! Xx

Images are hidden by default on this community. Learn more

Show imageRemember my choice on this device

[Twiglet2]

I’m so sorry I’ve recently had this too and it is genuinely harder than a negative result for me….like you said Chemicals are most likely due to the embryo not being quite right is what the clinic has told me but you could also discuss things like your progesterone levels if that’s not already been covered, but it does sound like the conditions are right for implantation. My clinic aren’t keen on testing embryos once they are already frozen (due to the damage than can be done to them in thaw and re freeze) unless there is a known chromosome issue but given you have had quite a few chemicals perhaps they will advise you of that route. I would definitely have a consultation with them and see what they suggest. Testing doesn’t stop the possibility of chemicals but it does reduce the chances of it happening again so I get why you would go down that route.

I’m so so sorry and I’m thinking of you on what must be a really difficult time 😥 xx

[Esb27 in reply to Twiglet2]

Thanks Twiglet2, I appreciate the kind words.

Yeah I was thinking about low progesterone levels, so annoying the timing of this cos I haven’t been able to test it (also my clinic doesn’t do them anyways but I would have gone to the EPU). Maybe it’s not that but I will bring it up.

Interesting to hear about the genetic testing, guess unfreezing them then re-freezing is such a risk so I understand. I’ll ask but I guess we’ll just have to do the remaining 4 untested and see what happens.

When did you start bleeding? My test is very light today, two days after the original OTD and I’m getting a few cramps and tiredness/nausea but so far that’s it. For my last chemical, that was natural I think I only discovered really late as I got a super faint line then bled/had bad cramps that same day so was a bit different to this. Just desperate to put this behind me already. Xx

[Twiglet2 in reply to Esb27]

I totally understand I was the exact same once I knew it was a chemical. When I got a negative on clear blue digital on 13dpt after testing positive from day 6 but starting going backwards day 11. The same day the digital went to negative it was a really faint line on FRER (like yours today) so I stopped my progesterone pessaries and injections and got my period the next day but the last time I had a chemical it was a few more days later once I had stopped (last time wasn’t as early though I was over 6 weeks before that one went to negative and had been spotting). the spotting is why I am on both types of progesterone and had no spotting this time so I am fairly certain even without the test (our clinic lab was shut too) it wasn’t progesterone related for me.

I know it’s probably not something you want to hear right now but wanted to share a positive with you after my chemical in early 2020 our next transfer (from the same round of embryos) was successful so I know for certain that just because this one didn’t work for you it doesn’t mean there isn’t your wee miracle sitting waiting on ice from the same collection 🤗💜 xx

[Esb27 in reply to Twiglet2]

Ah that's interesting! I'm now 13dpt too. Maybe I should stop the pessaries. Feel like I should consult with my clinic before I do that but that's silly isn't it? I'm clearly not pregnant anymore so should just stop and get the bleed to happen. Guessing you have to wait until the cycle after that bleed to re-start another IVF cycle?

No that's lovely to hear, thank you for sharing that 😊 it's really good to hear positive stories as having a chemical can feel sooo negative and sad. Bloody hope one of our little frosties will make it 🥰

Sorry you've been through it again recently, such a b*tch isn't it!! xx

[Twiglet2 in reply to Esb27]

as mine was a fresh transfer I was due to stop the meds either way anyways at that point as test day was 10dpt but if it’s frozen your clinic may say to keep taking them until test day or a few days after. For me I just like to move on physically once it’s confirmed, though I get why they say to keep going with meds for a few days.

I’m not sure what we are going to do next as we have none frozen so we need to have a chat in a few weeks but yeah normally if we have Frosties it’s the bleed after the withdrawal bleed we can phone to start again at our clinic xx

[Esb27 in reply to Twiglet2]

Ah right. our OTD was Friday and when I emailed them obvs i only had just got the positive so they just said to wait and take it day by day. It wasn't until the next day I realised something was wrong but they were off for the weekend/new year so it's kinda been bad timing. I think i'm going to email them now and I think they are back on Wednesday so will probs stop them tomorrow once I get the full blown negative.

