Estradiol & PCa.

[pjoshea13]

New French study.

Nalakrats will get a kick out of this one.

"Our objective was to assess the concentration levels of sex steroids in prostatic tissue and serum, in two cohorts of patients with localized PCa or benign prostatic hyperplasia (BPH)."

"The levels of Total Testosterone (TT), Di-Hydro-Testosterone (DHT), and Estradiol (E2) in the serum were not significantly different between PCa and BPH."

"In PCa tissue, TT concentrations were significantly lower (0.11 ng/g vs 0.47 ng/g ...),

"however its derivative E2 had significantly higher concentrations (31.0 ng/g vs 22.3 ng/g ...).

"DHT tissue concentrations were not significantly different between the two groups (5.55 ng/g vs 5.42 ng/g ..."

Seems like the PCa cells were producing higher levels of aromatase, which converts T to E2. The effect being to substantially reduce protective T & increase growth-promoting E2. (All the more reason to consider Arimidex when serum E2 is >20 pg/mL.)

The fact that serum levels differed from cellular levels is not surprising. It's a warning to not place much faith in serum levels.

{& those of us considering the use of Avodart while castrate, should be aware that advanced PCa cells might have higher DHT levels than that suggested by serum levels.}

-Patrick

ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/303...

Prostate. 2018 Oct 28. doi: 10.1002/pros.23732. [Epub ahead of print]

Sex steroids in serum and prostatic tissue of human cancerous prostate (STERKPROSER trial).

Meunier ME1, Neuzillet Y1, Raynaud JP2, Radulescu C3, Ghoneim T1, Fiet J4, Giton F4, Rouanne M1, Dreyfus JF5, Lebret T1, Botto H1.

Author information

1

Department of Urology, University of Versailles-Saint-Quentin-en-Yvelines, Foch Hospital, Suresnes, France.

2

University Pierre et Marie Curie, Paris, France.

3

Department of Pathology, Foch Hospital, Suresnes, France.

4

INSERM U955, Eq07, Centre de Recherches Chirurgicales, Créteil, France.

5

Department of Clinical Research and Innovations, University of Versailles-Saint-Quentin-en-Yvelines, Foch Hospital, Suresnes, France.

Abstract

BACKGROUND:

Currently, there is no consensus regarding the expected concentration levels of intra-prostatic sex steroids in patients with Prostate Cancer (PCa). Our objective was to assess the concentration levels of sex steroids in prostatic tissue and serum, in two cohorts of patients with localized PCa or benign prostatic hyperplasia (BPH).

METHODS:

Between September 2014 and January 2017, men selected for radical cystectomy (for bladder cancer) or open prostatectomy (for BPH), and men selected for radical prostatectomy for localized PCa were included. Blood samples were collected at baseline before surgery, and steroid concentrations were assessed following the recommendations of the Endocrine Society. Intra-prostatic samples were collected from fresh surgical samples, and assessed by gas chromatography and mass spectrometry (GC/MS). Permanova analysis was performed. Analyses were adjusted for age, prostate weight, and prostate-specific antigen (PSA) level.

RESULTS:

A total of 73 patients (41 patients with PCa and 32 patients with BPH) were included in this study. Patients with PCa were younger, and had smaller prostate volumes with higher levels of PSA. The levels of Total Testosterone (TT), Di-Hydro-Testosterone (DHT), and Estradiol (E2) in the serum were not significantly different between PCa and BPH. In PCa tissue, TT concentrations were significantly lower (0.11 ng/g vs 0.47 ng/g, P = 0.0002), however its derivative E2 had significantly higher concentrations (31.0 ng/g vs 22.3 ng/g, P = 0.01). DHT tissue concentrations were not significantly different between the two groups (5.55 ng/g vs 5.42 ng/g, P = 0.70). Intra-prostatic TT concentrations were significantly lower in the peripheral zone than in the central zone for the CaP group (0.07 ng/g vs 0.15 ng/g, P = 0.004).

CONCLUSIONS:

Patients with PCa had lower intra-prostatic TT and higher E2 concentrations levels compared to the patients with BPH. PCa seem to consume more TT and produce more E2, especially in the peripheral zone.

© 2018 Wiley Periodicals, Inc.

KEYWORDS:

5-alpha-reductase; aromatase; prostate cancer; sex steroids; total testosterone

PMID: 30370569 DOI: 10.1002/pros.23732

[Hidden]

So, is there a supplement, like DIM, that could help counteract this conversion to E2?

[pjoshea13 in reply to Hidden]

Before I shifted to Arimidex, I was using chrysin + bioperine.

"... studies have shown chrysin, 7-hydroxyflavone and 7,4'-dihydroxyflavone to be the most potent flavonoid inhibitors of aromatase. However, very poor oral bioavailability is a major limitation for the successful use of dietary flavonoids as chemopreventive agents." [1]

Very little chrysin survives the "first pass" through the liver. But bioperine inhibits the CYP enzymes that metabolize chrysin. It really works.

{I owe my basic education in hormones to bodybuilding sites, where the guys running the sites have amazing knowledge. They cite scientific studies to back up any claims. Importantly, the information they pass on is used by bodybuilders who are concerned that increased T should not be converted to E2. I should say here that, unlike Nalakrats who has already shared the results of his gym visits with us, I have never knowingly stepped inside a gym.}

-Patrick

[1] ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/176...

[PhilipSZacarias]

I have been taking DIM+ (diindolylmethane) which is obtained from cruciferous vegetables and considered an aromatase inhibitor for the last two years (100 mg/d). A drop in my PSA from 0.23 to 0.1 ng/ml coincided with the start of taking this photochemical. A literature survey indicates that DIM+'s mechanism of action parallels enzalutamide. Cheers, Phil

[PhilipSZacarias]

Hello Patrick, have you experienced any side effects with Arimidex? Have you considered DIM? Do you have any opinions on the latter? How did you convince your doctor to prescribe a medication, which I believe is typically given to women who have be treated for breast cancer? Cheers, Phil

[pjoshea13 in reply to PhilipSZacarias]

Hi Philip,

I established a relationship with an integrative medicine guy over a dozen years ago. I was taking androstenedione - which had become illegal - & I was going to need testosterone down the road.

I was on chrysin+bioperine for aromatase inhibition & he was wary of chrysin & though Arimidex was safer. So I said yes.

A lot of guys have asked their GPs for Arimidex & been laughed at. Pure ignorance - as though high E2 is safe.

All along I was on DIM Plus at 8 caps /day. But I hadn't heard of a possible aromatase benefit.

-Patrick