Shin Pain

[lehcar70]

I’ve noticed niggling pain in my left shin last few runs. I haven’t been running any faster or longer - 4or5k x2 per week. Im also a tortoise not a hare.

Wondering if sign I need new trainers? 18 months since had gait analysis.

[IannodaTruffe Mentor]

Shin pain is almost always associated with an increase in impact stresses, which is why new runners are susceptible and also anyone stepping up their training regime significantly.

Have you changed the surface you run on?

Average distance for running shoes is reckoned to be 300-500 miles, but weight, surface and running style can alter that considerably.

If your shoes show signs of wear or have lost their spring if you fold them back on themselves, then they probably need replacing.

Of course, it might be something completely different. Go to a reputable running shop and ask their opinion.

[Indielass00 Graduate]

I can relate to shin pain. I went to a fantastic running shop and discovered I was a heel striker!😫 I’m now learning to run with a new gait. Gait analysis sounds a great idea 👍🏻

[baronblaze]

It is the onset of shin splints. . You do need to consistently do some exercises to strengthen the muscles and hamstrings in your thighs.Look up exercises to treat shin splints and ensure that you do them as much as possible.

If the pain gets worse than you will need to rest as you are aggravating the problem.

[John_W Graduate]

Do you know what your cadence is? i.e. your steps per minute.

[John_W Graduate]

Have a watch of this video, from renowned sports podiatrist Ian Griffths, about a client of his who had shin pain (splints)

healthunlocked.com/api/redi...

Should be of interest IannodaTruffe Instructor57 roseabi

[Instructor57 Graduate in reply to John_W]

Interesting !Thanks John_W

[John_W Graduate in reply to Instructor57]

It is.

Also, it's a reminder that per unit distance, walking creates a greater load on the body than running. Counter-intuitive, but it's all to do with increased ground-contact time. Get yerself in the air!

[IannodaTruffe Mentor in reply to John_W]

That is interesting but although we are told that they worked on form, we are not told whether they eliminated his very pronounced heel strike, which might well have been the primary cause of his shin splints while walking fast. Reducing stride length and ensuring footfall was under his body would seem the obvious route forward seeing the video.

Perhaps we are not all runners after all.

[roseabi in reply to John_W]

Folks, please note that the man in the video was walking exceptionally fast. Ordinary walking is not bad for you, it is an excellent form of exercise 😊😊😊

[IannodaTruffe Mentor in reply to John_W]

John, your assertion that “walking creates a greater load on the body than running” has been bugging me. You say it is counterintuitive and it certainly goes against all my readings, observations and received knowledge, so I would really apreciate it if you could give me references to help me understand this statement. I would be the first to admit that my understanding of the complex bio mechanics of pronation is very limited, but I cannot get beyond my understanding that it is impact that causes stresses, not duration of contact with the ground, a crude extrapolation of which would suggest that we are all at risk of crippling ourselves every time we walk.

I did an internet search using your assertion as the search term and the first result (the most relevant, by Google’s algorithm) was this pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/270... which not only contradicts that opinion but concludes that walking can provide aerobic exercise without elevated orthopaedic stress.

I haven’t been through all my search results as I hope you can provide some substantive evidence to back up your statement.

I certainly did not draw the same conclusion as you from the Ian Griffith’s video, which to me highlighted the fact that heelstriking, whether walking or running, is undesirable, although I didn’t delve into his supporting literature, which sounded as if it was addressing another issue (perceived exertion). I could not find any of his statements that matched your assertion.

Running theory is complex, contradictory and everchanging and I am always keen to advance my understanding. Very often, it seems to me, that advice and practices devised for high level athletes needs to be adjusted and tempered for our readership, who are often unfit, unhealthy, overweight and older, compared to the average pro. However, we need to be able to communicate the basics with as little confusion and and as much clarity as possible, so it is useful if we all read off the same hymn sheet, even if the tunes vary slightly.

[John_W Graduate in reply to IannodaTruffe]

Hi Tim,

“walking creates a greater load on the body than running” has been bugging me.

PER UNIT DISTANCE Tim! Very important point.

" so I would really appreciate it if you could give me references to help me understand this statement."

