Tingling hands and wrists, fatigue, achey but also feelings my system is wound up? Is this a flare up?

I am in a complete dilemma. I am experiencing all the above symptoms and I'm not sure why it is. It could be two things, but whatever the cause, I am feeling pretty yucky, which is really annoying because I was doing quite well apart from menopausal flushing.

First possible cause is that I've finished my last batch of NDT ( Thyroid S), and started on another, and so I'm not sure if this batch is working well or not. The other possible cause is a reaction from a one off Osteoporosis infusion treatment that I've had recently for the first time, and unfortunately, at the same time as changing the NDT batch. I regret having this treatment until I knew the NDT was working, but having it on the NHS, I had to get it when I could.

My Rheumatologist claims due to my age, my early onset of Osteoporosis is mostly caused by my upper levels of T3 and very low TSH, and wants me to reduce my NDT significantly. I fear if I do this, I am going to feel even more fatigued. My T3 was 6.8 and the normal range was 6.5 on my last test, so I don't think it is too high. My T4 was mid range of normal.

I've read other posts that you're not supposed to alter dosages of NDT from day to day, which I didn't realise until now, but have been doing to see if I feel any better.

I am in a quandary about things and how to try and feel like I did several months ago. I have to self medicate as my GP is of no help in the thyroid area & the local endocrinology department will not prescribe T3 or NDT, so also useless.

I am also taking a vitamin supplement, Vit D, and just started taking magnesium.

Any thoughts or insight of how I'm feeling and how I can help things will be greatly appreciated. Thanks!

[Alanna012]

My T3 was 6.8 and the normal range was 6.5 on my last test, so I don't think it is too high. My T4 was mid range of normal.

I got exactly the same results after taking Thyroid S and felt greatly improved aside from bad rashes, headache, and frighteningly awful inability to wind down and sleep. I felt 'wound up', despite still having a few symptoms. After a time of being nearly 72 hours awake, I threw the towel in with much regret.

I think (anecdotally) TS is very potent t4 wise (I'm assuming it's the T4 as my body seems to always have an issue with it) so you get to the upper limit T3 but might still need more perhaps. I know a few people taking quite a large dose with ranges above the T3 reference range. It also has a lot of fillers. My private doctor (who, it worth noting has a vested interest in writing prescriptions for money and can't exactly do that where TS is concerned) says he found the amount of filler in each TS tablet can vary, causing inconsistencies in absorption of the hormones in his patients. He apparently ran a trial.

Aside from speculation, menopause (estrogen dominance) can cause both low bone density and problems with thyroid hormone uptake - I'll find some sources and link.

My personal belief now is that all women with thyroid illness should start supplementing either bioidentical combined hormone treatment or an effective pure sourced progesterone cream as soon as they reach pre-menopausal stage or try supplements that help balance hormones.

And once you walk into a Rheumatology department and confess to taking T3 they will just blame it on that. It's easy for them.

A Rheumatologist told me I categorically did not have an autoimmune disease and positively no thyroid antibodies. Said I needed anti-depressants for anxiety. I truly started believing I was suffering from a mental illness.

I later discovered they didn't even check TPO.

[Hidden in reply to Alanna012]

Thank you for that helpful information. Regarding Oestrogen dominance, I thought Oestrogen is supposed to drastically reduce in menopause, my doctors think it's most likely low because of the bone loss and hair thinning I am also getting. Unfortunately, they won't test it. Have you stopped taking Thyroid S now, and if so, what do you take now?

[Alanna012 in reply to Hidden]

Yes oestrogen drops, but Progesterone is meant to be the dominant hormone. Low progesterone causes many symptoms. When you become menopausal, the body still produces some oestrogen (there is a different mechanism to how it does this after menopause, I'll have to dig it up) but without sufficient progesterone oestrogen now becomes the dominant hormone.

So effectively you have both lowered oestrogen and oestrogen dominance at the same time. Then factor in all the synthetic oestrogens which get in body products, food, dairy etc.

This results in an increase to susceptibility to breast cancers etc. It isn't oestrogen per se, it is oestrogen without sufficient regulatory progesterone. It causes all sorts of physical issues. Including hair thinning.

