Years ago I rejected the principle that EOD was all I could do although it 'worked'.
A year ago I rejected the science of detention times as applied to vitamins and minerals. The day I injected 3 times a day was my start of self treatment that not only worked but was more effective.
I used the principle of plateauing for months. That when I increased my B12 injections I would plateau then try changing the frequency, amount or concentration in trials. Born of the rejection of EOD was effective in all cases.
I had rejected the principle that I would heal eventually and that there was any rational to accept it takes years as that made no sense with what I know about the human body.
I through my experience with my trials now use the principle of my body will continue to heal at a certain frequency, amount and concentration of supplementation but the rate of healing plateaus. I then start a new trial with the understanding that if effective I will need more sleep and rest, symptoms of the past may be a bit present.
I currently inject 2.4 ml 4 to 6 times a day at a concentration of 3 mg per ml.
In the last 6 weeks I have discovered that when I get tired from a more effective regime I tend not to inject as often hence the 4 to 6 times. Putting the effort into injecting 6 times a day is more than I can manage while healing. Inadvertently causing my own rollercoaster.
If I inject every three hours then I heal at a preferred rate. The way that works out is 6 times a day with sometimes waking up in the night to inject.
I also use Betaine to open my methylation pathways. I no longer treat for B12 deficiency or PA rather use Beraine to open my methylation pathways and balance out my deficiency caused by the way my methylation pathways functioned. I am enjoying the results of the last 90 days. Not yet wonderful but I do not discount that is possible. The proof either way will be in the pudding.
I did not include the frequency, forms, amounts etc when writing of all the supplements I am currently taking as I am still in flux and do not want to expend the effort at this time.
As I improve my suplimentation I change my evaluation method. The symptoms typically associated with 'B12' deficiency have been resolved by my self treatment not by just waiting and hoping. I am currently using the term 'Acuity Index'. it is useful in evaluation how my regime is effective. When my 'Acuity index' is where I want it I can do any task with the same amount of effort and do not have to decide how easy or possible a task might be. This is valuable to me as when I improve my supplementation I go through a period of less acuity as my body heals. I do expect it may be the vestige of fatigue.
Hand in hand with my concept of acuity index is inflammation. Supplementing or pushing to the point where I feel I am experiencing inflammation has no value other than to measure the effect of what I should do. I do sometimes push to where inflammation becomes an issue. That is valuable information but not healing. (I currently can swim 1/2 mile and only be tired. Or swim 500 meters three days in a row and only be tired.)
I do sometimes walk a known distance to measure progress It is not a focus as this is all about how I experience not performance. The performance is a result.
In the immediate I am working on supplementing 6 times a day to prevent the self induced roller coaster. From experience I can expect to be more tired and my acuity index to be on the low side. Past experience indicates less than a week.
As a scientist, not a technician or hobbyist who is educated not trained in the environment sciences I could design a formal numerical Acuity Index utilizing a weighted average. It has no value for me to do so.
The knowledge I have as a scientist has limited value when applied to methylation pathways. It is helpful to understand that science that is provabale by experiment is rare and all science is temporal. It is also helpful to understand doctors are only applied scientist and their ability to heal does not correlate to their ability to become licenced by the state. It took 30 days to have a better understanding of how to treat to heal than my doctor and 2.5 years to substantially know how to self treat to heal that was more effective than a modified EOD method.
My work as a professional also helps me as I understand the difference between a solution and the the best solution currently available. Modified EOD is a solution. I will let you know if I design an elegant solution.
I am competent to evaluate the risks of my supplementation as well as the benefit gained.
Self-treating has a high degree of difficulty.
As always unless I get lazy this writing is about sharing my experiences and not portenting to be competent to instruct.
All my work is done without having to eat lentils. : )
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WIZARD6787
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By cofactors I am assuming you mean B6, Ferritin and Folic Acid. And that potassium levels may go down with initial treatment utilizing the EOD medidology.
I do supplement with P-5-P, Methylfolate. The amounts and frequency are in flux as my body is different with treating my methylation pathways.
