Photo from my holiday. Any advice welcome in how to help my partner with holiday anxiety and social anxiety.

[Kkimm]

Hi

My partner and I are having a very mixed time on holiday in Southern Spain, even though it should be wonderful.

We have just had a brilliant three days with relatives who we are both very fond of. They are great company and look after us so well. Sadly his older sister he is very close to has stage ,4 breast cancer, though is very well and cheerful at present.

We had planned the stay with them for the begining of our 7 nights in a beautiful apartment with pool and stunning views of the sea. This was to make sure my partner Pete (not his real name) did not have time to build up his social anxiety about the stay. Usually we tend to stay with them towards the end of our stay and I have noticed this is really bad because for the last twice he has started to have sleepless nights for at least 3 or 4 nights before the stay and is exhausted tired nervous and very angry with me until we get their. All his difficult feelings get taken out on me, verbally only or by sulking and refusing to do anything. Usually he starts to stay in bed all day to catch up on sleep so will do so dispute knowing this will mess up his sleep pattern more and enjoy nothing until the evening. He will then enjoy a lovely meal, be pleasant and cheerful as long as I am. Drink half a bottle of wine or more if it is on offer. Go to sleep perhaps for an hour then be unable to sleep for the rest of the night and the cycle begins again.

Even if he does manage to sleep well he will refuse to get out of bed often til mid afternoon when I am raring to go to enjoy out together in a new exciting place.

We have done many exciting adventures together and with our lovely dog,now dead, we've sailed to Sardinia on our own boat and more recently campervaned over Europe which he struggled with a bit as we have got older. We are now in our ,60, retired with time togethether. He has a great project building our extension and generally loves his life as I do mine and love and support each other and are great friends too.

Back to the holiday, as you can imagine with the above, my patience starts to run out and we finish up with constant arguments for the rest of the holiday if on our own. If time is spent with relatives again he behaves perfectly as soon as we all meet up. However he will have been a nightmare to get out of bed before hand and will probably get at me on the whole journey to meet them.

He is normally a very kind gentle person who does so much for me. Nearly everyone thinks he is a lovely laid back guy but nothing could be further from the truth if he is feeling stressed whatever the situation.

This time, seeing them at the beginning was good as he slept well for the two nights before we met and was cheerful and happy to do things as he is sometimes at the start of holidays. This time he would not get up til midday on the first two days so I did things on my own and when he did get up he was great so I was very happy with that.

The time with relatives was wonderful and so was he.

However right from the afternoon after we returned he got controlling about me crossing the exactly where and when he thought I should then very angry when I told him the controlling behaviour is not on and that have crossed roads on my all my life and am still around. He then becomes very angry and finds other things to say to get at me etc. When I stand up to him over this we finish up with arguments, sleep difficult and more days of refusal to do things at all before the meal in the evening.

We managed a long walk in this beautiful gorge in photo but not before he had insisted on bringing and wearing the wrong foot wear and complaining about his feet all the time. He loves walks particularly challenging ones by the way but does get foot pain which is usually improved by walking.

I was kind and sympathetic about his feet but did say he was really silly to insist on bringing the wrong footware. I then made the mistake of saying that perhaps he should go back and rest in the car or have a drive back to the apartment for a couple of hours while I did it and come to pick me up again, this was said kindly not angrily. I now realise this was my mistake as he stormed off leaving me behind on my own in the gorge where we had to scramble over rocks in water etc. I guessed it had hurt his pride I had suggested this and made him feel less needed because he could see I was confident to do the walk alone. There were other people around. I guessed he would just continue to the half way point where we agreed we would take a break. When I got to the half way point and he was not there I started to get a bit worried, I had no water because he had taken it and he had left me the small rucksack to carry, he just had the water in his hand when he stormed off. I also realised he had left his phone in the car. I now think deliberately as when angry and stressed he nearly always does things that are meant to worry me as his way of getting back at me. I was not too worried as I am so laid back since on antidepressants. He however does worry about me so I am surprised he did his storming off, which is common but normally in a safe setting.

By the way I am the person with the serious anxiety condition of GAD and depression but fully recovered almost and even more confident than before I was ill. He was not caring and protective when I was ill, I get that it scared him as I was always the strong one. When really ill he tended to bully me. As I started to recover he got more angry as I was not prepared to be bullied anymore verbally. This was controlling behaviour on his part, never really putting me down by the way. He was pleased and tried to be supportive when I recovered. He certainly listened alot even if he often said the wrong thing.

