Failed 4th ivf 💔

I not been putting much on her lately but do read everyones posts. It was our test date today and had another bfn!! Just feel totally heartbroken and so unsure of what to do next. Any advise please?? I respond well to treatment i just cannot seem to get to full blastocyst.. im being to think that there is a problem with implantation. Altho i use both lubion and ultragest pessaries to help built up lining due to previous miscarriages. Since having my ectopic pregnancy it feels like nothing working.. any advise gratefully recieved. Xx

[kumkums]

It's difficult going through such. So sorry for your BFN. Have you had consultations with your clinic, have they advised any tests on you and hubby. Sure there must be a reason why you don't get blastocyst. It needs investigated, you may also want to try second opinion, if you are able to spend some cash.

Hopefully some people on here can advice on things to do. I'm sorry I have not been in such situation.

[Hidden in reply to kumkums]

Thank you for your reply. This will be our second bfn with this company on our last consultation they said it was my egg quality and we changed my meds to a milder dose the egg quality did improve but still not a full blastocyst . We always implant 2 embryos due to age, started to wonder if this could be a problem. .. xx

[Hidden in reply to Hidden]

Hi Helenlou

Just a little to add to my last post. Have you considered donor eggs at all? It is a difficult decision for some but for me, having a very poor response to any protocol - even one abandoned cycle - it was a no brainer. I have actually now managed to get my very first bfp. Unfortunately this first bfp ended in a blighted ovum but hopefully next time will be the full term.

I hope that helps to know xxx

[Hidden]

Hi Helenlou. I'm so sorry to hear your bad news. It's truly devastating after such a difficult journey. Do you have a follow up appointment with the clinic? Perhaps they could run some more tests? My cousin was found to be deficient in vit. B12 and folate, and she had a blood clotting disorder. They only tested her for these after 3 good quality embryos failed to implant. Take good care of yourself xx

[Hidden]

Thank you for your reply we had first 2 on NHS and then paid for last 2 at a reputable company. I just feel I need to do a lot of research again now as something obviously isn't working for me. I'm not ready to give up my dream although my biological clock is ticking xxx

[Hidden]

Hi Hun yes follow up next Friday I wanted time to grief and get some questions together. I have had a lot of tests done but not sure if I had the right ones.. I'm wondering whether to have nk cells done. Just heartbroken and my mind is working over time looking for something to blame.. xx

[Hidden in reply to Hidden]

Give yourself as much time as you need to grieve. I would definitely ask about other tests. The blood clotting condition and vitamin deficiencies are not routinely checked but it's only a blood test so it might be worth a mention. There is also PGS but I know it's really expensive. I hope your consultant will be able to suggest the best next steps for you to take. I'm sorry I can't be of more help. Take care and be kind to yourself. xx

[Lizzielizzielizzie in reply to Hidden]

I’m a stuck record on this but if you’re trying more tests then consider chromosome testing (karyotyping) x

[Hidden in reply to Lizzielizzielizzie]

Is this a blood test? I assume both me and hubby will need to do this? Xx

[Lizzielizzielizzie in reply to Hidden]

Yes it’s a blood test for both parents. There’s a one in 500 chance in the general population that you have a chromosome translocation, which causes no problems for anything until you try to reproduce! Then it can cause miscarriage or disability in your child (depending on the type of chromosome translocation). Chance of finding it rises to 2% for people with infertility, still such a small chance but my husband was in that 2% and we still wouldn’t have found it if we had not pushed to have every single possible test done.

[Hidden in reply to Lizzielizzielizzie]

Thank you I think I will push to have this test . At the moment I feel as if I can't face another round of treatment but I need to know what is causing our heartache. Thank you again xx

[Hidden]

So sorry to hear this. Give yourself time to grieve and be kind to yourself xx sending you hugs. DianeArnold has a list of questions for follow up appointments if you email her.

