Lalatoot

Well you could increase levo or lio but only one of them at a time.

jostafford0 in reply to Lalatoot

I know my GP won't increase my Levo as he will probably be alarmed at my low TSH (if he sees this level he will probably try and reduce my Levo). I might try and increase the ERFA by a quarter so I am taking half a grain on top of my Levo and see how I feel. I honestly feel different every day, some days I feel ok and others feel dreadful. There is no happy medium unfortunately.

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Lora7again in reply to jostafford0

Why don't you just take NDT? I took Thyroid S and it suited me instead of the artificial Levo. Levothyroxine is very cheap to buy on line btw.

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jostafford0 in reply to Lora7again

I can't tolerate it unfortunately or I would just take NDT - I have tried just about everything. I am very very sensitive to medication.

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Lora7again in reply to jostafford0

I suffer with allergies so I was worried about taking Thyroid S but I took it slowly and it did make me feel better. Everything is trial and error with thyroid disease.

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jostafford0 in reply to Lora7again

I get huge palpitations and shaking even on the lowest dose plus it made me feel absolutely dreadful. I stuck with it for 3 weeks then had to give it up, I was so disappointed. The only one I’ve been able to tolerate is ERFA but that is at a low dose with the Levo. My consultant trialled it as I never thought to combine the two although I’m nowhere near at optimum level yet. My consultant has gone AWOL since lockdown so I’m going it alone.

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Ela_peraj in reply to Lora7again

Where can you get that please. Ndt? How does it help the thyroids?

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Lora7again in reply to Ela_peraj

I see you are new member can you start a thread telling us about yourself?

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greygoose

I take B

All the Bs?

D

Do you also take magnesium? Vit D and magnesium work together.

K

Which one?

multi vits

Not recommended to take multi-vits, for all sorts of reasons.

Chitosan

Why do you take that?

Calcium

Why do you take calcium? That's not a good thing to take because it's not well absorbed and can build up in the arteries. If you're taking vit D, that will increase your absorption of calcium from food, plus you'll more than likely get calcium in any mulit-vit you're taking. It's very easy to over-dose, and that is not a good thing to do.

MCT oil

Are you trying to lose weight? Or do you have high cholesterol?

adaptogens.

What are you trying to acheive with the adaptogens? They won't affect thyroid hormones, and could have the opposite to the desired effect on cortisol. Have you had your cortisol tested?

jostafford0 in reply to greygoose

I take Jarrow B Right & Methyl Folate as I’ve had really low levels of both folate & B12. Better You vit D&K 4 sprays at night, Nature’s Way Alive which is multi vits, calcium chewable tabs prescribed by my GP, magnesium spray at night, MCT oil & Adaptogens recommended by Isabella Wentz on her Adrenal reset 6 week course. My cortisol is high. I don’t need to lose weight but notice my limbs look like jelly.

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greygoose in reply to jostafford0

OK, well, there are several multies of that name, but the one I looked at wasn't very good:

It contained iron - therefore you won't absorb any of the vitamins, because iron blocks absorption of vitamins.

And it contains calcium, which will bind with the iron so that you won't absorb either of them. So far, it's a complete waste of money!

It also contains iodine, which you really do not want because you're hypo. You're already getting iodine from your food and your thyroid hormone replacement, so you're probably over-dosed on iodine by now. And that is a really bad thing.

It contains copper. Hypos are usualy high in copper and low in zinc, so best to get them both tested before taking any of either. They need to be balanced.

It contains magnesium oxide, which we can't absorb.

So, you're paying for a lot of things that you can't even benefit from. You might just as well throw your money straight down the drain.

Why is your doctor prescribing calcium? Do you have parathyroid problems? It's rare to be calcium deficient in the UK. I hope he keeps a close eye on your levels. When did he last test it?

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jostafford0 in reply to greygoose

Hi Greygoose, thank you for your reply. I thought the Alive multi vits were ok because contain fruits & veggies. It says no added iron but it does contain calcium & iodine. My GP never told me why they prescribed calcium but I was prescribed it after I was on steroids for a colitis flare 4 years ago. I did a Blue Horizon blood test a few months ago to check my B12 and it included a few more tests which showed I’d got low calcium & testosterone but high magnesium & zinc which surprised me a lot. My B12 was fine!

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greygoose in reply to jostafford0

Fruit and veg are fine, but best on the dinner plate.

I think you should ask your doctor about the calcium: why he prescribed it and why he doesn't check it regularly.

Ignore the high magnesium, blood tests only test what is in the blood, and the body makes sure that magnesium levels are pretty much always good in the blood. But, that doesn't mean you're not deficient at a cellular level - most people are because soils are depeleted. And, if you're taking vit D, you need extra magnesium because the vit D will deplete it even further. Excess will be excreted, anyway.

Zinc is another matter. Did you not have copper tested at the same time?

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jostafford0 in reply to greygoose

Yes copper was within limits although on the lower end. It’s odd I’ve got high zinc as I wasn’t supplementing (and I wasn’t taking the multi vits either at that time). I’ll stop the multi vits as they do seem like a waste of money now. Thank you for the advice on the magnesium. Do you know what prevents vit & minerals getting into the system on a cellular level? I’ll also ask my GP when I next speak with him about the calcium.

