interesting results

Perhaps someone could kindly look at my results and give their comments.

blood test for Nov 16 taking 75 mcg thyroxine and 20mcg liothyronine

ft4 14.2 (10-24)

ft3 5.4 (4-8.3)

TSH 0.04 (0.4-4.5)

blood test Jan 17 taking 100mcg Thyroxine only after 6 weeks.

ft4 19.6

ft3 4.4

TSH 0.03

I would have expected TSH to rise not fall,as I was told it was suppressed due to T3,but is now more suppressed just on T4.

It looks like the T4 is not converting to T3.

Hopefully someone a lot more knowledgeable can help!

Thanks.

10 Replies

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  • It depends on the time we get a blood test as the TSH varies all through the 24 hours. Also the other results might well vary too. Your first TSH was fine as you were on T3 also. On your second test without T3 your FT4 is higher and T3 is lower so your results look o.k. to me. The most important thing is how you are 'feeling' on this dose.

    web.archive.org/web/2010103...

  • Hi, thanks for your reply.

    I'm feeling pretty awful all round to be honest.I'm very tired,headaches,but I am mostly concerned that my blood pressure has gone up and I am having palpitations,so thinking that the 100 thyroxine is too much,but 75 mcg of thyroxine alone wasn't enough as I couldn't function very well.

  • The more I reduced levothyroxine and increased T3 the better I became but that's not to say that everyone will have the same experience.

    We have to be allowed to trial several thyroid hormones/doses to find a sweet spot for us as individuals.

    I'm not surprised you are not feeling so good due to the actual reduction of thyroid hormones, i.e. T3/T4 is around 135 equivalent of levothyroxine but you are now taking 100mcg.

    Whenever doctors mess about with doses to get the patients' results in 'range' the patient suffers.

    If you read the above link you might find it very helpful.

    p.s I had constant palps when on levo.

  • Hi, thanks for that.

    Yes I was much better with the T3,but due to costs they are trying to take it away.

    Initially the gave me 125 mcg Thyroxine, but my heart was thumping so much and I was afraid I would have a heart attack! So I reduced it to 100.

    the Endo said the T3 is suppressing the TSH, and"we are aiming for an un-suppressed TSH."

    How on earth can that be achieved if it is still suppressed on Thyroxine only?

  • I cannot fathom out how they think. I had constant palps and was in and out of A&E sometimes by ambulance. It was awful. Cardiologist was puzzled and there was talk of inserting something to record what was going on.

    Since I've gone on T3 only, my heart beats perfectly and I've not had any visits to A&E since. I assume that my body was sensitive to T4 but has calmed on T3 only and I feel well.

  • This is an excerpt from the above link which I think you'll find interest:

    TSH levels don’t significantly correlate day-to-day[1] or week-to-week.[2] One research group measured the TSH and free T3 and free T4 levels of ten normal young men.[3] When they measured the levels every 30 minutes for 24 hours, they found that the hormone levels were lower during the day and higher at night. During the day, the free T3 was 15% lower, the free T4 was 7% lower, and the TSH was 140% lower. When the researchers measured the hormone levels every five minutes for six to seven hours (7 PM-to-11 PM), the levels varied every thirty minutes. The TSH level varied 13%, the free T3 15%, and the free T4 11%.

    Other researchers measured the TSH levels of 31 healthy people. They found that women had significantly higher TSH level than men.[1] On different days, individuals had "a large" variation of TSH levels. The large variations were about equally extreme in both men and women. The researchers concluded, "The present study demonstrated a large variation of TSH levels in various conditions, even in the same individuals, indicating the necessity of strictly controlled conditions in the study of TSH secretion."

    Another research group measured TSH and thyroid hormone levels in normal people every month for a year. They found that in individuals, the levels of thyroid hormone varied within narrow limits. But among the people as a group, the levels varied considerably. The researchers wrote, "This high degree of individuality implies that rigorous comparison of thyroid hormone results against a population-based 'normal range' can be potentially misleading." They also reported higher T3 and T4 levels in winter months. During these months, the pituitary gland’s secretion of TSH was more easily provoked.[6]

  • This is another excerpt:

    You may find it helpful to keep in mind a clear-cut double standard of the endocrinology specialty. Endocrinologists keep thousands of thyroid cancer patients on TSH-suppressive doses of thyroid hormone. But these specialists vociferously warn of grave dangers if hypothyroid patients use the same TSH-suppressive doses. However, meta-analyses of studies show that these doses are harmless to thyroid cancer patients, despite them staying on the doses for decades. Rather than harming the cancer patients, TSH-suppressive doses appear to benefit them: researchers write that the patients report feeling better on these doses than hypothyroid patients do on T4-replacement. (In T4-replacement, of course, the patient uses a dose of thyroid hormone that doesn't suppress the TSH.)

    The endocrinology specialty cannot reconcile this discrepancy in its practice guidelines for the two different groups of patients. This to me is one of many pieces of evidence that T4-replacement is driven by commerce—not by science or an aim for therapeutic effectiveness. I provide rock-hard evidence for this conclusion in my forthcoming book Tyranny of the TSH.

    There is a growing coterie of physicians such as you. They’ve all enlightened themselves despite the shroud of darkness tenaciously held over the eyes of modern medicine by the endocrinology specialty. That you have freed yourself from so-called "fibromyalgia" is good. But that you’ve joined that growing clique of physicians suggests that the long-overdue liberation of millions of patients is on its way. Welcome to our side, and thank you for the patients you’ll free from the horrors of T4-replacement.

  • You have asked the 24,000 dollar question :)

  • The TSH is totally irrelevant, once you are on thyroid hormone replacement, unless it goes high. Nothing bad will happen to you if it goes low. I do wish endos would get that through their thick heads!

    You are right, you aren't converting that T4 at all well. You really need the T3 - in fact you need more than you were taking - and you don't need much T4 at all.

    The reason the TSH becomes suppressed when you are taking T3, is because you no-longer need it. Pointless having high levels of a hormone that isn't even doing anything (like the TSH and most of the T4).

  • Thanks Shaws and greygoose,very helpful.

    Just need to convince my Doctor now!

    Will ask her the question - how can the TSH be un-suppressed, and see what her answer is!

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