Has your clinic suggested an endometrial scratch or embryo glue? Or having intramuscular progesterone rather than pessaries? Xx

[Hidden in reply to Hidden]

Hi Zoe i have the endometrial scratch and glue! Just not seeming to reach my blastocyst. I do have lubion injections aswell as pessaries due to miscarriage when we was trying naturally. I will message Diane to see if she can help. Thank you. Xx

[Hidden in reply to Hidden]

I hope you go out and treat yourself xxxx

[Hidden in reply to Hidden]

Not today having pj day. Told hubby we need to book a summer holiday at weekend. Thank you xx

[Hidden]

Thank you Selena. I was convinced it was going to work this time. I felt good on meds as lower dose so no bloating or any other med symptoms. Life so hard. Good luck with ur treatment. Xx

[Lizzielizzielizzie]

I’m so sorry.

Just a thought, what treatment did you have after your ectopic? Is it possible that you have developed a blockage in your tube that is leaking fluid into your uterus?

[Hidden]

This has crossed my mind that sthing happened when i had ectopic. I had my part of my tube removed. Prior to this i had hsg to see if tubes was blocked and all was fine. The bizarre thing is that i caught with my iui first time. Yet ivf isnt working. Im not sure how i go about checking tubes now as we are funded treatment ourself i find it difficult to have anything done via nhs!! Xx

[Lizzielizzielizzie in reply to Hidden]

Hopefully your clinic could help; when I needed cervical dilation, my ivf private consultant wrote to my nhs gynaecologist about it.

[angellllll]

Hey, Helen, I am really sorry to hear this. IVF is a form of treatment with which there exists no guarantee about whether it will work or not. However, don't let this make you fall apart as I know being on this infertility journey can be really hard. I myself am on the same path and I can understand how difficult it can get. I was diagnosed by my doctor that I had a poor ovarian reserve. Due to which IVF was not going to work for me as the embryos weren't going to develop.So life has been really hard for me as well. I hope that your problem can get sorted out and you're able to conceive.

[Hidden in reply to angellllll]

I am so sorry you too are going through hard times. Have you decided on what you are going to do? It's so hard... and having a baby is meant to be the most natural thing in the world. I just don't know which way to turn at the moment. Xxx

[Cinderella5]

Hi Helen, I'm so sorry you've had another BFN. It is the worst!! I'm not aure of your age, circumstances. Gav you tried DHEA & Ubiquinol to help improve egg quality. I did this after my first round and although I didn't get a BFP we got to blastocyst stage for that and next cycle. We then decided to move to donor egg which was a massive....huge decision. We landed up with 6 blastocysts on our first cycle. Umfortunatley we got a BFN but 2e have freezers. I know it's not for everyone but just wanted to put it out there is you wanted to look at other options! Sending hugs xxx

[Hidden in reply to Cinderella5]

Thank you my clinic advised me to take infofolic sachets twice a day. I asked about Dhea after my last cycle and was told that there was no evidence that it made a difference but I will certainly ask again next week when I have my follow up. Xx

[Cinderella5 in reply to Hidden]

My clinic now recommends it. They didn't at the time I took it and said the same as yours....small emerging evidence in papers but it's the only thing i did different so defo worth an ask/try. Feel free to have a read through my old posts....!!xxx

[Hidden in reply to Cinderella5]

Thank you i will. Can i ask what make do u use? I will try and gather enough questions to ask by follow up. Xx

[Cinderella5 in reply to Hidden]

I used 3x25mg per day which is the general dose. Google Dr Norbert Gleiker on YouTube. He's a huge supporter. One of the girls I cycled with is due twins soon after taking this....after a poor first round!xx

[bms12]

I'm so sorry to hear this. It's the same problem my friend has she did managed to implant though when she had the endo scratch and endo glue but unfortunately it didn't stick around past 8 weeks. I wish you the best for whatever you decided to do lovely xx

[Hidden in reply to bms12]

Thank you today been a hard day. I do have the endo scratch and the glue is standard procedure in clinic. What outcome has your friend had? Any further tests? Xx

[bms12 in reply to Hidden]

She's had all the genetic tests done and on paper her and her partner are perfect candidates unfortunately it just hasn't worked so far. She starts her 3rd round soon. I hope you get your happy endinf lovely xx

[emu2016]

Awww Helen. Lots of love. Sending so much love xx

[Hidden in reply to emu2016]

Thank you. I do enjoy reading your posts. Good luck. Xx

[lianm8]

Firstly I am really sorry to hear about your failed cycle. BFN are really hard.

