It frustrates me so much when very well-meaning people try and give advice. Advice that would work very well for someone not burdened with depression, anxiety, OCD, and insomnia. I'm a very intelligent person, I've done research, I tried so many things, but trying is the very hardest thing. When trying to brush my teeth is hard, trying your exercise routine is not a solution.
"Logic" doesn't help me, or I'd be able to logically maneuver my way out of depression and anxiety in the first place. Depression/Anxiety aren't logic deficits, they're chemical deficits.
Stop giving advice. Offer to help or walk away.
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TheMicrobe
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Depression and anxiety are more than just a chemical deficit. I don’t strive to be logical, I work to be rational. Acceptance through honesty and humility can take a person to a better place. Both anxiety and depression thrive on a battle. They love the stress and frustration, leading to irrational self talk. Rational thinking takes away the power gained in a fight.
I don't understand how else to think, I'm a logical person... Yes, depression and anxiety can be more than just chemicals, but scientifically speaking that's what they are. I'm a scientist. If I can't think logically/rationally (same thing), how am I supposed to think? Irrationally? I don't understand.
I see rational thinking differing from logical thought because rational is meant to be reasonable. Logic is rigid. Rational is picking your battles. Rational allows for compromise. Rational allows for emotional control, logic doesn’t care.
Logical is “stand alone”, extrinsic. Rational is “engaging”, intrinsic.
I understand and respect your intelligence, it took me a while to get mine out of the way. We are dealing with not only emotion, but extreme emotion. Mental stability is the goal. Contentment and serenity are the rewards.
Your last 2 sentences are confusing, “Stop giving advice. Offer to help or walk away.” Offering to help usually entails giving advice and support. For someone who’s, “very intelligent” you sound like you couldn’t fight your way out of a wet paper bag. But, that’s just my opinion, which I have a right to have. Looks like I’m, “walking away.”
Haha, I guess you are proverbially walking away, but I'll offer a little clarity if you care to read... or not. As I had just made my point that advice was not advantageous at all, the help I was referring to (but didn't want to make a superfluous post) would be active help. If someone says they have a hard time making Dr appointments, offer to help them make said appointment, or even drive them. Not say something to the effect of "just think of how much better you'll be once you go," or "just pick up the phone, that's the first step, then it's easy."
Deducing that words can be condescending and utterly unhelpful, actions can show the most care.
However, non-judgmental listening is always the foundation for anyone who is struggling. Certainly steer clear of insults and assumptions.
You seem to be lacking common sense as this forum is nothing but words since we’re online. Action is best when instituted by the person who’s suffering from depression/anxiety, not everyone around them. Said person needs to feel the sense of accomplishment through their own action in helping themselves. Depending on others helps keep us stuck/sick. Helping yourself is the way to healing...that’s my advice...haha (as you would say).
I hear ya sista.... anyone can sound intelligent....by using an extensive vocabulary, but some of the smartest people I know... and that actually is a very extensive list...as I did some computer upgrade for a friend of mines dad who was an atomic physicist and taught at UC Berkley, who worked with Oppenheimer back in the day,.. I'd call him a smart guy. So... there are a few smart people here on this site... and there is nothing more intelligent than closing your mouth and listening to good advice...there's an old saying: 'you'll attract more bees with honey than vinegar'.... I think anyone would get a good run for their money trying to have a 'pissing contest ' here... I wouldn't go up against any of these gals personally.... I respect them very much.
Wow !! People like you are a huge part of the problem !! Who do you think you are ?? We're not here to put people down !! This is a "support" group. Maybe you just need to leave !!
Trying to understand... So what does help look like to you if it's not in the form of advice? Also remember that you don't have to take anyone's advice. And if you don't want anyone to give advice to you then you can put that in all of your posts.
I understand. Its frustrating especially when you tell someone if you want to help me please do this and they do whatever is easiest for them or give advice like just exercise.
• in reply to
I feel quite lucky and appreciative when someone offers me advice. If I don’t think it applies to me or isn’t useful, I don’t have to employ it. Asking for help to be given only in a way that I think suits me is closed-minded and most likely going to be ineffective. Sometimes we can’t see ourselves as others can. If I want advice, then I want to hear what others see in my words and what they think, otherwise, I wouldn’t be here seeking advice!
That is the smartest thing I've read .... hmmm... good advice. I didn't start to get better till I checked my ego and smarts at the door and started listening to the truth others had to offer... and yes... take what you need and leave the rest.That was the smartest thing I ever did.
I am NOT trying to say that advice is bad, and never, ever useful. But LISTENING to the person who relays their struggle to you is essential before offering it. I do try to be very open minded, but it can be frustrating when people seem to think they have the answer to what you've been struggling with for years. "Just try this, it helped me." I thank them for their time, but if they don't understand where I'm coming from, how can they know what will help me? I am relaying a frustration, not a law. Please LISTEN to those around you before offering any help, especially advice.
