Doctor's appointment - feel cheated!

[kk12]

Well I went to see the one Doctor at my practice that seemed to have knowledge of thyroid issues but we are now back at square one again!

She looked at my TSH level 3.4, T4 level of 15 and Thyroid peroxidase antibody level - negative and because they are in the "normal" range, discounted the fact that I might have a thyroid issue, here we go!

How you can 100% state that when the other tests of T3, reverse T3 etc haven't been done, I really do not know!!!

She agreed that my Vit D at 47 and ferritin levels at 26 were low and advised that I needed a large loading dose of Vit D of 10,000 iu for 2 months followed by 5000 iu dose for 4 months and that was about the most useful info I got out of the appointment.

I decided to tell her the exact time I started to feel unwell which was July 2014 and what's happened for me to feel that I might be hypo and she actually knew about adrenal stress and cortisol levels - hurrah I thought, we might be getting somewhere and there are cortisol drugs.... so she proceeded to tell me about a drug that might help increase my serotonin levels and regulate my cortisol levels.

I specifically asked what type of drug this was (my husband can vouch for this as he was there with me) and she said it was an SSRI - please note she didn't tell me what Fluoxetine actually is - I get the prescription and read the bumpf inside and yep she's given me anti-depressants or to give it the name it's actually known by... PROZAC!!!!

[SlowDragon Administrator]

You can be given SSRI to help with other things - it is not exclusively an anti-depressant.

Same thing happened with a friend - they were given it for tinnitus and it does help them

[kk12 in reply to SlowDragon]

I am just disappointed that the GP specifically did not tell me it was an anti depressant when asked what type of drug it is!

I don't really want to take any anti depressant if I am honest - you hear such horror stories about coming off them and reading the list of side effects, well some of the side effects are also what I suffer from - no thanks!

[Heloise in reply to kk12]

Antidepressants do change brain chemistry albeit perhaps not immediately and short term might help someone who is severely depressed (or not) but I'd certainly try other methods first if it were me. Why use it when it is THYROID related?

[kk12 in reply to Heloise]

Thank you Heloise - I understand that - but when feeling low/depressed is part of the actual symptoms and not the main symptom, it just seems that here have anti depressants is the main answer!

[Heloise]

How disgusting! The medical establishment has sunk so low in my opinion it may as well be medical mafia. She would rather prescribe an antidepressant than simple hydrocortisone, why oh why oh why oh.

Since you have no antibodies, you could try a small dose of iodine. There is a pill that contains both types good for breast and thyroid called Iodoral. If that doesn't help, many people here obtain T4, T3 or NDT on their own.

[kk12 in reply to Heloise]

I really cannot believe that I was cheated in this way but yes I have been!

I am going to get the saliva cortisol tests done first and see what that tells me before anything else.

[humanbean]

So, she was keen to get her funding points for treating depression without actually telling you, the patient, that that was what she was treating? That is dishonest!

And another thing I noticed. The doctor refers to regulating your cortisol output. Has your cortisol been measured? There might be nothing wrong with your cortisol at all. Not that your doctor appears to care - she's apparently just a sales rep for pharmaceutical companies to make money for herself.

[kk12 in reply to humanbean]

I told her that my other symptoms - feel tired all the time, 2 stone weight gain since June 2014, insomnia, migraines, scalloped tongue, hoarse voice that got worse and worse speaking to her and menstrual issues were getting to me and that I had suffered a lot of stress since last year - that's when she mentioned adrenal stress and cortisol levels and I thought we might be getting somewhere but then she veered off that and gave me the prescription for Prozac saying that the increased serotonin levels would regulate my cortisol... er really?!

So no she has measured my cortisol levels at all - I am going to do the saliva test myself!

[Heloise in reply to kk12]

You might get something from this man as well.

youtube.com/watch?v=nZ_CP7l...(Not working as expected?)

[kk12 in reply to Heloise]

Ooh he's good! So the thyroid can also go wrong from 24 different issues and the TSH/T4 test only picks up 2 of those 24 issues.

I don't doubt the seratonin thing and the thyroid but isn't there a natural seratonin drug instead of anti depressants?