This why you should never supplement oestrogen in isolation, even if menopausal.

HRT and the pill contain progestins and progestogens. Which are a slightly altered structure from natural bioidentical progesterone.

progesteronetherapy.com/

Also see Videos by Barbara Hoffman on Youtube. She is an American Naturopathic doctor and unbelievably, if you write her an email she gives advice and sends information on menopause treatment for free.

I emailed and she gave me info about fibromyalgia and told me to go on NDT 4 years ago.

[Hidden in reply to Alanna012]

Thank you, this is really helpful.

[Serendipitious in reply to Alanna012]

Alaana012,

Are you taking a progesterone cream? If so which one and how?

Also what supplements are you referring to that balance hormones?

[Hidden in reply to Serendipitious]

No I'm not on HRT, but seriously thinking about going on it. I take D3 with K2, just started B12 yesterday, and will start the Ferritin again as this may help with my hair thinning. Other than that I take a multivitamin without iodine intermittently. I am not very good at popping pills as they make my belly rather nauseous.

[Hidden in reply to Serendipitious]

Sorry, I didn't read that the post wasn't for me on my alert before replying.

[Serendipitious in reply to Hidden]

MapleMoose,

That’s ok still interesting to know. I’m also getting tingling in my wrists, fingers and toes. I know I’m under medicated. However that’s because my TSH refuses to come back up and there’s limited conversion from T4 to T3.

[Hidden in reply to Serendipitious]

Are you on NDT? If you have poor conversion, then maybe you need more T3. I did and then I switched to NDT, it's only recently I've had the tingling on my wrists and hands.

[Alanna012 in reply to Hidden]

I moved on to Armour, then NP. Without a doubt other than those issues, Thyroid S was the best of them for effectiveness. Armour comes second, but only if you get a potent batch.

I've given up on NDT, and am (please god🙏🏿) having some success with T3 only. It's early days 😬 so I'll see how it goes.

[Hidden in reply to Alanna012]

All the best with the T3 and thank you!

[Hidden in reply to Alanna012]

I was also seriously thinking of going on a combined Oestrogen/Progesterone HRT for the hair thinning, night sweats and loss of bone density. It's hard to know what to do.

[Farrugia in reply to Hidden]

There's a lot of good information about osteoporosis and different types of HRT on balance-menopause.com - there are loads of different articles, all science based.

I was told by my Dr that oestrogen is the best thing for preventing osteoporosis. I've tried a lot of different types of HRT and am now on an oestrogen patch (Estradot) and Utrogestan tablet (which is micronised progesterone). My sleep is a million times better which is the most striking benefit for me, it didn't improve much on previous types of HRT I used. I still have hair thinning but I think that's my thyroid - am on Levothyroxine and I don't think I convert very well. I've read on here that for hair thinning you need good levels (not just in range) of ferritin. I haven't managed to get that sorted yet.

[Hidden in reply to Farrugia]

Thank you, this is helpful! Did you find that the Oestrogen lowered your thyroid levels? I have read it can do that

[Farrugia in reply to Hidden]

I was already taking hrt when I was diagnosed with Hashimoto’s so I wouldn’t know how it affects it. It’s tricky because quite a few menopause symptoms are similar to thyroid symptoms so sometimes I’m not sure which is the problem!

[Anthea55]

My first thought is carpal tunnel syndrome, but have a look at the Thyroid UK page for symptoms of underactive thyroid.

thyroiduk.org/if-you-are-un...

[Hidden in reply to Anthea55]

Thanks. It just seems strange the tingling has just started and I've never had this issue before.

[humanbean in reply to Anthea55]

Anthea55

Carpal tunnel was my first thought too.

Another alternative that I wondered about was levels of B12 and/or folate dropping.

[Hidden in reply to humanbean]

I have just ordered Magnesium Glycinate which has folate in it, so that may help. Thank you!

[helvella Administrator in reply to Hidden]

If you are deficient in B12, it is advised to commence taking B12 before starting folate.

Taking folate while still B12 deficient can cause subacute combined degeneration of the spinal cord.

[Hidden in reply to helvella]

Oh Gosh! I didn't know that, thank you! I have a B12 spray, so I will start to take it properly from now on.