I understand where your frustration is coming from. And, you’re right that some don’t like to hear advice, though this site is where most members come to get advice. In that case, how could it benefit you to forgive those who ask for it & those who kindly gives it? For, healthy & fitting advice is a good thing, building wisdom.
From my understanding, counseling & coaching are different in that counseling gives advice. And, coaching during the sessions, whether individual or group setting, uses a different set of techniques that helps you to get to the best available options for you on your own. Considering the difference, in what ways do you believe coaching may be a more desirable option for you, being that you’d prefer no direct advice?
Neither way, coaching or counseling, is wrong. I do both depending on clients’ preferences &/or goals.
I think it’s truly based on what each individual wants. For, some welcome advice & others, like yourself prefer something else.
The ball is in your court to decide & move on from there. May you discover all you need on your journey.
well said....and from someone in the field which is also very helpful advice.
Why are you here, Personally I cannot really understand what you want.
If you find these sites are offering questionable help or information you need to consider how you wish to proceed with your Mental Health Condition.
I am a firm believer in Diversions, you do activities you enjoy. This may take your mind of your mental health condition.
If you are introduced to a Therapist, will you disagree with someone qualified to suggest ways of controlling your fears and concerns. Would you feel if you were hospitalized that would be the best way to move on in the long term.
Advice and discussion with like minded patients comes forth ideas you can try. They can explain how they have managed to make things better. The best way in many cases is to talk problems out.
How would you prefer to be helped , You are tying peoples hands to give support and that just leads to an irritation from you the sufferer.
To be honest your best way of getting help is via your Doctor and various Specialists Your Surgery can offer you.
In your case I reserve judgement I hope you get the help you deserve. You need to remember when push comes to shove the Specialists can only introduce coping techniques you will find useful. However it comes about face, The Patient needs to contribute to that cure.
I hear you loud and clear Microb. Your struggling and everything is overwhelming. I can imagine that the responses here are overwhelming. I can imagine how irritating it is to get suggestions, when it’s difficult to brush your teeth, as the thoughts just keep coming. I have these issues too, all the same Dx. I hear your frustration in this thread. The only way out of this is through it, compassionately.
Absolutely right.... it's like in program your told if your depressed, your just not working your program hard enough... if praying and working program would be all we needed to heal us... there would be no need for this site... and everyone would be healed.....
You were born with a brain...and given free will to use it to figure out stuff... and as the water level is rising.... and you keep saying 'god will save me'...each time a row boat goes by to pick up you....well...you know the rest of that joke....we have choices that only we can make for our own wellness path.
I wont give u advice, ill tell you what gets me out bed. self talk- ever morning I tell myself " i can do this. I am Important." I set daily goals. one goal is do something that makes me happy no matter what it is. I love going to the movies but I have a hard time leaving the house time to time. so I MAKE MYSELF GO.
When I am not at work i do my hair put make up on and dress, half of the time I dont go out side.I do it for myself.
EVERY DAY
I WRITE DOWN WHAT MAKES HAPPY.....(NOW) SHORT TERM
ME: going to the movies, making art, cooking new recipes
WHAT WILL MAKE ME HAPPY..... LONG TERM
Me: being a Rn , getting a better car
How will I get there : study every day, Finish school :bsn.
Fauxartist, I personally think the Microbe wanted to begin an intellectually challenging argument to take his mind off the struggles he is having and I think it was a good idea.
But as for prayer, it depends on what you believe prayer is for, if you believe God will actually do what you ask, if you think God is willing and able.
I believe prayer is to stay in connection with our creator; I believe God is all powerful; I believe God wants to help us in our struggles; I believe that He works with us in accordance with the power we have in us; I believe that sometimes it takes a while because God has to strengthen us first; I believe staying in connection with God allows Him to speak to us to guide us in our decisions to get to whatever we’ve asked; I do believe God can give a divine touch but we have to be strong enough to receive it so we can maintain it; if we could only believe, all things are possible. I believe God is a spirit and we are spiritual beings. I believe He is Omnipotent. I believe......
Okay... I'm done....I am going to stop with this thread... some of the comments are just way too off for me to continue.... simple....site rules... no politics ....no religion.... no trolling.... peace and love to all....
A lot of folk on here want advice, and it is given with a graceful heart, if this site is not for you, fine, walk away, but don’t stop others from asking/seeking help.
I apologize if you think I am trying to stop others form helping! Perhaps my message was misconstrued. My point was that, if you want to help, you need to find out how that person needs help. Telling them what to do, when *doing* anything is incredibly hard, is more frustrating than enlightening. I was relaying a personal frustration, not a universal law. I am not for a second suggesting that if someone asks for advice that someone should not give it to them.
absolutely agree.... we have to let people know what we need before anyone can begin to know what someone else might need. And some times we just want to be listened to and not be told what to do or given any feedback... that's really okay too. But kindness does not equate weakness... state what you need, and just take what you need, and leave the rest.