[Heloise in reply to kk12]

If you click the icon for youtube in the right bottom corner, he has the other videos listed. Yes, 24 causes for low thyroid symptoms and they ALL do not need thyroid hormone. He doesn't recommend taking serotonin. He is a functional medicine neurologist so would try to correct the function of other areas. Your digestive tract stores serotonin so for instance if you improve digestion, it will produce more serotonin so, no, not a helpful idea to take synthetic chemicals. I have posted all of his videos over the past year. They are worth watching.

Pettals posted a John Bergman video. His are longer but it is along the lines of correcting areas of dysfunction as well and he thinks you can heal. He offers more solutions than Dr. Clark as Clark just points out the problem.

youtube.com/watch?v=T_Re4ja...(Not working as expected?)

[kk12 in reply to Heloise]

Thank you - I started watching the you tube videos but I will watch them on another day as need to do some work! They are very interesting though - at least he is pointing out the problems and you can have a think as to what you can do about it!

We need more of these doctors everywhere that's for sure!

[Heloise in reply to kk12]

If you look into this more closely, you will realize that there is nothing wrong with the actual gland itself, it is the other issues. The TSH is a pituitary test and unless it is very high, it is useless for diagnosis unless you also have low thyroid symptoms. The T4 test only shows how much T4 the thyroid is producing and unless you destroy the gland (which attacks can do), it will continue to produce T4.

The adrenal gland can lower T4 levels. When you have time to watch the video, it will explain it very well.

[Clutter]

KK12, NHS rarely tests FT3 in primary care unless TSH is suppressed <0.03. They're looking for high FT3 in hyperthyroid patients not low FT3 in hypothyroid patients. rT3 is not usually tested on the NHS although there is an rT3 trial being run at a Southampton hospital.

You can order private FT3 and rT3 tests from Blue Horizon and Genova via thyroiduk.org.uk/tuk/testin...

SSRIs are sometimes prescribed for pain relief and to relieve anxiety in patients with high cortisol. Did your GP test your cortisol levels to see whether it is high or low before prescribing Prozac?

Her vitD advice was good. You need to supplement iron too, to raise your ferritin.

[kk12 in reply to Clutter]

Thank you Clutter

I am going to order the saliva cortisol test first and see what the result of that is first of all. I may need to tackle my adrenals first and address the low vitamin and mineral issues before we start tackling thyroid issues.

I didn't talk about any kind of pain apart from migraines to the Doctor on this visit although I do have pains in my neck and shoulders and knees.

She hasn't tested ANY cortisol levels at all.

I am taking a Vitamin supplement for Vit D but it is too low a dose as she rightly advised (had already found this out on here) and also taking an iron supplement too.

[Clutter in reply to kk12]

KK12, it is a ridiculous state of affairs where symptoms are dismissed until thyroid levels are over range and are then deemed to be due to hypothyroidism. Your symptoms probably are thyroidal but the reality is that protocols mean you will have to wait until bloods are abnormal before getting a diagnosis and treatment.

Optimising your vitamin and mineral status will help with some symptoms, low ferritin and vit D can cause musculoskeletal pain and fatigue, and will also help thyroxine work when it is eventually prescribed.

You could also supplement 200mcg selenium which may support your thyroid.

Take your iron tablets with 500mg-1,000mg vitamin C to aid absorption and minimise constipation.

[kk12 in reply to Clutter]

Thanks Clutter - I work on principles of logic and if you present me with a list of clinical symptoms and you tick one hell of a lot of them then logic tells me that that is where the issue lies - now if there are other illnesses that fit so to speak then fine, let's get tested for them too and come to some sort of conclusion!

I am taking the Liquid Feroglobin for my iron supplement but noticed that there is a super duper plus version of it as well - already taking 800mg of Vit C - no issues with constipation at all!

I think there is some selenium in there as well but will check!

[nightingale-56 in reply to Clutter]

I believe it was mentioned on here a couple of years ago that Southampton University Hospital did Cortisol Saliva Tests! They seem to be a forward thinking hospital.

[kk12 in reply to nightingale-56]

I am actually going to Southampton in a few weeks time as it's the starting point for a cruise holiday but it's quite a way to go from the Midlands - I've just ordered the saliva cortisol kit from Genova.

[nightingale-56 in reply to kk12]

Just had my results back from Genova and pleased to say they have improved from 5 years ago. Hope you enjoy your cruise.

[kk12 in reply to nightingale-56]

That's great news re: your results! I am sure I can recover from this but I need to know how and if a doctor can't tell me then I have to research!

