PIP - How are they allowed to get away with this!?

[Ceri-NorthWales]

Just had mandatory reconsideration letter through. Yet again 0 points!

So many lies! More than last time! How are they allowed to get away with this and what can I do!?

The first thing I'll say that they have put in the letter and I am sure many of you will choke at this too. I swear they have put this in for a laugh. "There was no evidence of cognitive difficulties or overwhelming pyschological distress". Seriously!? Wtf!? I have letter from a Liverpool Walton Centre Neurologist which I sent a copy of stating I am under significant distress and that is having an impact on my physical and mental wellbeing.

"You said you have difficulty engaging with others. You engaged appropriately at the health assessment with no prompting or support from third party." This is an outright lie! The friend that was with me had to answer some of the questions, particularly in regards to mental health as I struggled and was visibly distressed, sweaty hands, refused to talk about mental health, even when the assessor pushed. She wanted to talk about things I find very difficult to talk about. No. I was incredibly uncomfortably, changed sitting position and had very closed body language. Seriously, how are they allowed to lie!?

"You said you have diffivulties with buttons fastenings. No restrictions were observed with the movement of your hands. You are able to fill your car with fuel and handled your bag without difficulty. There was no observed redness or swelling in your hands.." I didn't use my hands in the assessment nor did they ask me to do anything with my hands. She asked about buttons. I answered, I don't wear clothes with buttons. Right wrist is pretty unusable and 'clunks' out. I have going through proprioceptive retraining and purposely use my other wrist for so much. I picku up my bag with left wrist which has a ganglyion cyst in which presses on the ulna nerve. If i use a straight wrist, I am able to use it. I didn't even use the door at the assessment. She didn't even look or ask to look at my hands and my hands and wrists are painful and swell with use. Ask me to pick up a kettle and you'll notice! Ask me to do the weeding and I cannot move my wrist for the rest of the day and it is agony the following day.

"You said that you struggled to prepare food due to injury to your wrist and your health conditions. You were observed to move freely, lift a bag with your right hand and there was no redness or swelling observable." I didn't lift my bag with my right wrist as I do not do that. If they contacted the hand therapist at Countess of Chester they would know the difficulties and the medical facts regarding my right wrist. I was sent to Pulvertaft Hand Centre at Royal Derby Hospital to get the correct diagnosis! Again, all evidence sent in. The consultant in question is the ONLY consultant in the NHS that has the experise to diagnose what I have done to my right wrist. He also the ONLY consulltant who can stablise the joint. It isn't fixable, only able to make it more stable.

There are so many other examples of LIES within this letter. Every word is lie. What am I supposed to do now!? How can they can get away with lying? I was counting on PIP to be able to afford a car. I am COMPLETELY STRANDED where I live. I hate this life. I really do.

[CecilyParsley]

Oh Ceri, I am so terribly sorry lovely. These lies seem to be commonplace. You need to challenge them on it. I did with mine and actually got compensation. It makes me so angry that they seem to not weigh up medical advice and are often clearly unfit and unqualified to judge. My first assessor was a Physio, my second a mental health nurse who had never heard of Bechets and confessed he did not know what Lupus was?? Have you looked at the Benefits and Work site? It costs under £20 for the year and is invaluable and advises you how to complete the forms and challenge decisions. It helped me so much to put my thoughts coherently. Don’t let them win Ceri. Take some time to get your thoughts together. Now it is me who wants to give you the biggest Cwtch xxx

[Ceri-NorthWales in reply to CecilyParsley]

How do I challenge tham though? This is already mandatory reconsideration. The person who did the assessment was formerly a mentaal health nurse so I am VERY surprised at the lies in this. No distress? I refused to answers her questions, even when she pushed on mental health and also said, "it's ok, I don't want to make you uncomfortable." My friend answered for me, so how the hell can it say I had no input from a third party? Complete and utter LIE.

How they hell can these people be employed by these people and lie? I have no idea what the hell I am supposed to do now. And with the monday to friday mentality still rife even in time of global pandemic, no places open to talk to. Mind and CAB closed at 3 or 4pm which is complete and utter madness.

