Antibody results not sure how to interpret

Does anyone understand what these results are indicating. Have added 12.25 mg T3 for 5 weeks having dropped Levo from 150 to 125 mg. Taking B12 and B complex for a deficiency which seems to have improved. But I really don't know what the really high antibody levels are telling me....how do I get this under control?

TSH 0.07 0.27 - 4.2

T4 total. 120.2. 64.5-142.0

Free T4. 20.81 12-22

Free T3. 4.79 3.1 - 6.8

Anti thyroidperoixidase > 600 <34

Anti thyroidglobulin >4000.00 <115

B12 551 <140-725

Folate. >45.4 8.83-60.8

Ferritin 60.6 20-150

CRP 0.5 <5.0

I have felt better since going gluten free and the T3 has improved my constant neck and arm pains and headaches.......but mostly feel pretty awful, sluggish, achey, low body temps, joint pain and itchy feet. I wonder whether to increase the T3. Will this reduce the antibodies ? Any help gratefully received.

11 Replies

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  • Wantie,

    When medicating T3, TSH level often drops and T4 result becomes meaningless.

    Your T3 level is still low so you have room to increase T3 dose and reduce T4 further.

    Elevated thyroid antibodies denotes Hashimotos and can cause inflammation in the body which can have a profound effect on all aspects of thyroid metabolism and physiology.

    Inflammation suppresses the hypothalamus-pituitary-thyroid (HPT) axis and so disrupts the production and regulatory mechanisms of thyroid hormones. Thyroid medication will increase the levels of T4 and possibly T3, but it doesn’t address the other effects of HPT axis suppression.

    Inflammation can also decrease the number and sensitivity of thyroid hormone receptors, which means it doesn’t matter how much thyroid meds we take, the cells won’t be able to use it. It also decreases the conversion of T4 to T3.

    Are you supplementing selenium ? ? ...

    .

    Hashimotos

    thyroiduk.org.uk/tuk/about_...

    .

    Thyroid and Gluten Connection

    chriskresser.com/the-gluten...

  • Thanks for that Radd, do you have any more information about the resulting issues of a high antibody count? I am currently taking selenium in the form of 5 Brazil nuts a day but do have some 200 mg capsules. I've been on levo for 10 years and don't see why it's all gone wrong recently. Having said that, I recognize I have complained periodically of symptoms but been staunchly ignored by medical profession. Is it just that ageing, being postmenopausal and having been on a slow decline as the body depletes it's capacity to respond and deal with metabolic issues, eventually takes its toll?

  • Wantie Does the packaging of your Brazil nuts say they have been grown in selenium rich soil? If not then they won't contain any selenium. If it does, you should only eat 2 a day which should give approximately the recommended amount of 200mcg.

    The only sure way of getting an accurate amount of selenium is to supplement.

  • radd, what does this mean?

    'Thyroid medication will increase the levels of T4 and possibly T3, but it doesn’t address the other effects of HPT axis suppression.'

    What's this HPT axis suppression?

  • Gabtek,

    When my thyroid antibodies wouldn’t reduce in spite of feeling and looking well after all gut issues, nutrient deficiencies were addressed together with tolerated thyroid hormone replacement, I investigated the effects of this inflammation.

    TNF is an inflammatory protein (cytokine) involved in systemic inflammation made chiefly of macrophages (type of white blood cell) and its primary role is in the regulation of immune cells. When high it reduces blood levels of T4, T3, TRH and so TSH.

    Although thyroid hormone replacement meds will replace those missing, it fails to address the decreased function in the hypothalamus or pituitary gland.

    Of course should there be is a fault in the hypothalamus//pituitary gland, the TSH becomes meaningless anyway but should there still be a little thyroid gland working and producing a little thyroid stimulation hormone naturally (although not enough to prevent hypothyroidism), then the links below explain how inflammation can decrease this.

    .

    ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/210...

    .

    academic.oup.com/endo/artic...

  • Next time I see the endo, I'll ask her to do antibody testing. To my knowledge this has never been done. I've had all sorts of other antibody testing done in the past and everything, even the esoteric stuff was negative.

    Prolactin was high at diagnosis. Not super high but not normal. Last test done recently prolactin (post menopause) was above top of range. There's no tumour, that was checked a long time ago.

    It's weird because the thyroid gland is normal size, no cysts, no weird stuff and yet it doesn't do anything because TSH is always low. The highest it ever went was back in 1985 when I was off thyroxine and it went to 3.0 and I was dead in the water. fT4 and fT3 were both 'low normal'. A few years ago, TSH of 1.0 = horrible hypothyroid necessitating a serious increase in thryoxine dosage.