He is a real Jeckle and Hyde character. At home where he feels safe, most of the time he is lovely kind and caring. If anything makes him feel angry or unsafe he takes it out on me.

Travel was always our thing and we both loved it. You could say I live for travel so it is so hard that since I became ill it seems he has to turn every holiday into a nightmare. Happened only or twice prior to my illness once where he felt very unhappy on a Borneo wildlife jungle trek etc

We only go on holidays he wants to go on and I have taken to travelling with my daughter for other places, or on my own. I am starting to think about going with friends also but have not done so yet. I want my best travelling companion back.My fearless kind and caring partner who is there most of the time at home but disappears on holiday.

He is not good at communicating his feeling by the way and could not answer a question like "what would make you feel safer on holiday ?"etc. Refuses any treatment or counselling at this point. Only told me he suffers from social anxiety when I became ill. Presents often as cheerful and talkative often even in shops with people he does not know but tells me that he will put off going into shops for ages or phonecalls etc because he is so nervous. That was a massive open up for him.

I make what I know is the mistake of doing for him nearly everything he finds difficult and always have done and try to be tactful and not let people know his difficulties. I often look a bit managing or controlling I know how hard it is for him to order his own meal in a restaurant etc. Yes I probably make it worse by doing so and should try not too.

Anyway, you have now got a really full picture. It would be great if a few people could give advice or suggestions or even sympathy would be lovely.

Thanks for reading this massive post if you have done. I have cried a little while writing it and that is difficult for me since being ill. I think I have to mourn that side of my partner which is gone.

My thoughts and good wishes are with us all.

Kim

[LilyAnnepuppy]

Thank you so much for being vulnerable and pouring out your heart. It sounds like you have your hands full, but are managing quite well navigating through the difficult interpersonal issues. How long have you been together? I get the impression it’s been awhile. I’m sorry some aspects have changed but happy you’re recovering nicely.

I’ve noticed that when I make/experience changes in my behavior, it throws my close people off base. They were used to dealing with me one way and were confused with my newly acquired self esteem tools. I even lost a job because of it. After 10 years working for a doctor (6 were subservient and 4 were the best employee I could be) he fired me for “personality differences.” Unemployment agency had a good laugh about that one. The rep said to me, “It took him 10 years to notice a personality problem?” I knew the backstory, but we laughed about it anyway.

But have hope that throughout my life with my husband of 36 years, we have surmounted a number of obstacles. Including personality changes. Love, respect, patience, courtesy, kindness and communication seem to work (as difficult as those principles are to practice).

I’m glad you’re traveling anyway, with others and on your own. That can be so rewarding. But of course he’s going to react to his loss of control. He may or may not come around, but hang in as long as you need to. You’ll know if you’re supposed to make the ultimate break. But it’ll be harder to live with yourself if you run. I find it better if I move toward a positive as opposed to away from a negative. If that makes any sense.

In fact discard this whole response if it doesn’t address your needs. I’ve been known to be way off base.

I can say with assurance, however, that the photo is stunning. Thanks for posting it. Lynne

[JEG325 in reply to LilyAnnepuppy]

Hello, my friend! Hope you're okay this morning!

[Kkimm in reply to LilyAnnepuppy]

Hi Lynn

I have really thought alot about your very insightful reply. You are right that I have grown and changed and sadly rather than growing with me Pete has actually had more problems which as you say is not surprising. Really well demonstrated by what happened to you at work. What was your role if you do not mind saying? That must have been very painful to go through. Does it still give you pain or anger?

I am doing alot of thinking at present about the future and will heed what you said.

I have some ideas on what l could do to try to build on the good so we will see.

The holiday went from bad to worse after this and I have returned feeling exhausted and somehow broken, so I do not want to share more detail at present, unusual for me I know.

I also feel oddly light and in some way liberated. I cried such alot both on holiday and after I got home which has helped as I am learning that I have probably been holding far too much in for many years and crying has been very difficult for me, particularly whilst very ill, because despite being depressed I could not cry at all. Same happened to my sister when she experienced a very deep psychotic depression and had to be hospitalised some years ago. Yes, our upbringing in our birth family was difficult.

I hope you stay in touch and tell me more about what is going on in your life. I read so many people's profiles and a few if their posts that I can get people mixed up, I think I remember yours however. I think you are keen on wildlife and live in the USA?