My study indicates that testing for B6 much like for B12 should not be used to determine B6 deficiency or subsequent testing.
My study indicates that the typical test for Folate is not reliable as it can be a indication of recent Folate consumed. A Folate RBC test which is more expensive and therefore not often done is what I would use.
As I indicated in my post I am currently working on supplementation 6 times a day and that will establish a base line for the next work I do.
I am making the assumption that you are referring to a B complex and not having done trials with each individual B vitamins. Note: Biotin is also known as vitamin B7, vitamin H, or vitamin B8
The only reason that I have found to recommend a B complex is is seems like a good idea. I have no information other than that. Does not mean it is not a good idea just the effectiveness of that idea is not known.
I never used a B Complex. I did use Simple Spectrum as it was designed for autism which is a neurological disorder. It did have a positive effect for a while and I did a trial of not taking it and did not experience any difference. It is on my list of trials to try again.
Thanks so much Wizard! The reason I was wondering was because you supplement B6 as P5P along with the folate and B12, so I thought maybe there was a reason you only took the P5P and not the other B vitamins. But you answered my question thank you 👍
I follow your personal B12 ++ treatment regime with great interest WIZARD.
Thank you for sharing your progress, and also your thinking with us. It is outside of the medical norms and fascinating to think about. I am very very glad to hear you are recovering and repairing with a B12 approach that seems very effective for you.
Could you perhaps share what your symptoms were? Also, where are you now in terms of their repair/recovery? I wonder which of your own symptoms were relieved first? You do sound very well.... healed?
You may recall I am also working on determining a level of B12 dosage/frequency that works for me. I could not ( or rather my partner) find any scientific basis for the UK NICE B12 dosage/freqencies. So, I too decided to "feel" my way ahead .like many do in our forum here.
I also use the usual cofactors each day, and now, use betaine (thanks to you) to help bridge into methylation. My own logic stemmed from the fact that B12 is water soluble and readily metabolised. So its a quick usage system, and (obviously) will be influenced by exercise levels and food energy/good diet. I also worked on the assumptions that there is a B12 "daily burn" rate that requires a certain level of B12 bioavailability. But, also a higher level for sustaining recovery and repairs. Given our cells repair/regenerate at different rates some repairs/ recovery will take longer than others i.e. brain function/nerve function.
I used a combination of daily SI and SL B12 supplementation to keep high levels of availability approx 3x higher that the NICE levels and treatment stages. I found those Japanese B12 articles most instructive ref dosage levels. I intend to sustain my x3 levels for a year. I am using Dr Chandy's Health Check listing to keep my own log of my signs and symptoms. The first effect i had was much less brain fog, and less headaches. Recently, I have found that i can walk farther and a little faster, though i get tired soon afterwards. I also believe my tinnitus is less..noisy?
As your own recoveries progress, do you anticipate scaling down your dosage/frequency of treatments...?
My work is not outside science but is outside medicial understanding and the results are far superior to what the medicial field will accomplish.
I was miss DX my whole life and in November 2024 I was close enough to death that the medicialfield could Dx B12 deficiency. They had and still have no understanding of how to treat it as effective as I do.
My symptoms and results of treatment were somewhat standard until 90 days ago. The only two I did not experience were menstrual issues and Tinnitus. I did experience Tinnitus for about a month and that resolved with more B12.
I do not give or take advice to those on the forum. I have found the advice of you will get better in time to be incorrect and born of assuming what they experience is and will be universal which is is not. I was less worse when injecting 1.5 mg per day. That worked.
Living with a 'acuity index' as defined by me and having to regulate my activity so I do not experience inflammation does not work for me. The fact that my results are superior to other regimes only means to me other methodology fails me. Anyone who has not experienced the results of my regime have no reason to believe they can evaluate it. And have zero idea how it might work without trying it for themselves, although some make such a claim.
I did not experience a linear reversal of symptoms and have not known anyone to personally recount that happening. I have known of people that believe that happens for reasons not known.
Good on you for discovering that Betine is effective for you. As far as I know there are three of us experiencing that benefit.