Have you looked into nk cells? Some people have their doubts about it but I truly believe in it.

I have had a miscarriage through natural conception and two failed ivf (one fresh and one failed) with the nhs. Went private and I had a blood test for this and my levels came back high. I had treatment (steriods and blood thinners) with my fet with them and that resulted in my little girl.

I have just gone through another fresh round with them and had the same treatment although I’ve had to stop the blood thinners as I have a clot around the baby and I am currently 10 + 1.

Maybe worth looking into. Xx

[Wishfully in reply to lianm8]

This is an amazing story @lianm x

[Hidden in reply to lianm8]

I will certainly speak to my consultant again next week when we have follow up. When I spoke to her about it before she seemed to think it was more of a egg quality issue but I'm not convinced. My periods are so irregular and feel that there is definitely a underlying problem. Huge congratulations on your pregnancy. Xxx

[Wishfully]

Oh my goodness, how disheartening for you 😔 I suspect that, given implantation did not happen, that blood clotting tests etc won’t really help you this time - this is all down to the little embryo. As clinical as it might sound, I think with age it becomes a numbers game, & likely next time you will find your perfect embryo. Gather any tips you can get on improving egg / sperm / embryo quality & go again, with as much positivity as you can muster! Good luck xx

[Hidden in reply to Wishfully]

Yes feel heartbroken I do sometimes think my age is a factor I have just turned 39. I have had blood clotting test and all seemed fine. Along with numberous of other tests... Just maybe not the right ones. Xxx

[vic77]

I am so so sorry to read this..I know only too well how u feel ..my 4th bfn was by far my hardest...sadly time is the healer and you are right to consider your questions and next steps..I very nearly gave up after our 4th bfn and would say for sure my hope had gone..I dug deep went for 5th go with little enthusiasm and we are 12 weeks pregnant. ..I say this only to give you hope and I hope you can find the courage to continue to pursue your dream...much love xxxx

[Hidden]

Congratulations on your pregnancy. We always said if our last round of treatment didn't work that would be our last... I really did think it would work. Now I'm not sure if I can give up the thought of not being parents just breaks my heart. Xx

[vic77 in reply to Hidden]

thanks. I say if you can don't give up hope. do you have frosties?I saw you asking about dhea...I swear that made the difference for us and egg quality which was the issue for us..our 3rd fresh cycle we got frosties for first time and 3 of them..my egg quality was much better. it has to be micronized dhea 3 times a day..25mg I think it was..can send on name of one I used if helpful. ..you need to get from the states as can't get here..sending love xxx

[NDE1987]

Hey hun I would highly recommend getting your NK cells tested. I got mine testsed at Coventry and warwick hospital. You can refer yourself privatley and it cost £540 and this included two tests. After two failed cycles I finally got a positive on my 3rd cycle. I was prescribed steriods to take after my 3rd transfer and the results showed I had high NK cells. Private message me if you need any help xx

[Hidden in reply to NDE1987]

Thank you for reply. How long did you wait for results? Im so frustrated today. Got so many questions with it all. I respond well treatment my embryos its just the quality and implantation is a problem.. unfortunately the bigest problem. My consultant felt i didnt need this test as i got pregnant with iui..but had miscarried and then found i was stil pregnant with ectopic but was growing in tube.. i feel if it was implanted in uterus would my body reject it.. ??? And y did iui work and ivf isnt!! So many questions xxx

[NDE1987 in reply to Hidden]

Hey hun, I got the results back withing a few weeks. All you have to do is call the clinic on the first day of your positive ovulation and they then book you in for your biospy. It is good news you for pregnant with IUI, that's good news that the embryo implanted Hun. Please keep faith. I never ever thought I would get pregnant. Honestly I had given up. I literally have such a long journey ahead still and I feel scared every day about miscarriage etc. But just have to take one day at a time. X

[Hidden]

I’m so sorry to hear of your loss ; I had one last year.It’s heartbreaking 💔

I’m also very sorry to hear of your negative test; so upsetting.