They also have the cheek to say I have no intervention with mental health. No I don't, not because I don't need it but because North Wales Mentla Health Team are complete and utter shit and are incapable of helping anyone and excel at putting people in crisis and confirming they are nothing. I haven't been able to afford private therapy in a long while and THAT is true real help.

Wht the hell am I supposed to do!? I KNOW I am beter off dead. I never thought I would say this, but I really do wish illhealth on ******, the person from DWP who wrote this pack of lies and ******* who did the assessment. They should be on the receiving end of this and see what it is REALLY like. Same with BCUHB!

[CecilyParsley in reply to Ceri-NorthWales]

I went to Tribunal with my DLA claim. I had expected that the judges would be more sympathetic but OMG it was brutal. The doctor asked me how many incontinence pads I used, if I wet the bed. Then he disputed that I fell and injured myself. They had 92 pages of medical info plus photographs of my broken nose, smashed out teeth, rashes, mouth ulcers etc. He then asked me if I travelled to St Thomas’s how did I get there. I told him my husband drove me. He asked how could I manage to hold my bladder for the journey? I said we stopped in every service station. He said give me the names?? I lost it then I ranted that if they would like me to pull down my trousers and show them the bruises on my ass and legs I would and that if they thought someone who was incontinent could hold their bladder for hours think again. They gave me a break because I was crying and could not stop. The DWP representative stood up and said they did not believe I was sick. I left completely defeated. They told me that they intended to take me to court to get back the ESA I had been paid. I felt like you Ceri, I wanted to die, to give up. That was when I started the antidepressants. I won my case thank God. The system is designed to make you give up. I honestly think anyone who did not need the financial support would never put themselves through it. I think you will have to submit a new application but I could be wrong. You need some advice from people who know and help. All I can say is that these people are not worth you feeling that you are better off dead. These people do not know you, do not understand your health issues. They are paid to work for the DWP and not for claimants. You are worth far more Ceri xxx

[CHEZZAD68 in reply to Ceri-NorthWales]

You need to appeal the decision and then it will be looked at by an independent appeal judge. The majority of appeals concerning PIP are successful. Good luck!

[suzannah16]

so sorry for you. I find it hard to fill out those forms myself and gave up after being rejected for PIP. they lie and you are supposed to provide new evidence. how when they ignore everything? it really is designed to prevent us qualifying.

[Ceri-NorthWales in reply to suzannah16]

They say they have looked at it, but they really haven't. How the hell are they above a top hand surgeon in the UK? How are they above GPs, consultants? Are they qualified to say what I can and cannot do with my right wrist? Are they hell! And going through propriceptive retraining, you are taught how to sue your wrist in a different way and how to compensate for how unusable it is.

Citezen's Advice have helped me all the way through. They helped with all forms, prep for assessment and mandatory reconsideration. I ahven't ben able to get in touch with them today because of the monday-friday mentality. Post arrived at about 3, CAB phonelines shut at 3. Mental!

And the lack of face to face is causing far more harm than good! I understood the measures in the beginning but these measures have caused more damage than good for a very long tim now. But hey, nothing else matter but a virus that has been downgraded and is nowhere near as deadly as they first thought. 1% of all covid related deaths in England and Wales have been people aged 45 and under, 93% aged 65 and over, 47% aged 85 and over. And there have been so many deathss recorded as covid when covid was nothing to do with the death and I have proof of that.

[LalSD]

Hello Ceri, I can feel your pain and sadness. Any battle in life is difficult. Is there a way you can appeal to this decision? Please remember if you feel the decision is wrong. does not matter what decision and it puts you in a vulnerable position, then you have right to appeal or ask them to reconsider it. I would state that the decision does not address your physical and mental health need and requires to be reviewed giving the reasons of why. If you can, please may I suggest for you to write the reasons in bullet points and write your evidence across, straight to the point. Lx

[Spanielmadlady]

Hi sorry to hear of your struggles.i dread my pip assessment I also had many lies on mine but as it was granted I let it go.if I was you I'd go to or contact citizens advice .big hug xx

[Spanielmadlady]

P.s you haven't got to let these people get to you it's what they want x

[Krazykat26]

Oh Ceri 🤗 gentle cyber hug from me lady 🤗 this is awful but oh-so common..I speak as a lady who has been there..done that..got the t-shirt!!

