Thai NDT question

I have read so many glowing reviews on Thai NDT. Some prefer Thyroid-S, others Thiroyd or TRMan, but it's difficult to find any negative reviews on any of them.

But some claim that since these brands are available OTC, they are not regulated, and there is no way of knowing exactly what they contain. I get the impression these statements are made by people who are not taking these drugs themselves.

But aren't the FT4 and FT3 levels standardized in these pills; at least that is how I understand it?

40 Replies

  • Well i have been taking the thai ones for the past 5 years..... I havent noticed any great fluctuations so i stay on the same dose.....      The sellers make their money from repeat orders..... I  dont imagine they have much to gain from killing me..... Or failing to make me feel better.....


  • This is from STTM and Dr Lowe, who was one of Thyroiduk's Adviser before his death invented a non-prescription NDT made from grass fed New Zealand Cows. His wife, Tammy, now runs that part of the business. There is other info re the two you mentioned as well on this link:-

  • Thanks for the useful link.

    Some claim that porcine thyroid is closer to human chemistry than bovine thyroid, but maybe that is just a myth...?

  • Some with religious beliefs wouldn't take porcine but can take bovine. Everyone also finds a particular thyroid hormone replacement suits them better than another, whatever we take i.e. levo etc. It can be trial and error I am afraid unless the person is very lucky.

  • I have been on Thiroyd by Greater Pharma (Thailand), Thailand uses this in their hospitals and i felt better on day one of taking it. i haven't tried the other Thai NDT, but, a lot of others on this site have, and i cannot speak for them, but i think it is legit. if you have not found any negative responses, doesn't that in itself tell you something? but if you're looking for a negative response, im sure if you keep looking, you will find one. the NDT i take is not over the counter, so, it is regulated as are most of the ones you listed. i wouldn't buy into the whole "we don't know what they contain" campaign, its a scare tactic, and it could apply to any single pharmaceutical in the world. the porcine they use is from pigs that are raised specifically for this purpose, or else we would all be sick and not better on it. for me, i was so sick, it was worth the cost and the fear to at least try something i had read so much good about, and the fact that it is natural was the deciding factor. im glad i did, i can get up in the morning and not want to go right back to bed, it took away my foggyhead awful feeling the very next day, it has not returned. if you found a place that sells it OTC im sure there are a lot of people here that would love to know which store that was

  • No, you are right, the fact that there are only positive reviews is very telling. Erfa and Armour have been really disappointing, plus they are very expensive...another great thing about Thai NDT is the price.

  • what dose did you take compared to what you used to be on....i used it for a short while hence 1 grain was too little and 2 grain made me have heart paps but test didnt show i went back to synthroid but i am wondering now if i i need to try  again bec of the t3.....

  • thecat,

    have all the NDT you tried have a coating? it seems like some people cannot tolerate the coating or they think they should take it sublingually, which is not the way it is to be taken (i think). I take one that is not coated and its the first one i ever tried, it works for me, i hope you are able to find one that agrees with you. let me know if you want me to PM you my source, id be glad to do so. i went to your page and read that you are concerned about your labs and your TSH being at 0.01. my tsh is 0.04 and i am not worried one single bit, because i feel better, could i have an underlying condition? maybe, but, my thyroid is suppressed after overworking for years. don't let their number bother you, if you feel better on NDT, it means it works.

  • Yes, please PM me your source for NDT! Thanks in advance:-)

  • I am not 100% sure, but I don't think either Armour or Erfa has a coating...? Neither was optimal for me, anyway, although, in retrospect, I actually think Armour was a little more consistent. Maybe I just wasn't taking enough...? I switched to Erfa mainly because of the glowing reviews on STTM, but I never found it to be that great...I started itching terribly on it, and the itching went away if I stopped taking it for a couple of days.

    I think the official advice is to swallow NDT, although I know many prefer to take it sublingually. My doctor, who is on Armour herself, recommends chewing the pills up, and some claim it helps break down the cellulose...