I agree with others perhaps further investigations are the way forward; I have put a hold on trying till my endo is properly sorted 😊

Have you had a hysteroscopys and laparoscopy? A hysteroscopy will give better detail inside your uterus and treat any abnormalities if found. A laparoscopy will look outside the uterus with other organs to check/treat endometriosis. Always worth ruling out. I also had nk cells tested and it’s raised so I take prednisone during pregnancy early weeks and I also take progesterone pessaries despite just trying naturally. Maybe look into blood clotting tests. Has your thyroid been checked? That needs to under 2.5.;For ttc /early pregnancy: my fertility specialist recommended the antibodies checked as that determines whether you need thyroid meds.; that’s the important test. Have you also had vitamin levels such as vitamin D checked?

Hope that might help a bit.

Good luck with it all xoxo

[Hidden in reply to Hidden]

Hi jess thank i so much for your reply. Im sorry you are having a hard time aswell.. its just not fair.I have had my tubes checked at start of this process before i went on Clomid. Also i had a cyst on ovary which needed to be removed and had a laparoscopy to do this. This was over 4 years now. Im deg going to ask about the nk cells again. Thyroid had been checked and in normal range however 2 diff prople have said to me about my thyroid as my neck seemed puffy... weird hey? I will see if vitamin D is in any roitine tests done by clinic thankyou so much.I want to be able to say we tried everything to have our family and dont want no ifs... i wish u all the best. Xxx

[Hidden in reply to Hidden]

Thank you .

That’s good you have had a lap; so good to rule endo out it’s not a standard fertility test; very stupid when 1-10 women have it and it can cause infertility 🙄

Puffy neck does sound odd; maybe get a second opinion.

I can understand that; that’s why I’m keen to sort the endo to know it has the best chance. Can’t have regrets.

NK cells is a private test and isn’t funded by the NHS; but if you do have higher NK cells the NHS will fund the treatment side 😘

It’s a hard process but we have to believe our time will come. And all this will be worth fighting for 🌈 🤱🏼 xoxo

[Hidden in reply to Hidden]

Thank you Jess I'm currently compiling a list of questions for consultant. I have asked the receptionist at the clinic if I can have a list of blood tests I have already have as I can't remember them all.. I'm also going make apt after to see my go I feel as a lot more could have been done under the NHS. Xxx

[LovelySA]

Hi Helen ask your doctor to test you for mthfr gene mutations which is linked to issues with implantation, also blood clotting could be a problem which can also be tested for. You could also find a clinic that offers immunology treatment? Good luck it’s such a rollercoaster x

[Hidden in reply to LovelySA]

Hi I have not heared of the mthr gene mutations but I will look into it now thank you. I'm pretty sure I have been tested for the blood clotting but not 100% so will check. Xx

[LovelySA in reply to Hidden]

Good luck xx

[angellllll]

Hey, Helen, I am extremely sorry to hear about the BFN. I can totally relate to your problem. When I started TTC I used to be completely shattered after every BFN. It was just like all my hopes were dying. Even when I visited my doctor and they prescribed to be Provera and Clomid I thought I was finally going to get a good result. however, unluckily that didn't work out either. I was so disappointed in my life by this time that I honestly thought my TTC journey was coming to an end finally. However, the DH insisted that we visited the specialist and we did. They did my tests and told me that I was not ovulating and also that I had a poor ovarian reserve. All of these things started to link up after this point as I realized that life is actually not that simple. I was told to look into assisted conceptions as I really had my life chance on them. I searched for both IVF and surrogacy and decided that I wanted to go for IVF. However, when I visited the clinic they told me IVF would disappoint me because of my current condition and therefore had to opt for surrogacy. I have shared my story with you to let you know that you're not alone and that I faced many worst things in life. Therefore, stay strong and just don't worry I am sure things will get better.

[Hidden]

Thank you for your reply and sharing your story. I never thought I'd be in this situation where I was 39 and still without my family, I feel like there is a huge part of me missing. I know there is so many different avenues we can take but I feel I can't move on until I know what the problem is. I'm just taking one day at a time. xxx

[Hidden]

Hi Helen

I am so sorry to read this. Sending you huge hugs. Perhaps once you have had time to process what you have just been through your clinic follow up will be able to advise on what next?