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greygoose in reply to jostafford0

Well, I have heard of that before, people having high zinc and low copper, but I don't know why.

It's not the cellular level that's the problem. It's at the gut level that the nutrients aren't absorbed. And that's because the food isn't digested properly, due to low stomach acid.

Insist your doctor tests your calcium.

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Hidden

Hey Jo, I would increase NDT.

Like you I had high cortisol because of being hypo, ashwaganda didn't help, I tried holy basil, it was the same. Taking a lot of supps can be very taxing for your body, for liver and also adrenals, I personally disagree with Wentz, she sells supps and lives from it. I would take minimum needed to address deficiencies.

Once your thyroid levels are good, your cortisol will normalise, it is completely normal.

jostafford0 in reply to Hidden

Thank you Cuppaofcha, it’s reassuring to know I might feel normal soon. I’ve got myself mixed up with so many supplements I don’t know what I need & what I don’t. I was so poorly with low B12 & folate a few years ago that I’ve panicked & just started taking everything I’ve read about.

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Hidden in reply to jostafford0

I did the same back then, I have taken everything and anything. B12, D, folate, iron are essential, if you have low levels. Personally I take Floravital in liquid form for iron and B's, plus rich B vitamin diet (whatever is easy on your body), Vit D in capsule, folate from food, loads of greens. I was on 20+ supps before, digestive enzymes, vit c, vit a, vit e, adaptogens, inositol etc etc. If you decide to remove some supps, do one at a time so you know what is what.

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helbell

Hi Jo, your T3 could do with raising and your t4 will be lower if you are taking any T3 containing dose. I also combine levo and NDT because NDT alone gives me palps.

If you manage to raise your T3 with more NDT expect your t4 to lower a bit more.

I'm currently taking 150 levo and 1grain naturethroid. Levo as one dose with half grain, then half grain at teatime. I know we're all different with individual levels, and react differently. You sound hypo, and hypo alone will hinder vitamin and mineral absorption and increase gut issues including lowering stomach acid. For me personally, getting my T3 up helped with sluggish adrenal function and vit/min deficiency. Watch out for shakes and palps as you raise dose, which also be a sign of adrenal fatigue which will go hand in hand with low thyroid hormone. So go low and slow. It's hard to get T3 levels up on levo alone. Not only because some of us have conversion issues, but also a scientific fact that using levo alone does not replace normal T3/t4 ratios of a healthy functioning thyroid mechanism. Some cope with that, some don't. Many don't even know that's what might be ailing them. Anyway, keep an eye on those vit levels...plenty of great advice here and raise thyroid hormone low and slow.

jostafford0 in reply to helbell

Thank you Helbell, I will try a 1/4 of ERFA at teatime and see how I feel. I didn't realise free T4 lowered when you took T3 so that is good information to know. I thought I had to get both in the upper levels so it was frustrating me when I could see my levels dropping. Can I please ask if your TSH is below the threshold and how you get round this with your GP? If they see my TSH so low they will reduce my Levo for sure. Jo x

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helbell in reply to jostafford0

Most will drop dose on low tsh. Which is why I self dose and test.

My tsh is suppressed when my T3 is in the upper quartile. That's when I feel well. Most GPs don't know that taking T3 will further lower tsh and T4. Self treatment is not perfect but it's the difference between being able to function or horribly symptomatic undertsh driven treatment. Like many others, my tsh response is sluggish and does not reflect live thyroid hormone levels. Your T3 is the main thing. I saw a private endo for a while...or an endo privately, because I wasn't getting better on levo and started self dosing. He requested that my surgery tested for T3 only because I was taking (T3) NDT. They hated it but didn't go against him. A while after I'd stopped seeing him, my GP persuaded me to try levo again using surgery lab results. I said I'd need at least 150 mcg starting dose and he agreed. I was fine for a few weeks then the symptoms started creeping back but he would only continue to monitor and dose via tsh.

A private test revealed my T3 was dropping again so I gave up the fight with my doctor and went back to self treating. Since then our surgery has had a huge change in staff so whilst I'm still being treated for any single issues, my hypothyroidism isn't being picked up.

The NICE guidelines state T4 should be tested if a patient is still symptomatic. I hope your GP knows about T3. Be strong. Actually, if you're going to tackle it through your surgery, ask for help how to go about it, and what you are entitled to, from the forum. x

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jostafford0

Hello - thank for you reply. I tried Tiromel 5mg and it made me feel dreadful, like the blood had rushed from my head, my skin was grey and I had huge dark circles round my eyes, I had palpitations and shakiness with insomnia. I stuck it for weeks but had to stop as it was making me so ill (Did Tiromel make you feel like this when you started it?). A private blood test showed I'd got low testosterone. I wonder if that is wrong with my muscles (or lack of them) - I exercise every day but I cannot tone up and its like all my muscle has turned to jelly/cellulite. I've given up with doctors as all of them I've seen have been useless!! If you get chance, can you PM me the Testosterone supplement and where you order it from? Thank you - Jo