Speed doesn't matter....

[Curlygurly2]

I'm sure we've all heard this at some times during our running careers, but I just want to throw something new into the mix.....

Over the last few months my running has got slower and slower - sometimes I find it hard to break 10 mins per KM, (this is barely above my walking pace, and I was faster than that when I started C25K all those years ago) and harder and harder...until I reached the point I didn't want to run again, ever...so many people told me I needed to be doing speed work - well, I do one interval run per week usually, and that wasn't helping...

I tend to think of running as a barometer of my general health and mentioned how difficult exercise has become to my ENT specialist last week (Some of you will know I had part of my thyroid removed a few months ago) and he took me seriously...some of my hormone levels are not quite right, still in "normal" levels but only just. He prescribed Levothyroxine tablets.

I've only been taking them for about a week, but I've already reclaimed about 1 minute a KM - I averaged 9 mins pace yesterday on my run, you might imagine I was delighted with that!

So, my message here is sometimes it's not your fault, something else needs to be taken into consideration.

[GoGo_JoJo Graduate]

That's very true. Usually a sustained drop for me means overtired and dehydrated, a reminder for me to get good rest and drink more!! We really need to listen to our bodies as much as we can. 👍🏻

[Oldfloss Administrator Graduate]

Good to hear my friend... you have been through so much and yet, despite all, remained one of our most awesome runners. This latest, issue... well thank goodness, someone took it seriously and how great to start seeing the results so quickly!

You know so well that it was you who got me hooked on the C25K+ podcast years ago; I still love it, occasionally, even though my mantra still is, slow and steady !

Huge well done to you! x

[Curlygurly2 Graduate in reply to Oldfloss]

Thank you Hilary! No I didn't know that about the plus podcasts! I've not been able to do those for months, far too fast for me, but I will do them again soon.

I saw 2 other ENT doctors before this one, they both said I was fine, and they wouldn't do any more blood tests. Seems crazy, surely you need to keep an eye on something like this. I'm glad, too, I took the advice, I'm quite resistant to medication.

P.S. no way are you slow!!

[OldManRunning Graduate in reply to Oldfloss]

Sorry Curlygurly2 to hijack your thread although I do hope everything sorts itself out for you 😀 But where can I find the C25k+ podcast? I've tried searching

[Curlygurly2 Graduate in reply to OldManRunning]

healthunlocked.com/redirect...

try this...

[Curlygurly2 Graduate in reply to Curlygurly2]

IDK if it will work, I downloaded them years ago...

I could try and share my files with you if this doesn't work, let me know xx

[OldManRunning Graduate in reply to Curlygurly2]

Thank you

[OldManRunning Graduate in reply to Curlygurly2]

Yes they work, great thank you

[Languid_Lil Graduate]

This is so true Curlygurly2! Well done for realising something was up and getting the medication you need; it's so easy to put things down to age, or tiredness or just life - I dismissed my tiredness and dizziness as just "getting older" but finally went to the GP who found that I had Vitamin B12 deficiency - now it's sorted, I'm like a spring chicken and back doing C25K (next run W5R2) with the aim of a Park Run by Christmas!

[Curlygurly2 Graduate in reply to Languid_Lil]

Funny stuff, B12, my husband was found to be deficient when he kept dropping his cutlery and pens etc, his deficiency gave him pins and needles and loss of sensation in his hands and feet. Poor bloke, when he went to the doc, they made him take his socks off and close his eyes while they stuck sharp implements in him!

Glad you all sorted now xx

[Instructor57 Graduate]

Hello, good to hear you might be onto something!Fingers crossed 🙂🤞

[Curlygurly2 Graduate]

I wasn't saying I wanted to go faster, but that I was going progressively SLOWER. I lost more than 3 minutes off my KM pace...this is surely not normal is it?

Yes I know all about holding a conversation while doing C25K, I completed the programme way back in 2014.

Maybe your comments were meant to imply that perhaps I should have posted this in one of the more advanced groups, Bridge to 10K, or the Marathon group, but I know that many of the more experienced runners still post here in C25K and I wanted to reach as many of them as possible. I was simply drawing attention to the fact that there might be a problem people might not have considered.

thank you for your best wishes xx

[MissUnderstanding Administrator in reply to Curlygurly2]

I think you’ve read my post with a tone that genuinely wasn’t meant to be there.