  • There are a few negative comments on some Facebook thyroid groups but on the whole people are happy with the Thai NDTs because one of them usually works, they're easily obtainable and reasonably priced. As far as I know neither of the older ones has been reformulated and caused problems that way - unlike Armour and whatever happened to ERFA, which Health Canada is now investigating. I didn't get on with Thiroyd, it made me dizzy, but I found Thyroid-S to be fine although it took a while to stop worrying about the fillers. I chew the tablets as I did with Armour and ERFA. I am sure that in Thailand drugs are regulated as they are here, one difference seems to be that they don't have to declare fillers as that is considered proprietary information. I was told by someone, I can't remember who though, that the NHS sources some drugs from Thailand. I understand why you're thinking about it though, I now stop and think about everything including what might be in supplements and how reliable they are! 

  • So Health Canada is now looking into it..interesting. I remember when the first complaints appeared, and how Erfa's director at the time denied any reformulation. But it seems obvious something happened to it, and I hope Health Canada will be able to find out what.

  • So do I! If you want to add to the complaints you can do so in this link but you have to say where you got the ERFA from and so I'm still thinking about it. 

  • you are right, not every NDT works for everyone, i guess because i tried 3 different T3, and could not take a single one, finding that Thiroyd GPharma NDT worked was like a miracle for me. i have not noticed a single tablet to be any different than the one before. i went ahead and ordered it from a different source (just so i don't run out) and it is no different than the one i ordered from the first source. but again, we are all different and cannot all tolerate the same thing. also, i was sub-clinical hypothyroid, so that could mean i don't need as much as someone else

    THIROYD (yes, that’s how they spell it) by Greater Pharma Ltd., a leading Thai Pharmaceutical Manufacturer. An email to a patient by Greater Pharma states that “thiroyd” at one grain contains T3 at 8.31 microgram; T4 at 35 microgram, which is 0.013

  • what were u taking b4 and what do you take now on thiroyd, do you take it once or twice a day

  • I took Erfa before, and I only take NDT once a day (in the morning). I have tried taking it twice or even three times a day, but I honestly felt difference, so I decided to take it once daily mainly for personal convenience.

  • I am on thiroyd and have been for about 4 weeks now that is from Thailand. The reason why I chose these is because like you say I couldn't find any real negative reviews of them or other NDT. I tried T4 and T3 from Greece about 2 years ago that was ok but I am getting better results with NDT. Personally I think it's just down to what works for you. For me when taking T3 and T4 I always had an underlying sick feeling and still got swollen and bloated. It hasn't been plain sailing and I did get some pretty nasty side effects at first with thiroyd. But it's evened out now. My hair has stopped falling out and I feel warmer, also I am not getting puffy and swollen, skin and hair has become less dry also.

  • wow ...all those results in 4 weeks...did you increase your dose, what were you taking b4 and now...i am asking this bec i never really got the correct dosage and thinking and retrying

  • Hi, I started on 2 which isn't advisable but my levels were very low. That is probably why I had a rough first week as it was a shock to my system. Previously about a year before I took uni pharma T4 and T3 I can't remember what dose(i think it was 75mg T4 and 25mg T3)  but I stopped them as couldn't get them from the same supplier anymore and wasn't doing well on them. In fact I ballooned to a size 16 which is the heaviest I've ever been as I am only 5ft2. Also my hair was falling out. I am now taking 4 NDT a day and making sure I supplement with B12, Iron, D3 and sellenium, vitamin c. I also take an adrenal supplement with my NDT in the evening. I just take that as and when. I don't advise what I did starting on 2 and increasing so fast but I just felt so ill I felt I had to start at a higher dose. Will be getting bloods done soon but I am very happy on thiroyd.

  • theCat346,

    Thai NDT doesn't appear to be regulated in the same way Armour, NatureThyroid, Erfa etc conform to pharmacological standards which means they can be included in the US and Canadian national formularies.  Although the Thai manufacturers state the active T4 and T3 content they don't list the excipients which can be a problem for some people.

  • This guy claims Thyroid-S was reformulated somehow, and is not working as well since:

  • my lot all take thyroid-s and theres been no complaint

    they don't do well on the thyroid one though

  • Interesting, thanks for the info! I also guess people in other parts of the world are no more interested than we are in taking harmful drugs, so why should it not be safe...?

  • PS. Can I ask what they didn't like about the Thiroyd?

  • they needed to take far more thiroid than thyroid-s and did not feel it worked as well

  • I took Thiroyd (made by Greater Pharma) for about three months, and I cannot say it did much for me. Labs confirmed this. In February of this year, this is what they looked like on 5 grains daily:

    FT4 0.9 (ref 0.8-1.8)

    FT3 2.9 (ref 2.2-4.2)

    TSH completely suppressed, though (<0.01). 