I TOTALLY understand where you're coming from..the whole process is an absolute farce n it seems it's done to cause more harm than good 😠😤

When u read all the lies that they have said about u..it makes one wonder if u were both at the same assessment doesn't it? Anyway to business..on that letter it will tell u that u have the right to appeal their decision..this is what u must do now..contact citizens advice when they're open n appeal it..they will tell u what to do. However be aware that this process takes a long time..it took just over a year for my ESA appeal to get to court!!

By then I was so ill that I didn't even go to the hearing n yet I still won it!! 🤷🤦What a complete waste of time n taxpayers money!!

These so called health professions r fake n the whole process is like some kind of reverse psychology!! N they make their own assumptions..for instance my assessor asked how I washed my hair..I said I don't wash it much..she said how long since u washed it..I said 6 months..she however thought that my appearance didn't appear like I hadn't washed my hair!! Obviously if she leaves hers for a couple of days it's greasy..mine doesn't get greasy coz I don't overwash it!! 🤦Anyway that's just to try n give u a giggle in these difficult times..back to serious..u will get your car but it won't be for some time..when u win that appeal all the money will be backdated!!

My experience has taught me that the way to view the whole process is that at the face to face..they'll nick your handbag..refusal of pip is like them burgling your house..mandatory reconsideration is when they try to kill us!!

It sounds as if u provided lots of evidence at the assessment..please DO NOT lose hope..it's just gonna take lot longer than u thought!!

Be strong n keep on...U WILL WIN!! 🌈😽😽Xx

[meecee1]

This is a common situation, it is terrible , however, it isn't the end of the road. They should have given you two copies of the mandatory reconsideration letter. When you lodge an appeal, you have to attach one of the copies to prove you have gone through the mandatory reconsideration stage as you cannot appeal before this is done. I would advise getting in touch with a local advice agency for assistance with this. They are all working from home so will answer your telephone message or email. Tell them you need assistance to appeal giving them the date marked on your letter so they know when the deadline is. The agency you choose will draft your appeal letter and have you sign a consent form advising the tribunal service you authorise them to act on your behalf. The tribunal service has a massive backlog caused by the Covid-19, so your appeal may take some time to be heard. If succesful benefit will be backdated to the date you called for the claim pack. For your local CAB go onto the CAB page and there is a place you can put your postcode for the nearest bureau. Appeals are more successful when the person has a representative with them. It also takes some of the stress off of you. I was reviewing my reply and had missed the part where you said CAB had helped you with all of the stages so far. Thy will also receive the mandatory reconsideration outcome so should contact you about appealing. I would still call or email to make sure they have received a response. In order to be eligible for a car you need the enhanced rate (12 points) awarded for at least 3 years. You will receive all of the information if you win your appeal with 12 points for the mobility component, the care component does not count towards a mobility car. Good luck, you have come this far so keep it up. Marie

[TM1970]

Meecee1 is right. Also you will still receive 80% of your dla while waiting for a tribunal date. There are loads of organisations that can help you prepare. And it takes place in an ordinary room not a court. I’m in NI so not sure if the same applies, but you will be fine, you’re over the worst bit. I’ve heard the ‘assessors’ get bonuses dependent on reducing your payment or stopping it. I don’t know how much truth there is to it but it makes sense to me.

Good luck. Terri X

[meecee1 in reply to TM1970]

If you already have DLA and are moving to PIP you receive all of your monthly benefit until there is final decision, all the way to a tribunal. If it is a first claim nothing is paid until a final decision is made, payments are backdated to when you first called for a claim pack. If you have an award for standard rate and have asked them to look at your claim as you believe your conditions are worse then you receive all of your current award. again , this is until a decision is made. There is no 80% payments in Scotland, Wales or England, it must be just in NI that is paid to claimants.