I’m sorry that you’re frustrated with people giving you advice. I’ve always tried not to do that, but to suggest what has worked for me. We are all a supportive little bunch here & we do mean well. I hope things get better for you. <3
Reading your contributions sounds like you will just question everything and gain nothing.
A discussion you ask for is of a hypothetical nature and you can chew over everything until nothing will help. This type of attitude just frustrates the help given and it will be just the same in Therapy. Your conversation will become hypothetical where no advice can be given. We are generally Patients on this site and many will address your questioning in a straight, honest way, your reply could end up as a throw back where help becomes problematic. Personally I feel you are not here for ideas to get better. Given that a tussle with Professional Therapists may be the best place for you. The problem in the UK time is short and therapy is rationed. You will need to work with someone who has time to push the envelope.
Many sufferers will question everything, you are not alone however this attitude can effect to much time if it goes on to long.
Personally chewing the fat wastes the time for people who need help and will work in a constructive way Consider your needs and spit them out. I personally do not have time to keep discussing on case where no help on this site can be given without going around in circles. It will not be of any help if you contradict people and their concerns. It may distract their recovery, by going around in circles.
People need to get well here a distraction like you suggest will not work. Professionals may have more answers for your questions
Wow, I missed something clearly, I’m trying to read where I asked you a question, oh that’s right I didn’t. This feed is not about you or your feelings. This feed is directed towards Microbe. If you can’t identify with him or I that’s your issue. Stop telling people to leave the forum, it’s not your place. Everyone has a place here. No one is any more important than the next.
Yeah like we have no idea what it feels like to have anxiety,depression,ocd and insomnia. You are the only one that suffers from it? How do you think we ever came to be on this forum in the first place? From reaching out for help from our own suffering. Your angry post because you’re not getting the perfect answers will probably just make some not want to say anything at all. Who wants to be micro-managed when they’re only trying to help you.
To be so intelligent—your post doesn’t make a lot of sense to me and honestly sounds unappreciative.
I hear ya Glendajean: nobody knows what someone else needs unless you tell them... and I think a lot of folks here have a pretty high IQ... so there are a lot of big brains here that do know what they are talking about because they live with this disease, and some of us have decades of experience....
I was once told... 'you'll never learn if you don't listen'... and: ' those of you who think you know everything just annoy those of us who do know'....
Hmm, The Microbe, that's an interesting name, doesn't sound very friendly 🤔Maybe this site is not for you as the entire point of it is to support and advise each other. We can't offer practical help because we're not in the same vicinity and if you're as intelligent as you say you are then surely you must realise that. There are different types of intelligence and to be honest I don't see much evidence of emotional intelligence in your posts. You seem to expect people to automatically know what you specifically need to do to help yourself as an individual even though you provide very little information for us to go on. To me, that suggests a lack of social imagination and empathy, which is synonymous with asperger syndrome, high functioning autism, attachment disorder and personality disorders including narcissistic personality disorder and psychopathy, particularly in intelligent people and those who had a very strict upbringing with little attention paid to their emotional needs. Especially as you give the impression of disliking talking about your feelings and favour logic. Any of the above can be underlying causes of anxiety and depression. It's not my intention to insult you, you just strike me as the kind of person who appreciates straight talking so I have tried to approach this from a logical point of view. I don't know you and all your personal circumstances so I'm afraid I'm unable to give you any tailor made advice but perhaps giving some thought to what you hope to achieve by posting future rants would be a good start.
I hear you! I have struggled with this very conflict. Can my anxiety be resolved with a simple "mind over matter" solution? Not really. Though I do believe that the buildup of negative thinking in my mind doesn't help the situation! Over the past 10 years, I have learned to cope with my "issues" but never seem to fully escape them. There is one thing that I am completely sure of: I am not less of a person just because I experience anxiety and depression. I have been gifted with these struggles that have ultimately made me a stronger and more compassionate person. I am wired with certain default reactions and tendencies by both nature and nurture. While some of these tendencies I can overcome, the core of who I am is God-given. I am not permanently defective, but I am miraculously me! This is truth, not logic.
I know what you mean...it feels like a misunderstanding in language because others are unable to really relate unless they have been there. Just like talking to someone with a different definition of the same word lol
Hello TheMicrobe, I see that it has been two years since this post. I just saw it today, so I thought I would ask after how you're feeling. How are things these days ? Take care.
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I'm not "fine"
I'm not a victim 
I'm depressed with little support
Depression Relapse...help?
I'm not doing well