I was in Social work management and have always had great sympathy for everyone who experiences mental health or addiction issues which is another mh problem. Now I have experienced it myself my interest has deepened.

I would love to hear more about you if you want to and have time. message if you prefer.

Very best wishes.

Kim

[LilyAnnepuppy in reply to Kkimm]

I will pm you

[Kkimm]

It was a lovely reply Lynne

In the car so will we write more fully later

[JEG325]

I'm sorry you go through this. I feel bad for you. But, what love you must have for him to put up with it and still deal with it all these years later. He must make you happy if you're still there. Treasure the good parts and continue to be patient with the bad parts. I often tell my sweetie that love never remembers the bad. It only remembers the good....Affectionate kisses, a hug when you needed it, walking together in the rain and the tenderness of making love with someone you truly love....Those things are priceless and cannot be replaced. Those are the things that make a relationship worthwhile. My sweetie will often say, 'I'm sorry I did that, honey..." I always reply, "Did what? I don't remember you doing anything. All I remember is that I love you! Take care Kkhim. Have a really blessed day. Okay?

[Kkimm in reply to JEG325]

Hi

Thanks so much for your kind words.

Kim

[lillyofthevalley37]

I think you have answered many of your own questions you are obvs both very fond of each other

I was wondering if you recovered from your GAD would the antidepressants that worked for you work for your partner ?

I am against antidepressants esp for young people but am intrigued as to the antidepressant that worked wonders for you could you please tell us which antidepressant it was?

I hope you both enjoy the rest of your holiday thank you for sharing it with us I haven't been on holiday this year I didn't want to go but I have enjoyed reading about yours

[Kkimm in reply to lillyofthevalley37]

Hi

Thank you so much for your reply.

We are now back from Spain after what proved to be largely a very unhappy holiday not just because of Pete but because prior to it we had not realised just how ill his sister is with cancer. We had a lovely few days at the beginning of the holiday but a very sad time after that.

We are both very close to her and I am very upset also about the prospect of loosing her.

Pete seems to have blocked or failed to understand how ill she is and cannot seem to connect to any feelings about it all.

What the holiday has done is reveal to me just how ill he is with his anxiety. I think it is impacting on his behaviour all the time but particularly when he is outside his comfort zone.

I had thought about if medication could work for him but I do not believe he would cope with any antidepressants and certainly not the one I took which is Venlafaxine.

I was given a choice of it or Zoloft by my doctor when I first became ill two years ago.

It is not the first go to antidepressant for most people. It is usually one recommended after others have failed. It is an SNRI not an SSRI.

It is very hard to cope with for the first few days or even weeks. Statistically it is the one most likely to lead to suicide in young people when they first start to take it. However it is also one that works for many people with anxiety after many other ones have failed. The process of trying and failing with antidepressants is a very painful and traumatic one from all I have read.

Venlafaxine is very tough at first because it increases your anxiety, alot in my view, although the leaflet states a mild increase of anxiety at first. It also has other very scary side effects that kick in very quickly. I was in a supermarket about an hour after having taken my first tablet and suddenly the floor felt as if it was tipping away from me and I wondered if I was safe to drive home. This dizzy spell disappeared in seconds but did keep returning. I also felt very nauseous which stopped in a couple of days. Some cannot drive on it at first due to dizziness. I was not afraid of the dizziness as I had read what to expect but I found the increase in anxiety, usually in the evening or at night extremely frightening, and unpleasant and was barely able to carry on with it.

I also found some big improvement quite quickly as well so stayed on it and am so pleased I did. I needed 3 dose increases and am now on 187.5 mg and do not intend to ever increase again as this leaves room for plenty of further increase if really necessary in future. Average dose 150 mg, top dose 375mg. I got to 150 mg after 4 months and this is what lead to my return to normal. Up to then I often felt worse rather than better but had the occasional very good day which gave me hope.

Once it starts to work in my case however it felt like a miracle. I was back to my old self in about 4 months. The extremely bad anxiety experiences went almost completely after a couple of weeks of starting the drug however. In a year I was better than my old self in that I am more confident and sociable and it has helped me understand myself and my relationships with Pete and others better than I have ever done.

So the side effects at first are very severe but after it starts to work it has one of the least side effects of any antidepressant as evidenced in research. Also evident in research is that it is the hardest to come off as well.

My condition of GAD means that I will probably need it all my life and I am in my 60s. Many people have taken it for 20 years and stay well on it.