[TM1970 in reply to meecee1]

Yeh we have 20% stopped

[meecee1 in reply to TM1970]

That's so unfair, there shouldn't be any difference between the four nations. If you are making a first claim then you have to wait on a decision, again the payments are backdated to when your claim was first made. If you have DLA and are moving to PIP, again, your benefit is paid until a decision is made, if you are moved to a higher rate then the difference is paid from when you claimed PIP. We never have any payments at a reduced rate, NI should be the same, maybe one of the advice agency needs to question why this is, losing 20% until a decision is made is a lot of money to be deprived of. The benefit system needs a complete overhaul. The Scottish government are taking over carers allowance and some of the other benefits this year, PIP and th old DLA will still be a Westminster decision.

[Ceri-NorthWales]

Sorry for not getting back to any one of you. I am defeated. There is no way out of anything. I have had to fght so hard over the last 16 months for the most basic of things. I have lsot everything. There is no way out. I am tired. The battles ahve taken their toll and the no face to face farce needs to end last month! It is causing far more harm than good.

I just don't understand the LIES. I ahve learnt so much about the public sector in the last 6 months. No work ethic, doesn't matter how bad you are at your job, you will keep your job. DOesn't matter how many rules you break, you keep your job. Doesn't matter how much wrong you do, you keep your job. Better still, you get a promotion for it. Complete job security, zero work ethic, do minimal work and still get paid an obscene salary. Totally different in the private sector. If you don't have a wok ethic, you are out the door. Break rules, lie, do a bad job - you are out the door. Job security? None.

I feel so stupid for even thankning the assessor for being so nice throughout the assessment and told her I had worked myself up for ages for that assessment as I had heard horror stories. Little did I know she was extremily two faced and would go on to write a pack of lies! And this is from a former mental health nurse. Proves my point about how terrible mental health services are.

There is no hope. I am stranded. I still don't even have healthcare. No rheumatology and they messed up the IPFR as they ahve only approved a single outpatient appt. What a load of rubbish! Yes, it took a lot for me there to hold back.

This is why I always have to have control. If I am in control, things don't go wrong. As soon as someone else is, everything goes wrong. Everything is dark, there is no way ot. I am sick of doing so much wok for the public sector with no thanks and no pay. I even had to dictate yet another letter for GP to write to Countess rheumatology in regards to IPFR. This shouldn't be so difficult. As the patient, my job should be easy. Get a letter with an appt and attend. Follow the instructions given by consultant. Job done. But no, I have had to do EVERYTHING myself. All whilst going through a complete mental breakdown. I cannot do this anymore. I hate this life. I hate the public sector. I hate BCUHB. They are incapable of work. I would like some thanks and appreciation from all these people that are incapable of doing work and I would like paying for my services. They are all being paid obscene salaries and it is ME that has done all the work. The only thing I haven't done is send the actual letters to the hospitals. All of you in England, you have no idea how lucky you are to have access to healthcare.

I cannot do this anymore. I am defeated. The bad guys ALWAYS win. and I would love to put these people through everything that I have. Make them see the pain and suffering they are causing. Maybe then they would think differently. But silly me, no they wouldn't, They are public sector workers. They haven't got a care in the world. No matter what, they have job security and obscene salaries. I cannot stand this world. Seriously, if I told lies like that when I worked for Samsung, it wuold be instant dismissal. If I told a customer all the wrong info and told them a tv did something that it doesn't, I would be dismissed and rightfully so. But no, public sector workers can cause as much hell as they like and the nly consequnce they get? A promotion and a payrise.

I am done. There is NO light. There is NO way out. I have NO WAY of affording a car. I ahve £910. that is it. Can't even get the £640 tax refund that I am due because the public sector don't believe in doing work and are off enjoying themselves. MP is a complete waste of space and money. And all this time later, I STILL haven't had the first payment of UC that I was due in Dec 2019 which they wrongly didn't pay as they took redundancy pay as income when in their rules redundancy pay is not income. The paperwork was filled out in the begining of March for me to get that money that I am owed. All these months later, not a single letter adn no money in the bank. Why? Because its the public sector. Their job is to do nothing, but cause hell and suffering and get paid for the pleasure.