What does Come and Treat First?: Depression or Poor Sleep Quality?

[Cowbsky]

Hi, all

_ this is first post downhere on Anxiety and Depression, even though I have already put something on some replies;

_ foremost this is JUST TO SHARE MY PERSONNAL EXPERIENCE on anxiety and depression throughout my 70-year life, and, eventually come attention for this question to be reflected. I am aware everyone case is each one. I would be very happy should my experience would be count for someone;

_ Except for the last seven years of my life (after retiring), I suffered a lot with "insomnia", anxiety, and depression. Benzo's saved my career and life, in a certain way;

_ 7 year ago, finally, I had a luck of consulting a MD, who (the first one in decades!!!) asked me to go for a Polissonagrphy (PSG), which I did, and later, three more. Those PSG's, and my researches, showed clearly I had two main conditions to be tackled: UARS and RLS (upper airways resistance syndrome, maybe since 17 years old, and restless legs, since 7 years old;

_ then, in 2017, close to suicide situation, I started using CPAP (continuous positive airway pressure). Life started changing for better. I soon realized: my "insomnia" and "depression" always had been associated with very, very poor sleep quality (during some 48 years), in turn associated with too many awakenings ( 15 secs), closely linked to UARS (mainly during REM stages) and RLS crises (before bed and around 3 to 5 am);

_ nowadays, still learning daily with the dataset which come from my Bilevel CPAP, I am doing rather well, thanks to management of the UARS and RLS (still no sure what is more deleterious!!);

_ Trying not going too long here and be focused: I would suggest all of you eventually reading one of my gurus, on association between mental healph and poor sleep: Dr. Barry Krakow (himself an UARS sufferer and CPAP user), one of the largest experiences on this issue. You might eventually want to start with these two recent articles:

vtheepochtimes.com/health/sn...

theepochtimes.com/health/sn...

all the best and good luck

[Dolphin14]

Welcome to the community

I couldn't read your links as they wanted an email sign up

🐬

[Cowbsky in reply to Dolphin14]

I couldn't read your links as they wanted an email sign up: I will try again later , sorry

[Kelkel00]

I definitely believe sleep is very closely tied to anxiety/depression. I wonder which comes first?

[Hidden in reply to Kelkel00]

My personal theory is anxiety came first. Long term lack of quality sleep just amplifies everything making recovery more difficult. Just my opinion tho.

[TangledUpIn in reply to Hidden]

I agree, I think anxiety came first. You get less quality sleep when you have issues you are worrying about🥺

[Cowbsky in reply to TangledUpIn]

_ in old days I read an article with something like this as title: " anxious depression, or depressive anxiety". I used to suffer from depression and anxiety; nowadays depression has completely gone, remaining only anxiety in general (harder than depression to manage)

_ I would keep suggesting readings articles from Dr Barry Krakow, and Dr. Steven Park, both on sleep disorder breathing and anxiety, depression, and many more.....

all the best and good luck..

theepochtimes.com/health/sn... ................ The Critical Role of Sleep in Mental Health–and Why Your Doctor Is Getting It Wrong: Part I

Part I of the 'Life Saving Sleep Series'

theepochtimes.com/health/sn... ...... Why Poor Quality Sleep Can Be the Critical Factor Behind Any Number of Conditions: Part II

Part II of the 'Life Saving Sleep Series'

FEATUREDMENTAL HEALTH

Barry Krakow

[Cowbsky]

_ With decades of life-experiences, I certainly hope they don’t ‘delete’ you anytime soon! 😉: well, that is surprise for me too!! sometimes I ask myself How I could survive all this and are doing rather well still. Reflections tell me may be other cares with to healph.. loved my earth-bound professsion an so on..

apologies the non native English

_ Fascinating the doctors think it went back to age 17: not the doctors, they would never be able to do this, not even diagnose correctly sleep disorder breathing in general. Me and 150,000 peers, on the webs apnea board and cpap talk would not believe likewise...I realized this much later, actually, seven years ago, by myself. At 17, I moved from my country side to a big city, changing sleep position (different beds, and so on), and this triggered my "insomnia", associated with minor chokings, etc (of course there was also an anxiety peak at the time)....

_ Surprisingly enough, I was told my numbers were good. as I said on doctors and sleep apnea above: doctors do not undertand this. Numbers (they only look on flagged numbers!!) don't say nothing on sleep disorder breathing, in particular on UARS (many times not flagged on the machines softers). Unfortunately, at the time, some 6 years ago, this was a thing I (plus my 150,000 peers) had to study, interpret, and see the correct machine I needed, and adjust parameters, by myself. If you want to first thing to do is download the free software OSCAR, available on the internet: apneaboard forum , or the CPAP Talk forum. Then, study in your waveform coming from the car on the machine: your tidal volume, respiratory rate, inspirations expiration times, the number of awakenings, wake ups, how is your sleeping cycles , and so on: don be afraid, it is a rather thing to go through, you can count on support of hundredts people on the Internet, you tube, etc.

_ How has better quality sleep improved your depression overall?; well, as per the Dr. Barry Krakow you would have the medical explanation. For me is just this: " no sleep quality, at least something bearable, no healph in general, not only depression, but also, diabetes, heart problems, and son. See also Dr. Steven Park's book and articles on the web: sleep interrupted..

good luck.

[Cowbsky]

thanks,

_ well, you know, believes are very serious things in life. I have my biases and my believes on healph.

Anyway, very grateful for your clue: I am going study carefully the National Allieance on Mental Ilness, your suggestion. I am afrai I would have to study, meditate, and be very humble on my believes, I think. For instance, beyond physical issues on my odl depression, I still have to understand better the role of the anxiety...

Some two months ago, I started meditating on Joe Dispenza guide ones, trying to change some of my believes, eventually

all the best and good luck

[Cowbsky in reply to Cowbsky]

_ just to ellaborate a little further on believes x poor sleep quality derived depression, I would add my 63-old wife's sad case. She suffers from high blood pressure and COPD (all life smoker). _ some three years ago, after consulting her pneumologist (indicated the use of MDA to beginning with), I put her on a CPAP machine + Oxímeter, Oxigen concentrator, and interpreted the outcoming data:

_ It was more than clear her poor sleep quality (some Obstructive Apneas, all night long flow rate restrictions = UARS; too many awakenings, etc), as well as improvments. And, yet, she thinks she sleep well, keep looking on antidepressants and so on, strongly believing on the old model of unbalanced brain chemistry, as main primary cause of her deep depresssion, and such and such...

_ I and her pneumologist pretty much gave up on changing her belief about her deep daily depresssion...

_ Yes, I know, using a simple CPAP might look difficult for so many, even it can save your life!

Good luck.

[Hidden]

Welcome to this community! Yes, there is definitely a deep connection between depression and sleep quality. Our entire systems (physical, mental, and emotional) are all connected.