Thanks for the info - good luck with your chat and fingers crossed you get your 2nd rainbow! xx

[Lolalules]

I’m so sorry to hear - I’ve had chemicals and they’re devastating. I know you’re having nhs-funded treatment so I’m guessing that you’ve had a lot of the initial testing but I’d ask your GP to refer you to tommys miscarriage clinic. You’re eligible after 3 miscarriages and they offer further in-depth testing plus support you through the first trimester of a pregnancy if successful. My GP didn’t know about it but i pushed and referral took a few months x

[Esb27 in reply to Lolalules]

Hi Lolalubes, thanks for your message. Sorry you have gone through it too, it's so depressing! Have you managed to have a successful pregnancy after your chemicals?

Yeah we've had the initial testing from a fertility doctor, who advised us to do IVF and referred us for NHS funded treatment. Funnily enough I was looking at the Tommy's site yesterday so I think I will try to get a referral. Do you reckon you could do IVF NHS funding and Tommy's recurrent miscarriage clinic at the same time?! x

[Lolalules in reply to Esb27]

yeah it’s not fun! We’ve had 5 losses total - and it’s early days but I’m currently 18 weeks pregnant following a FET.

Are you currently unexplained fertility or do you have some factors that are impacting? You can do NHS funded and tommy’s at the same time as they do different things. The testing offered by tommys goes beyond what’s offered by standard testing so the nhs funding wouldn’t cover it. Definitely push for the referral - everything helps in this instance! X

[Esb27 in reply to Lolalules]

Oh 5 sounds horrid but 18 weeks sounds amazing, congrats!! What made this one stick in the end?

They just call it sub fertility as i've managed to 'get' pregnant 6 times now but it's either been in the wrong place (ectopic) or an early loss (chemical) so something isn't right. All the other tests we did with the fertility doctor were normal luckily but they only do a certain amount. The IVF referral was more for the ectopics as my chances of having another one naturally is 25% but with IVF it drops to 3%.

Yeah deffo pushing for Tommys now!! x

[Lolalules in reply to Esb27]

Thank you! The first two were before i had my tube removed… the second three we don’t know the reason really but obvs with ivf there’s always the chance that some of them aren’t chromosonally ok. No idea what made it stick so far! Perhaps just luck/chance with this one, but the tests at tommys gave reassurance that we weren’t ’wasting’ embryos if there was something underlying. Really hope they manage to help you out! X

[Esb27 in reply to Lolalules]

Oh interesting! I guess one probs would just stick eventually, you just have no idea how many you have to go through to test that out! Sorry one last question haha, how long did the referral to Tommy's take until you got an appointment? x

[Lolalules in reply to Esb27]

yeah the true pain of fertility is that it’s so hard to know what works! We did a lot more supplements on our last round (hubby on proxeed, me on proceive and ubiquinol), but otherwise yeah so hard to know as you just try everything to make it work as soon as possible. Ahh I’m not sure but i think maybe a couple of months max. It didn’t take an incredibly long time x

[Esb27 in reply to Lolalules]

So true!

Oh fab, that's not bad, I was expecting 6 months! x

[Ranchu90]

I know how devastating it it. I had 3 chemicals before my rainbow twins that are 14 months now. As other said Tommy's is a perfect option for you, in case your GP won't refer you please be aware that you can self refer so don't give up. Tommy's are doing an amazing job and all for free. The other thing I wanted to mention is that not only abnormal embryos can lead to a chemical pregnancy, there are so many other factors that can contribute to that. I transferred a PGS tested embryos and still had a chemical. Only when doctors introduced steroids, antibiotics, blood thinner, immunosuppressants I managed to carry the pregnancy to term. I did all the tests under the sun just to find the answer, including genetic ones.

Hope you will find the answer soon also. Take care 💕

[Esb27 in reply to Ranchu90]

Oh wow, congrats on the twins!! At least you got your rainbows out of interest did you go to Tommy's to determine that you needed all those things to get a pregnancy to stick or did you go with your clinic?