[Curlygurly2 Graduate in reply to MissUnderstanding]

I think you didn't actually read my post at all...

[MissUnderstanding Administrator in reply to Curlygurly2]

Gosh, I’m really sorry you feel that way. I don’t want to get into an argument. I will delete it.

[SueAppleRun Graduate]

If you've noticed a difference in a week I can't wait to hear what happens after a couple more, it takes awhile for thyroxine to change the way you feel completely so for you things will only get better.Good to see you here

[Curlygurly2 Graduate in reply to SueAppleRun]

Thank you! Do you take this?

It's been a bit up and down, today I feel pretty good, yesterday less so, the day before was good too.

I'll keep you posted xx

[SueAppleRun Graduate in reply to Curlygurly2]

Yes I do and have done for years, but I always know when the dose needs changing.If you are new to it, it can take a few weeks before you are getting the full benefit and they may test your blood again and adjust the dose, it can make a huge difference though xx

[Curlygurly2 Graduate in reply to SueAppleRun]

Thank you for the assistance. Yes, the doc has passed me over to the Endocrine clinic so they can titrate my deose (new word for me!)I'm amazed so far at the improvement, and hope it continues, or even gets better.

[SueAppleRun Graduate in reply to Curlygurly2]

It will do and that's a good team to be monitoring

[Cmoi Graduate]

Hi Curlygurly2 , while obviously I'm sorry you've been having problems, I'm delighted that you've now got treatment that's helping. Here's to continuing happy running!

[Curlygurly2 Graduate in reply to Cmoi]

Thank you! I'm doing ok, likewise I'm delighted that someone listened to me finally, and gave me something to help! I really wanted to draw people's attention to the fact that sometimes running going down the tubes can have a reason.

[nowster Graduate]

I've been on L-thyroxine for over five years now, gradually increasing the dose until I reached my current dose of 100µg daily. That's what my walk down to the chemist's is for every four weeks or so. I only found out I had a deficiency when I had a grey-out in a meeting at work, and they called an ambulance. And then some months later my mother told me her father had been on thyroid hormone pills.

That reminds me... I need to book a routine blood test for the end of this month.

The one side benefit is that you can claim for a "medical exemption" from prescription charges. Ask your GP for the form.

Incidentally, there's a thyroid forum on here. I've never signed up. The participants seem even more obsessive than me about monitoring everything.

[Curlygurly2 Graduate in reply to nowster]

I had a hemi-thyroidectomy in the Spring, they couldn't tell if I had cancer or not, apparently it's very hard to tell by biopsy, but give my history of breast cancer they thought it best. They did indeed find a small amount - a micro cancer apparently. Since then I've gone downhill, losing a lot of strength and energy. I think the meds are going to help me a lot.

I've had free prescriptions since my first cancer, and anyway I'm over 60 now!

[Yesletsgo Administrator]

I'm so glad you found a doctor who took your concerns seriously. As a woman above a certain age there's always a worry being tired is just something you expect, let alone saying your running speed has dropped.My hypothyroidism was picked up when, at the age of 43 and 6 months pregnant I mentioned in passing that I felt tired. The doctor immediately ordered blood tests and I was prescribed Levothyroxine a few months later as my levels dropped from borderline to needing medication. It was like night and day.

You had good reason to suspect something was off Curlygurly2 . I'm so pleased you feel better and urge anyone else whose energy drops to speak to their GP. It can be life changing.

[Curlygurly2 Graduate in reply to Yesletsgo]

They've been keeping an eye on my thyroid for years because I had a goitre, but if I understand correctly the levels have changed since they performed the surgery. Worryingly, the 2 doctors that did the surgery told me everything as fine, it was only when I saw the senior consultant that he said my levels were clearly wrong. I have an increase in TSH apparently (whatever that is). Unfortunately I still suffer fatigue from radiotherapy, I think that has masked any symptoms due to thyroid, and they blamed my tiredness on that.

it was really the change in my running since the thyroid surgery that worried me, even after major surgery for my breast cancer and all the other guff they do to you I was still running around 8 mins pace, a drop to 10 mins is huge.

I've also lost a lot of muscle and strength, I'm doing weights and squats and stuff to try and get a bit back.

