First time posting. I am going for a blood test on the 24th at my GP surgery. I suspect I am hypothyroid after gaining around 45 pounds since 2019. I had a well-woman NHS check-up in 2019 and the doctor said my TSH levels were off, but not to an extent that needed medication. They said to come back if I felt any symptoms, but then the pandemic happened. Apart from the weight gain, I have had no other symptoms until recently, so it's time to check again.
I currently take B3 (niacin), Vit D and K2 MK7, Vitamin K2 MK4, selenium, Vit C with zinc, and berberine. Should I stop taking these before the blood test?
I have been eating carnivore for over 5 1/2 years (meat, eggs and dairy) and think this way of eating has helped to slow the hypo progress. I suspect I was already mildly hypo before. I lost 57 pounds in the first 3 years of carnivore, but the weight has been steadily creeping back on regardless of how I tweak my diet or how much exercise I take.
Any advice would be greatly received
55 year old, female, post-menopausal.
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meatymum
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I currently take B3 (niacin), Vit D and K2 MK7, Vitamin K2 MK4, selenium, Vit C with zinc, and berberine. Should I stop taking these before the blood test?
No, it's only Biotin or B Complex or any supplement containing biotin that needs to be stopped. You can continue with them but take them after the test on the day.
How much of these supplements are you taking?
Why are you taking them?
Did you test before you started them?
Why both forms of Vit K2?
As you are taking Vit D, are you testing twice a year to check your level?
When taking Vit D, besides Vit K2, another important cofactor is magnesium as this helps the body convert D3 into it's usable form. Are you taking magnesium?
Always advised here, when having thyroid tests:
* Blood draw no later than 9am. This is because TSH is highest early morning and lowers throughout the day. If looking for a diagnosis of hypothyroidism, an increase in dose of Levo or to avoid a reduction then we need the highest possible TSH
* Nothing to eat or drink except water before the blood draw. This is because eating can lower TSH and coffee can affect TSH.
* If you take Biotin or a B Complex containing Biotin (B7), leave this off for 7 days before any blood test. This is because if Biotin is used in the testing procedure it can give false results (most labs use biotin).
These are patient to patient tips which we don't discuss with phlebotomists or doctors.
Mostly as a way to protect my health going into older age. My mother has had two small heart attacks and has now developed vascular dementia, so I want to do everything I can to reduce my chances of following along the same path.
My older sister was also fitted with a pacemaker last year. So there is definitely a history of heart issues in my family.
After my 2019 NHS well woman test, I had a total cholesterol number of 21.5. This obviously concerned my doctor, but I know that total numbers are meaningless. It is the HDL to Trig ratio that is important, but as they didn't do a particle test, I cannot draw any conclusions from that.
I suspect that at the time of the test, after 3 years of carnivore, that my LDL particles would have been large and fluffy and my HDL and trigs to be healthy. It is also very common for people following keto and carnivore diets to have raised LDL. I am not concerned as LDL doesn't cause CVD.
I have also read that hypothyroid can also result in higher cholesterol levels – do you find this to be the case?
Did you test before you started them?
No. I didn't test them before starting. I would consider having my labs done independently. Could you recommend one to me and what labs to order?
Why both forms of Vit K2?
There is a lot of evidence that Vitamin MK-4 helps fight against cancer and Alzheimer's disease. It also has associated benefits including maintenance of bone density and prevention of osteoporosis and cardiovascular diseases.
With my family history, I am just trying to take some precautions, even if much of it may be anecdotal. I do believe in N=1, and am very in-tune with my body so can tell when something is off.
MK-7 you can only obtain from fermented foods such as natto and miso, so as I don't eat these on a carnivore diet so I am just covering all bases. I also believe the two types have different half-lives.
Vitamin D and vitamin K2 act synergistically and are important for proper mineral absorption and metabolism.
As you are taking Vit D, are you testing twice a year to check your level?
Again, no. That is something that I wasn't aware of – thanks for this. With the pandemic going on I have been reluctant to approach my GP to request any tests. It is something I should do with a private test I think.
When taking Vit D, besides Vit K2, another important cofactor is magnesium as this helps the body convert D3 into it's usable form. Are you taking magnesium?