Yeah I think Tommys is definitely the right move now, 3 natural chemicals and 1 IVF chemical (along with 2 ectopics) isn't right, I can feel it in my bones.

When you say you can self refer to Tommys, how do you do this? On their website it just says that you need your GP's referral? I wonder if it's quicker to do self or GP referral?

Thank you so much for your comment, it really helps to hear from people who have experienced chemicals x

[Ranchu90 in reply to Esb27]

Thank you! I had my treat done in Spain because of pandemic I couldn't travel for all the tests that been recommended to me so I tried to look for options here in UK to keep the ball rolling. I contacted numerous clinics for checking whether I have adenomyosis (lining inflamation) and elevated NK cells. In Coventry I knew about a very well known doctor that wasn't easy to reach Dr Quinby. I googled her email address and I dropped her an email without having any hopes really. She replied to me next day and after that she called me. I participated to a trial that she was conducted and because of that I was eligible to have free medication and scans during first weeks of my pregnancy (cyclogest, blood thinner, steroids etc). I don't know which clinic is closer to you but have a look online and send them a direct email saying about your problems or some other clinics have online option for self referral, you have to fill in one form and they will contact you. Also testing your embryos is necessary to rule out chromosome abnormalities, even though thawing and refreezing is a risky job, is really worth it. Believe me saves all you disappointments and shortens your absolutely crazy journey.

If you have further questions please feel free to ask.

[Esb27 in reply to Ranchu90]

Oh that was lucky! I think i've heard of her actually. I'll have a look though, i'm closest to the London one. Yeah agreed, genetic testing is very important, it's definitely something I want to explore!!

Thanks for all your help and advice x

[Strawberry17]

I'm so sorry, I've had two chemicals and it's awful. The reason for ours in the end was DNA fragmentation in my husbands sperm. We ended up going down the donor sperm route which luckily was successful for us. Sending hugs xx

[Esb27 in reply to Strawberry17]

thanks Strawberry17. Sorry for your losses too. How did you know to test for that?! My partner has had the all clear with the initial tests you do with a fertility check but nothing in depth xx

[Strawberry17 in reply to Esb27]

Thank you. Our consultant advised it as our fertilisation rate was quite low. 13 eggs, 5 fertilised and only 1 blastocyst. My husband also had low sperm count and low mobility. We had to pay privately to have it tested but at least we then knew why our pregnancies were never getting beyond 5 weeks. x

[Esb27 in reply to Strawberry17]

ahh right, that’s good the knew what to suggest and it worked!! X

[Boo718]

I’m so sorry. I hope you’re ok. I was just wondering if you have done the era test? I had 2 bfn then 2 chemical we then did the era and realised I needed an extra day of progesterone. I’m now 18 weeks xxx I don’t know if that will help you xxx

[Esb27 in reply to Boo718]

Thank you. Not yet, it’s definitely high up on my list of things to do, but just waiting to chat to my clinic to see what they advise. I think if I do it, I’ll do the trio so ERA, Emma and Alice (if the clinic agrees). It’s crazy to think that that extra day of progesterone was all you needed. You wouldn’t think it would be that easy! Congrats on your pregnancy though 😊 xxx

[Boo718 in reply to Esb27]

I did the trio. They weren’t too keen on the era and kept saying you’ve had implantation you don’t need it and I was like just do it your doing the other 2 anyway. So glad we did. Thank you. Yeh it’s been one hell of a journey and you think why didn’t I do that test years ago 🤦‍♀️😂 xxx good luck xxx

[Esb27 in reply to Boo718]

That's good you followed your gut!! It's so hard to know whether or not to do another transfer via IVF first just to see if I get lucky or to just do the tests first. This is the first early loss via IVF, but not the first generally so something can't be right. I'm in such a predicament. My follow up appointment isn't until 30th Jan and I've no idea how quickly I can do the tests as I have to go to the clinic I get my transfer done at (which is different to my main clinic as they don't offer the transfer procedure there) - no clue if they have long waiting times or not as they are a popular clinic plus my new cycle will be starting 3-7 days after my follow up so not much time to organise said tests! Urgh this is a mindfield xxx