" I also worked on the assumptions that there is a B12 "daily burn" rate that requires a certain level of B12 bioavailability. But, also a higher level for sustaining recovery and repairs. Given our cells repair/regenerate at different rates some repairs/ recovery will take longer than others i.e. brain function/nerve function."
I work with the assumption that without enough B12 my cells smoldered and did not heal reasonably until the last 90 days.
"As your own recoveries progress, do you anticipate scaling down your dosage/frequency of treatments...?" My methodology is that I should never supplement more than is effective and never supplement less than is effective. I understand I nor anyone else understands how to measure that other than symptoms. I do not anticipate as my self treatment is unique. So the final outcome will be determined by information not conjecture.
It is important to understand I am in flux as I have yet to maintain dosing 6 times a day consistently.
It is also important to understand Betine is just the start of opening my methylation pathways and I am still studying that and have not got to the level of understanding I require for design.
I do not understand the feeling one's way. It is not what I do but some find it hard not to believe that is all I can do because they can not.
Simplified: I increase by B12, experience a slight up tic followed by a period of downturn as my body uses the energy to heal, plateau repeat.
Wizard, I was just thinking have you tried MSM natural sulphur to open up cell permeability. The salt and potassium pump. We are supposedly all so short of this and it is the third most abundant in our bodies. I do well on this. Also have you tried copper. I seem to do well on this too.
No I have not tried either. Thanks for sharing and the heads up. Good to look at more than the B12 solution.
I am day 5 into a trial of 700mcg NAD. 180 pound male. It seems positive but my body is still adjusting and that takes energy. More of the feel a bit off while the new supplement takes effect.
I would be keen to see how you get on with NAD, I have not tried it. I am now on copper 9mgs a day, I might up that to 12 a little later. I taken a good mineral drop supplement and MSM. I do not seem to hold onto my electrolytes well. My cortisol is always low and goes to low normal by about 6pm every day. I also take magnesium and all the other co-factors for B12. I have notice that MSM and copper give me more energy. My energy levels are not good, but they stuck me under that old ME/CFS diagnosis without telling me my B12 and thyroid had bottom out. I am also on T3 now for the last 8 months, I felt a difference when first starting but that has stagnated. I am also on betaine, digestive enzymes, probiotics and bile salts.
I have completed 7 days of 700 mg of NAD and the results are positive. I will do a trial of 1,400 once my rate of improvement has plateaued.
I assume any reaction I have to a change in supplementation to be a sign of my body improving and do not consider it a side effect until it has not resolved over time. Currently about 7 days. When under supplementing it was months or not at all.
With the addition of NAD I experience a increased ability to experience emotions and do not assume the NAD is causing anxiety rather I can now process the emotions that I experience in a way that was not possible before. Hard work that!!!
I discovered that I need more electrolytes than most people in 1982. I do not consider it a defect rather just the way my body works.
One hack that I often use when experiencing intense exertion is to eat watermelon with salt. Watermelon has a high amount of potassium and is sweet.
I also use popcorn and lemonade from a movie theater.
It is very interesting Wizard. I had not thought of trying NAD before. Thank you for keeping me updated so I can make a decision on it. I have very low cortisol on a saliva test, it flatlines all day and rises just in the normal range for late afternoon, evening, this is when I feel I have some more energy. Endo early morning blood test shows me at 360 and they will not treat although it is on the very low end. NICE guidelines say to treat 400 and under. There was a time when my early morning cortisol test showed 117 and they still did not treat. Interestingly enough when I am very ill with a virus or such my cortisol will rise into the 600's even though I feel so ill I can stand up for longer then 5 minutes and have so much more energy. My blood pressure is extremely low. When my cortisol was 117 I was fainting on standing up. Now I just feel light headed when standing up. Do not get this late afternoon and evening. It is all intertwined but endo's do not want to look above what they are taught. Low cortisol can play havoc with electrolytes. I am now on T3. I hear that can help raise cortisol and blood pressure. My heart beat definitely feels stronger.
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Hydroxo-B12 in the US?