You cannot take it if you already have high blood pressure as Pete does.

I think my doctor could tell I was a bit unusual in that I was a non anxious person with GAD if that makes any sense. I was someone with a normally very high threshold for anxiety, had been a responsible manager in social work dealing with alot if pressure and coping all through my life. I had a very good knowledge of mental health problems and alot if insight into myself in that I could straight away tell when I became ill with GAD and health anxiety and depression. I did not do the usual thing of people with health anxiety of trying to find a physical cause apart from at the very beginning. I got onto antidepressants very quickly after the start of GAD

I had become very severely ill very quickly following a life trauma. GAD usually has to be lived with rather than cured but I am recovered in the sense of being very well, happy, non anxious, virtually no physical symptoms. I imagine all my symptoms would come back if I weaned off, but I would not take that risk.

I think therefore my doctor felt I could probably cope with it and would need something stronger because if how ill I was. He made a point of strongly recommend that I come back immediately if I felt I could not cope.

He did not tell me at the time but he himself has GAD and recovered very quickly through Venlafaxine and was able to get off it again quite quickly too and very easily by weaning off gradually. Not sure if it returned again for him but he was off sick for a few months not long after he treated me. He is back now and apparently well again.

Anyway, that is probably more information than you needed but I feel strongly about how effective it is as a medication but probably that it should not be given to young or vulnerable people unless all else has failed. You need excellent 24 hour support when you go on it which I certainly did not have.

The other thing about it is leads to periods of euphoria and lowers inhibition and can lead to anger and irritability. I had and still have periods of all that so have to watch myself carefully. When that happens I need zoplicone to sleep. I never increase the dose and have only needed it very rarely for the last year. I needed it every night for the first three months but had no difficulty stopping it. I had sleeplessness very badly with GAD before going onto Venlafaxine. I know when the periods of euphoria and irritability and sleeplessness are happening and realise it impedes my judgement a bit. It is usually on a good not bad holiday experience which happens with my daughter most often. Many doctors will lower your dose or take you off it if that happens but again with self awareness you can deal with it. I think that is an over reaction but I think they are wary of this causing real problems and in a vulnerable person.

I have found that it has also lead to a deeper understanding of myself and my family relationships and how to deal with them.

If you want to know more about my experience of Venlafaxine look at my second ever post called something like Antidepressants can lead to deeper insight etc. I do not know if I name Venlafaxine in it but that is the drug I am referring to. I have never taken any other but have read a huge amount about it and other antidepressants also.

I am also happy to answer more questions about it if anyone wants to ask or provide support through messaging for anyone trying to start antidepressants. As I think most people know therapy alongside antidepressants us very important or doing your own programme of activities, excercise, meditation etc for any antidepressant to work effectively. I also advise on doing your own programme.

Very best wishes

Kim

[lillyofthevalley37 in reply to Kkimm]

Thank you so much for explaining your experience of the drug you took where do you think you would be now if you had never had the drug ? Do you think you could've got back to normal without it?

Your trauma was all down to a misdiagnosis of cancer it strikes me that it was so shocking to you bc it was never meant to be your destiny and if it's true that God only gives us stuff we can.handle it makes sense you couldn't handle that and got GAD as a consequence

[Kkimm in reply to lillyofthevalley37]

Hi.

I do not think I would have recovered without both Venlafaxine and my activity programme. However I cannot be really sure of that. Other sorts of therapy and Venlafaxine probably would have been fine as well. Probably I would not have recovered unless I had somehow both halves of that equation.

Other antidepressants may also have worked fine for me. If I had not have taken then I think I would probably still be struggling very badly with the illness and depression.

Actually I now realise there was alot more than just the misdiagnosis that triggered it.

It came very suddenly on the evening of that but I think now that it was the straw that broke the camel's back. The year leading up to included a very stressful work contract involving a failing team I had to sort along side an Ofsted Inspection.

My mother died suddenly a few weeks after I started the contract and I foolishly carried on with the contract rather than withdrawing because I did not want to let the Local Authority down. The contract ended positively with good inspection result and the team thriving but I was exhausted.

I then had a major row with my sister around two months before the misdiagnosis. Thus triggered vthe symptom of not being able to swallow. My childhood was a difficult one particularly in relation to my father and my sister but I did have a warm caring mother and the loss of her hit me hard but I had no time to grieve.

Regards

Kim

[All_alone]

I love the photo and would love to travel to such places. Thanks for sharing.