BBC's 'The Truth About ... Getting Fit', shown January 2018, with the excellent and always evidence-led Dr Michael Mosley. Here, Prof John Brewer (Google him) shows him a counter-intuitive result . Watch from 38:00 onwards:

documentarymania.com/player...

The explanation: it's not the peak, it's the area under the curve.

Now, of course they'll be plenty of caveats to do with foot strike, gait type, pace etc. However, the point is well made and shows things are not as clear cut as you might imagine.

"I would be the first to admit that my understanding of the complex bio mechanics of pronation is very limited"

ditto!

"but I cannot get beyond my understanding that it is impact that causes stresses, not duration of contact with the ground"

I like to think the video addresses that.

"a crude extrapolation of which would suggest that we are all at risk of crippling ourselves every time we walk."

Not so much an extrapolation, more an exaggeration

"I did an internet search using your assertion as the search term and the first result (the most relevant, by Google’s algorithm) was this pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/270... which not only contradicts that opinion but concludes that walking can provide aerobic exercise without elevated orthopaedic stress."

Of course! I always advocate walking as excellent exercise.

"I haven’t been through all my search results as I hope you can provide some substantive evidence to back up your statement."

I haven't gone to the lengths you have, but John Brewer does seem to have a pretty reputable background and I'm fairly sure Michael Mosley would not have entertained such a piece without the science being well-researched.

I certainly did not draw the same conclusion as you from the Ian Griffith’s video, which to me highlighted the fact that heelstriking, whether walking or running, is undesirable, although I didn’t delve into his supporting literature, which sounded as if it was addressing another issue (perceived exertion). I could not find any of his statements that matched your assertion."

An increase in step rate and making sure that a flight phase existed (running) in the gait, looks to have correlated well with a decrease in the presentation of shin splint symptoms, in the case presented. Given that shin splints are often associated with increased acute or chronic loads and therefore cumulative and peak forces, then decreasing those loads, either by resting, doing less or gait retraining would seem sensible suggestions. In the case above, gait retraining (presumably modifying the forces) seems to have done the trick.

"Running theory is complex, contradictory <snip> ....

<snip ... advice and practices devised for high level athletes needs to be adjusted and tempered for our readership, who are often unfit, unhealthy, overweight and older, compared to the average pro."

I'm very aware and always conscious of that Tim .

"However, we need to be able to communicate the basics with as little confusion and and as much clarity as possible, so it is useful if we all read off the same hymn sheet, even if the tunes vary slightly."

Treadmills for the WIN! Yay!

😉

[IannodaTruffe Mentor in reply to John_W]

Thanks for such a detailed response, John.

I will get back to you when I have watched the video.

I don't understand your last line.

[John_W Graduate in reply to IannodaTruffe]

A tongue-in-cheek comment of course, agreeing with you that all the HU C25K team 'should read off of the same hymn sheet', especially when it comes to treadmills ...

[IannodaTruffe Mentor in reply to John_W]

Thanks for the video link, John. It gave me information on some things that I did not know about.

What a wonderful thing the exchange of information is.

[John_W Graduate in reply to IannodaTruffe]

Glad you found it interesting. Caveats aplenty like I say (there always are with running) but the maths is clear - while the peak is always important, the area under the curve is equally so.

[RyanSnellLean6]

Hey I made video on how to deal with shin splints. It's literally a 60 second video and I think it could really help you youtu.be/TWnrier5sRM(Not working as expected?)

[John_W Graduate in reply to RyanSnellLean6]

Did you have plastic surgery at some point? You seemed to change appearance completely mid-way through the video. Who/what are you?

[RyanSnellLean6 in reply to John_W]

LOL didn't change appearance. It's my business partner.

[lehcar70 Graduate]

All very helpful. Thank you. I ruptured disc in my back many moons ago & have residual numbness in left leg & foot. Wonder if I’m heel striking without realising.

[IannodaTruffe Mentor in reply to lehcar70]

As suggested, getting along to a running shop and having a video gait analysis will give you a wealth of information and perhaps some new shoes You might find browsing through the FAQ Posts useful too healthunlocked.com/couchto5...