    Probably this is a HPT axis problem. And yet, your links indicate that antibodies affect this.

    I'm avoiding the endo as much as possible. I'll have to call soon to book an appointment for August because she's just so popular or unavailable, take your pick.

  • gabtek,

    Although Hashi is the most common reason for hypothyroidism, it is possible to have secondary hypo, maybe with or without thyroid antibodies, as if very low the thyroid destruction would be minimal.

    I agree your results indicate an HPT problem and central hypothyroidism is a name used to cover both secondary hypothyroidism (dodgy pituitary) and tertiary hypothyroidism (dodgy hypothalamus) which both cause low TSH. It is difficult to know what the actually problem is but T4 & especially T3 results are the all important and the meds are the still the same.

    My links only refer to possible inflammation caused by elevated thyroid antibodies and the profound effect this can have on all aspects of thyroid metabolism and physiology.

    I would say it is prudent to have TPOAb & TGAb tested.

  • I edited my comment in regards to prolactin.

    Back in 1984, the working hypothesis once a tumour was not found was Hypothalamic problem.

    My doctor went all anti-HRT after the WHI study. For multiple reasons, she's wrong and I continue with HRT because it keeps the LH, FSH low. I figure, best to not aggravate the pituitary gland seeing as how it's not working properly anyway. For all I know, if I stop the HRT, the LH and FSH might stay low too. Just I'm not in the mood to experiment.

  • Wantie Those high antibodies mean you are positive for autoimmune thyroid disease aka Hashimoto's. This is where antibodies attack the thyroid and gradually destroy it. Hashi's isn't treated, it's the resulting Hypothyroidism that is.

    You can help reduce the antibodies by adopting a strict gluten free diet which has helped many members enormously so keep that up :)

    Gluten/Thyroid connection - chriskresser.com/the-gluten...

    Supplementing with selenium L-selenomethionine 200mcg daily and keeping TSH suppressed also help reduce antibodies.

    Hashi's Information:

    stopthethyroidmadness.com/h...

    stopthethyroidmadness.com/h...

    thyroiduk.org.uk/tuk/about_...

    There is room to increase your T3, an extra 6.25mcg for now, and I would reduce your levo at the same time by 25mcg, and see how things are in 6-8 weeks, test again and maybe tweak meds again. Adding T3 won't reduce antibodies.

    Ferritin needs to be at least 70 for thyroid hormone to work properly, and best for females is 100-130. With your level the easiest way to raise it is by eating liver once a week, either as a meal or include it in casseroles, curry, cottage pie, bolognese, etc. Much easier than fitting in iron supplements around your thyroid meds and other supplements, and no risk of constipation either!

    Have you had Vit D tested? If this is low (recommended level is 100-150nmol/L) that could be the cause of your aches and joint pain.

  • Thanks SeasideSusie. I've been diagnosed hashi for ten years. Does this mean that although on a decent dose of Levo for all those years I've had raging antibodies attacking my thyroid and whatever else for all this time? What controls the production of anti bodies ? I know selenium helps and going gluten free but is that it? I had a recent ultrasound that showed there has been no noticeable change in the size of my thyroid or the goitres, and there are no new ones. Can I take it from that, that my recent spell of ill health that started with digestive problems was the start of a flare up of antibodies? Or is it more likely that the IBS was a result of many years of high undetected levels of antibodies ? I've really only had TSH tested since the early years when the diagnosis was first made.

    I don't mind liver and will certainly do that but I also have a high coefficient of saturation of iron at 55% which is higher than the recommended upper limit for women of 45%. I thought naively this too high coefficient meant I have an overload of iron. Not sure what the relationship between ferritin and the coefficient of saturation is, do you know?

    Can I get the antibodies down any other way? I'm gluten free since beginning of feb and taking selenium. Is the level of antibody linked to adrenals....this is an area I have not checked at all. Many thanks

  • Wantie The nature of Hashimoto's is that the antibodies fluctuate, they will wax and wane and attack your thyroid from time to time, so your symptoms will fluctuate too. To get a better understanding you should check the links I've given, then research further for more information you might want. As I'm not Hashi's I don't have enough knowledge to answer your questions about IBS etc.

    Ferritin is the iron store. To understand more about iron, go to this website and check through the links irondisorders.org/forms/

    Here's another useful link rt3-adrenals.org/Iron_test_...

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