[Yesletsgo Administrator in reply to Curlygurly2]

My doctor told me that TSH is thyroid stimulating hormone. As the thyroid starts failing it needs ever increasing amounts of TSH to produce the correct amount of thyroxine. My first test showed high TSH and lower end of normal thyroxine. This was monitored every month or two as I remember and a while later I had to go on a low dose of levothyroxine, which has increased over the years.

As for your running speed, it's impressive you could run at all given how tired you can feel with low thyroxine levels. To drop 2 minutes is a lot and would worry me too. It's good to be taken seriously and now that you're getting the right treatment I'm sure things will get even better.

[Curlygurly2 Graduate in reply to Yesletsgo]

Thank you so very much for your clear and concise reply. Some days my running wasn't too bad, some days I got up and had to go back to bed I was so tired and couldn't run at all...I ran through breast cancer and all the treatments including radiotherapy, I sort of just felt this was more of the same,. Hopefully this is all behind me now and I will see more improvements.

I managed something around 8.50 today over 3 KMs. slower than my C25K pace, but I'm happy!

[Yesletsgo Administrator in reply to Curlygurly2]

Some days I could literally barely get up from the sofa, and I lost count of the number of times I nearly fell asleep at the wheel on even short journeys. Horrible. No way could I run in that state. It's been a very long time since I've even felt close to tired enough to fall asleep at the wheel, and then only after having had a long and tiring day, not just at random. When I feel like that I eat a packet of Haribos, and if that doesn't work I stop and rest.

Sounds like you're made of tougher stuff

[Curlygurly2 Graduate in reply to Yesletsgo]

Yeah, cancer will do that to you - carry on or give in!!

[Curlygurly2 Graduate in reply to Yesletsgo]

To be honest, this kind of tiredness is nothing on rads fatigue. I joined a group called 5 K Your way, Move against cancer, we meet at parkrun once a month, and support each other. We do what we can, some walk, some run, some support from the sidelines.

I learnt to do what I can, the other day I went out to do intervals, I had meant to sprint and jog, but had to jog and walk. Never mind, I got round. My friend has had BC twice in 4 years and completed the London Marathon a few weeks ago. She's stronger than me, but any movement is good xx

[LottieMW Ambassador]

The Thyroid forum link…

healthunlocked.com/thyroiduk

…I think what comes across on there is that there’s a definite distinction between “normal levels”…and what is normal for *you*. I suspect that with your medical history, the doctors were more alert to your symptoms. Problems with an under active thyroid can be so insidious that it’s difficult to differentiate between an actual problem, and just getting old!

I’m glad you recognised that such a drop in form could be down to a medical reason…and even happier that the doctors agreed and investigated!

For the new runners here it’s important to say that it’s normal and expected (and encouraged!) to run at a slow and comfortable pace…and also for the experienced runners returning to C25k after a break! I’m running slower now after my 2nd time at C25k…but it’s comfortable and sustainable.

…but as you say, it’s important to listen to our bodies…if people are struggling…and they have looked at ALL the FAQs…and followed the advice (especially to slow down!)…and are still having problems…or are having an unexplained drop in form…then it’s certainly worth while getting a medical opinion.

So glad that you’re feeling better and enjoying your running again! 😊

[Curlygurly2 Graduate in reply to LottieMW]

Thank you Lottie, unfortunately, the doctors didn't spot this for ages, it's been 8 months since my op, it was only the senior consultant who made the connection when I said my running had gone to pot. I've seen loads of docs since the op, they told me my levels were BETTER......

When I started running again after my BC four years ago my first 5K was 41 mins, my first ever 5K was 47, recently I haven't been able to go faster than 52 - that's not right is it?

I think they put it all down to rads fatigue...

[LottieMW Ambassador in reply to Curlygurly2]

oh my!

But it’s as I said (and often discussed on the Thyroid Forum)…’normal’ levels may not be normal for *you* 🙄

Doctors don’t seem to be on the ball when it comes to Endocrinology…and most of the endocrinologists focus on diabetes…🤷🏻‍♀️

I’ve only been running for just over 2 years…had a loss of mojo last autumn and restarted again. The first time around my best 5K was just over 41mins, after my restart I was averaging around 51! But that was deliberate on my part.

We do know our own bodies best, I’m glad you eventually had someone who looked at the whole picture and didn’t just focus on your known illness.