I don't take any supplemental magnesium. I think I get plenty from my diet and because I don't eat any magnesium-blocking substances such as sugar, lectins, oxalates etc. I may be getting enough.
I eat between 1 ½ to 2 pounds of meat and eggs per day and fermented dairy (kefir) so I wonder if I should supplement with magnesium?
I really appreciate your time and help with this. I am having my bloods drawn at 10 am on the 24th. I couldn't get an earlier appointment, so I hope the timing of the blood draw won't negatively affect the results.
I can't address everything you have mentioned I'm afraid.
I have also read that hypothyroid can also result in higher cholesterol levels – do you find this to be the case?
Yes, raised cholesterol is a symptom of hypothyroidism.
Vit K2 MK4 = 200 mcg
MK-7 you can only obtain from fermented foods such as natto and miso, so as I don't eat these on a carnivore diet so I am just covering all bases. I also believe the two types have different half-lives.
Yes, MK4 and MK7 do have different half lives. MK4 has a short life-span, it has a half life of about 1.5 hours and needs multiple doses during the day when supplementing. MK7 has a half life of about 72 hours, so a once daily dose is enough. I did take a combined MK4 and MK7 supplement but I now only take MK7. I understand that the amount of MK4 needed is a lot more than MK7 on a daily basis but I no longer have my notes on that.
Vit D should be tested because this is a fat soluble vitamin and any excess is stored and can lead to toxicity. We should base our dose on what we need to achieve the level recommended by the Vit D Society and Grassroots Health (100-150nmol/L, with Grassroots Health's recent blog post recommending at least 125nmol/L). 1,000iu D3 is generally a maintenance dose for someone with a decent level already, this may or may not be right for you. You may need more, you may need a lot more, you'll only know if your test. GPs are reluctant to test Vit D as they say it's an expensive test. If this is the case for you then this can be done with a private fingerprick blood spot test with an NHS lab which offers this test to the general public:
If you want to test all the key nutrients rather than just Vit D, then the cheapest way is with a thyroid/vitamin bundle from one of our recommended labs (Medichecks is the cheapest):
Both tests include the full thyroid and vitamin panel. They are basically the same test with just a few small differences:
Blue Horizon includes Total T4 (can be useful but not essential). Medichecks doesn't include this test.
B12 - Blue Horizon does Total B12 which measures bound and unbound (active) B12 but doesn't give a separate result for each. Medichecks does Active B12.
Total B12 shows the total B12 in the blood. Active B12 shows what's available to be taken up by the cells. You can have a reasonable level of Total B12 but a poor level of Active B12. (Personally, I would go for the Active B12 test.)
Blue Horizon include magnesium but this is serum magnesium and is an unreliable test (the better test is red cell magnesium) so don't let this sway your decision, it also tests cortisol but that's a random cortisol test and to make any sense of it you'd need to do it fasting before 9am I believe.
As for selenium, I've seen it said that 100mcg daily is a safe amount without testing, some say 200mcg. I take 100mcg and I have tested since taking this amount and mine is actually over range. If you want to test this then Cerascreen do it cheaper than any other lab but it's sent to Germany so there's a delay in testing the sample.
You can get selenium from Brazil nuts as long as they've been grown in selenium rich soil, the package needs to say this and preferably the amount of selenium per serving. Members have given me the following information of some Brazil nuts available here in the UK:
Apparently Sainsburys SO organic brazil nuts contain 50mcg selenium per 30g serving of nuts
One member has said that M&S Natural Brazil Nuts say "harvested by hand in the Amazon forest and naturally high in selenium".
Also, check out Aldi's "The Foodie Market" Brazil nuts, the packaging is said to show selenium content as 79mcg per 30g serving.
Another one is 'My Garden of Eden' Brazil nuts from Home Bargains.. They say "High in Selenium and high in vitamin E" on the front of the packet and the Nutritional Information says "one serving (25g) gives 63ug of Selenium".
Thank you so much for your very detailed reply. You have given me a lot to think about and a lot of choices regarding lab tests. I appreciate the links too!
I will take all your advice on board and when my GP calls me on the 29th with my results, I will request a copy of my test. I didn't know that the NHS did private testing! That is good to know.
I am happy to continue to take selenium pills if they are helpful. I won't go down the route of eating nuts (not carnivore). Nuts always gave me indigestion anyway when I used to eat them.
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