I will enjoy the cruise and a change of scenery for sure!

[kk12]

Thank you and I actually pointed out to the Doctor that my low Vit D and Ferritin, plus B12 score of 433 was a result of me being hypothyroid and her eyes glazed over!

[Lizzy1606]

Its funny my mother was on Prozac for a few years,and as she was still unwell she got herself off them and told them that she did not want to take the antidepressants anymore(i don't think she was depressed but it was easier than looking for what was really wrong) Then all of a sudden she got a prescription for Fluoxetine and if she had not asked in the chemist what they were she would of been back on them. how sly is that.

[kk12 in reply to Lizzy1606]

Yes and if I wasn't wanting to be so well informed and all that and listen to what the doctor is prescribing me then I would be in the same boat!

I would have no issues in taking anti depressants if they are going to help me, I've got no issue being called depressed either and taking meds but when they are part of the symptoms that the doctors are ignoring then that's why I get mad!

[Lizzy1606 in reply to kk12]

I don't blame you i think you would know if you were depressed .I think that sometimes its easier for them than looking for whats really wrong .I always say unless its stamped on your forehead you have had it.You just end up back and fore for months,which just makes you mad and disheartened

I read somewhere that it can take as many as 7 visits to the GP before you get a answer.I hope you get sorted soon .

[kk12 in reply to Lizzy1606]

Thanks Lizzy1606 - this was my 4th visit since March and I am still going nowhere fast!

There are times when I do feel very low indeed but that comes and goes. As far as I am concerned it is part of the bigger thyroid picture - it's part of the Thyroid UK checklist for hypo symptoms but I didn't get as far as that with the doctor today despite having a double appointment!

[Lizzy1606 in reply to kk12]

I think that not getting to the bottom of whats going on makes you feel low.And that you are knocking on the right door but not getting anywhere.and that the problem is staring them in the face ,but they don't look outside the box.

[kk12 in reply to Lizzy1606]

Totally right on the money there Lizzy1606 - like I said, I work on logic... I tell the dr what's wrong, they tell me it's this - great - I get medicine, I'm well again - er not here though! I have heard of countless cases where people have struggled to get diagnosed for years with hypo!

[Lizzy1606 in reply to kk12]

I had Graves (eyes popping outside my head)and it took me 4yrs ,it was a nurse told me i had Graves i was waiting for the punch line as i had never heard of it till then.And when i returned to the GP. he said i did'nt have it but he would do the bloods.

I know its hard but just hang in there.Best wishes Lizzy x

[kk12 in reply to Lizzy1606]

Thanks for your best wishes Lizzy - I will keep on battling! x

[kk12]

My opinion of a lot of doctors Londinium is exactly the same as yours!!!!

I think once she thought there was no way I was hypothyroid in her eyes that to suggest any more tests was not going to get me anywhere - i did attempt to get her to acknowledge that not ALL the tests had been but she said that they were the main tests and that I should near enough be grateful that the antibodies test had been done as they don't normally do that!

[Justiina]

Ssri now works for low cortisol ? Lol. That is all I have to say.

Soon they will figure out ssri's cure cancer too. How about flu then? Stuffed nose, take ad. It might not cure you but at least you don't care about it anymore.

So sorry you met another Dr. Jerk as I call them

[kk12 in reply to Justiina]

I had waited a few weeks to see this doctor as she gave me the impression she might give me a trial of Levo - she knew that my TSH was 3.4 at the time if seeing me so just feel like my time has been wasted!

It's just unreal! I did the online test for measuring adrenal stress levels and it came out as moderate and near the high level and I would challenge anyone about to lose £25k to your ex husband due to a professionally negligent solicitor not to feel stressed about it or dealing with an elderly 85 year old mother who has to have it explained to her why it's happening as she doesn't understand!

[kk12]

By the way, she didn't prescribe Vit D to me - she just told me the amounts I needed to take! I've just spent a lot of money buying it this afternoon!

[Angel_of_the_North]

I listened to a recording yesterday which said that there is no way to test serotonin levels in the brain and that there is no evidence that serotonin levels in depressed peopel are any different from those in non-depressed people. If you give SSRIs to people without depression and then stop them, those people will get depression. Nasty! It's like men taking testosterone when they don't need it - body stops producing its own. Bargepole!

The only thing that they seem to prescribe without lab tests are SSRIs.