Wishing you all the very best xxx

[Hidden in reply to Hidden]

Thank you. Yes i feel once i see consultant friday thinks will hopefully be abut clearer. There us a few things i would like answering. I just hope she can answer them. Thank you xx

[Hidden]

I see consultant friday if hubby and I are not happy then i will seek second opinion. It be a shame as o have a good rappor with clinic. Feel comfortable when we go there which i think ia important. Roll on friday. Xx

[Abbie40]

Dear Helen, i’m so sorry!! It’s devastating and draining in every way. I don’t know your age? AMH levels etc but please ask if you’ve been checked for blood clotting issues and other immune conditions! I too had 4 failed rounds and have seen specialists in top London clinics, Spain and finally had success in the States. I’m 45 and got married aged 42...whence the problem. I can make perfect blastocysts but 90% are abnormal. I had PGS done in the UK and even the embryo they told me was normal turned out to be severely abnormal with a nuchal fold of 6.4mm and rising and with a cvs they couldn’t tell me the problem but we had to have an erpc at 14 weeks. We then had 3 donor cycles in Spain again with PGS that resulted in zero transfer as all abnormal and the following 2 rounds resulted in a couple of chemical pregnancies they tried to blame my husband when really the quality of the lab makes a massive difference and after a successful round in the States they admitted to me that PGS ‘can’ cause problems with the delicate embryos IF the lab is sub standard. They also said they’re not sure of the efficacy of testing for nk cells but we had a full karyotype tests, every genetic test possible and they found nothing wrong with my husband. We proceeded with an egg donor cycle in the States with no genetic testing and so far so good!! 🤞🏼🙏🏼 It was v hard getting my head round it but if I want to have a healthy baby at my age that’s what we had to do. I really hope you find some answers and once you’re feeling strong and energised go for it!!! Sometimes it’s just bad luck and a healthy embryo just won’t implant but after 4 rounds you should both get checked out thoroughly. Hysteroscopy/ ERA/karyotype tests, blood clotting/immune etc xxx

[Hidden in reply to Abbie40]

Hi Abbie thank you so much for your reply. I turned 39 in march. 😣 i have had bloods done and all seem to be fine. I have had so many bloods done i cant remember them all i have had 4 rounds of ivf in 3 years. I have asked my clinic to send me copies of the tests i had done but still waiting. I know i had the blood clotting done and was fine. I am wondering if something has occurred when i had my ectoptic,had to have part of right tube removed...what test is the Era? Do you take supplements? My mind is full of questions needing answers! Xxx

[Abbie40 in reply to Hidden]

Bless you! I know exactly how you feel. It’s a great idea to collate all your tests as mine were missed. If you have a hysteroscopy they can see if there’s any scarring or issues before you invest in another round. I thought my chemicals and bfns were due to erpc scarring but the dr in the States couldn’t see any. It feels so complicated but good news is your age isn’t a problem as long as your AMH levels are good? so worth another crack with your own eggs but ask your consultant and maybe a second opinion never hurts? Has your partner been fully screened? Full karyotype? Before we were accepted on a money back programme with an egg donor in the States my husband had to be fully screened and have a counsyl test. I have 2 friends that went through a gruelling 9 cycles but both ha e their babies now...sometimes it is just bad luck and a numbers game but definitely ask your Consultant all the questions you have, go through all your results and ask them if with your stats AMH is it worth using own eggs again? Do you need a hysteroscopy? I don’t think the ectopic would have affected ivf but i’m not a Dr. An ERA was recommended to me as it tell you exactly when the transfer should be performed. Mine was performed on cycle day 19 the usual time for a 5 day blastocysts transfer and test came back receptive so the following month the same protocol was used for my actual transfer and it worked. It’s a tiny bit like an endometrial scratch but nowhere near as painful and it’s only one quick scratch with minimal discomfort. My husband and I had a lot more investigations than normal because of all my miscarriages and also because they wouldn’t accept us on their money back programme without it. I never thought we’d have to go so far but that’s our journey. I take zinc, magnesium, folic acid of course and reduced my vit d to 500 ius now. Please let me know how you get on!! Xxx

[nataliejames492]

Hi. I am so sorry for this. IVF does often need multiple attempts. Pregnancy is always a miracle. There's no sure-fire way to have a baby. I would suggest going for surrogacy now. You had your experiences with IVF. Surrogacy seems to be the next best option.