    So my FT4 levels were at the very bottom of range (and, unlike some people, my FT4 levels cannot get too low or I will feel less well, regardless of my FT3 levels...I have noticed this before, when I took synthetic combo drug Novothyral about ten years ago and the exact same thing happened to me...I ended up having to supplement with thyroxine to get my FT4 levels up).

    The fact is that my levels looked better on reformulated Armour, so I have been considering lately going back on Armour (which my doctor in Belgium prescribes). I read somewhere that if you combine it with a supplement called cellulase, it will help break down at least some of the could be worth a try, given how difficult it seem nowadays to find any truly good brand of NDT, at least if you limit yourself to prescription brands...!

  • Perhaps I did not try long enough but I found no difference from T4 so kept increasing until the difference was negative .This was Thyroid S. 

    The Thyroid Patient Advocacy site has details of the three Thai products.

    Framboise chews Thyroid S but another post a while back said they should be swallowed for slow release.

  • They only repeat what Stop The Thyroid Madness says (and clearly say that is what they have done).

    Trouble is, the information on STTM is up-in-the-air uncertain. Unless and until the Thai companies properly publish this information, there will be questions and doubts. From a UK (and USA) point of view, failure to state ingredients is a deeply questionable practice.

  • Well, should it not be a deeply questionable practice also to reformulate a product which had worked well for a century, and refuse to go back to the previous formula, even though hundreds of thousands of patients all around the world have been complaining and switching to other brands...?

    Please don't take this as an accusation. I just cannot help but think about how much trouble and extra costs the reformulation of Armour, as well as whatever happened to Erfa, have cost us...

  • In many ways I agree.

    Trouble is, we really don't know what happened. With Erfa (at one point - the explanation could well have changed since then) the issue seemed not to be so much reformulation as changes in manufacturing processes. Maybe higher pressure in the pressing?

    We also always have the problem that the actual source ingredients available can change over time. With Teva levothyroxine it appears that their source of dextrin changed. Whilst they should not have allowed that to happen, maybe their original source was no longer available and they simply (but very wrongly) just accepted another one? It was not necessarily the intention of any of these companies to make changes, but various issues might have pushed them into doing so.

    If they came clean and explained, we just might understand. We just might be better able to cope with the changes. 

  • Very happy on Thyroid S. Yes, the NHS do source drugs from the Far East, so buying from Thailand is not that big a deal.

  • NDT is specifically made for long term use.  It is regulated by the constant testing of the  efficacy of the product.  NDT  is available to all on a 'named patient' basis.  As someone who uses NDT on a regular basis there is no way I would go back to the levo poison.

  • Glynisrose, I found the complete opposite. GP and Endo flatly refused to prescribe NDT on named patient basis when I asked.  I have no thyroid so have no choice but to buy NDT myself now. I think there are very few who manage to get a prescription for it. I'm pleased if you did. That's a result. 

  • Hello i have stopped taking nature-throid and now take thyroid s my extensive digestive issues have calmed down a bit- the severe bloat also bit better. I am self medicating have tried to find a  specialist who listens treated my hypothyroid with chinese medicine for 9 yrs sadly lost acupuncturist. Hashimotos was out of control but as gut was very bad i currently have a restricted diet all a little calmer with the thyroid s. 

  • Just out of curiosity, can I ask why you stopped taking Nature-Throid...?

  • I started taking Thiroyd a week ago - all good here.  I started feeling better almost immediately. I feel much brighter.

  • allowed to prescribe to new patients simply because of cost.  It works, especially long term I don't believe doctors when they say that levo works, they have a vested interest.

  • If anyone here has tried both Thyroid-S and Thiroyd, I'd like to ask you if you noticed a difference between them strength-wise (that is, needing more Thiroyd compared to Thyroid-S, or vice versa)?

  • I now take Thyroid-S and haven't noticed any difference between that and Armour or NatureThroid - apart from the taste which I still haven't got used to.  I take them when I'm still half asleep so no water, just leave under my tongue to dissolve slowly while I go back to sleep.  I think the much lower cost is worth putting up with the taste for!

  • Thanks:-)

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