I haven’t had a problem with alcohol, just the standard American diet ie SAD diet.
It’s pretty standard in keto world that HDL goes up and triglycerides go down. When you go low carb you almost invariably go high fat.
Thus it would seem to me to lower the saturated fat in blood plasma keto is the way to go. A prostate cancer deposit would see the local plasma sat fats, but I can’t see how it would see how much dietary sat fat you ingested.
Also the SAD diet is high carb and high fat. It is generally agreed that in the presence of high carb, then sat fat may be unhealthy.
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Jalbom49
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The U.S. food pyramid has carb at the base & fat at the top. Many are obsessed with fat & the food industry has responded with No-Fat / Lo-Fat products. Only lean cuts of meat in supermarkets. Ground beef doesn't have enough fat to make a decent burger. etc.
The Med diet is 40% fat. High fat to me would be >40% fat.
Regarding saturated fat, the usual whipping boy has been stearic acid (from the Greek for tallow). Stearic acid is an 18-carb chain. Closely related is oleic acid (from 'healthy' olive oil). It too is 18 carbs long, but has a double bond in the middle, making it an omega-9. The ability to bend in the middle makes the fat liquid at room temperature. Cardio researchers have exonerated stearic acid. It is now considered to be heart neutral. One theory is that excess stearic is quickly converted to oleic. A one step process.
Interestingly, the ratio of stearic:oleic has prognostic value in cancer: a low ratio in blood is a bad sign:
"The red cell membrane stearic acid to oleic acid ratio was analysed in 34 men with histologically proven carcinoma of the prostate and distant metastases. This ratio was expressed as the saturation index (SI). A mean SI of 0.97 was found in control patients without evidence of any malignancy whereas all patients with advanced prostatic cancer showed a reduced stearic to oleic acid ratio (mean SI 0.466)." [1]
The red cell membrane stearic acid to oleic acid ratio was analysed in 34 men with histologically proven carcinoma of the prostate and distant metastases. This ratio was expressed as the saturation index (SI). A mean SI of 0.97 was found in control patients without evidence of any malignancy whereas all patients with advanced prostatic cancer showed a reduced stearic to oleic acid ratio (mean SI 0.466). Untreated patients had a significantly lower SI (mean 0.36) than those who had responded to hormonal therapy (mean 0.547; P less than 0.0001). A drop in SI correlated well with more advanced disease as judged by radiological findings and serum PSA. It is suggested that red cell membrane SI correlates well with radiological and biochemical markers of advanced prostatic carcinoma and may be used as a marker to assess progress and response to treatment.
Fascinating paper. You might find the fireinabottle web site interesting. He has a ROS theory of obesity where the ratio of oleic to stearic is determined by the SCD-1 enzyme and is poisoned by a high linoleic acid level. Also discussed on Reddit I sat fat subreddit.
One of the problems with N6 oils is they cannot be properly metabolized as fuel and accumulate in our tissues.
Two hundred years ago before these industrialized seed oils started entering our diet after the civil war, Coronary heart disease was basically unknown.
I haven’t paid attention to the definition of high fat, but I am concerned that studies are done with 40% carbs defined as low carb, way too high.
If we ate nothing but carbs, apart from losing insulin sensitivity, the glucose spikes would boost our supply of palmitic acid:
"Excess carbohydrates in the body are converted to palmitic acid. Palmitic acid is the first fatty acid produced during fatty acid synthesis and is the precursor to longer fatty acids. As a consequence, palmitic acid is a major body component of animals." [1]
Palmitic acid is the preferred fuel of prostatic cells & this largely remains true for PCa (at least until later stages for some cells.) Not that an increased supply would increase the demand in PCa cells.
Palmitic acid is a 16-carbon saturated fat. Our bodies make saturated fat! And from carbohydrates! Shocking! While some fatty acids are essential (cannot be made by us), the body mades most of the fats that are needed, & this is done by adding to the carbon chains and/or creating new double bonds. Palmitic acid is high up in this cascade of events. It cannot be avoided.
Dr. Myers favored a low-fat diet at one point, until he converted to the Med diet. He once said that his low-fat patients didn't do well at all.
Having said that, it's hard to get excited about any particular fat source. We use butter & a good olive oil at home. Before covid we ate out a lot, & although I never went for fried stuff, I probably ingested fat that I wouldn't have in the house (e.g. canola oil.)
If I couldn't live without fries one or twice a week, I'd buy a tub of tallow from grass-fed beef. lol but I'm serious.
Myers once mention Barry Sears (Zone diet). The Sears approach is to maintain the same fat:carb:protein ratio at each meal (including snacks. The Myers solution was to have nuts on hand to balance the fat:carb part.
Regarding the fries, I understand that McD's used to use tallow before that "sat-fat scare" took hold of the country. And I have heard (and believe) the argument that the fries would be "healthier" if they went back to that.
Apparently, someone arranged a cook-off at a McD's to see how the old and new compared, and everyone agreed that at the very least the tallow-fried fries TASTED better, lol.
I think the reason triglycerides go down on keto is because of the low carb component. The liver creates triglycerides from the excess carbs....the answer IMO is to keep carbs to a minimal, not eliminate them.
whole grains have proven health benefits especially for the gut bacteria which is essential for the immune system. Eliminating them is not entirely the wisest choice.
ADT does wacky things with lipids..my test results are now the following: HDL 85-90, TRI is 50-70 and LDL is 100 -130
The higher LDL is driving my Total Chol to 220 range but the ratio is still roughly 2.6 which is a very good ratio.
Consistent IF 16:8 with a sound diet will have the same effect as keto but with a better overall nutrition profile. IMHO.
I don't advocate one diet over another...as that is a personal choice...I do add my slant to contribute to the conversation.
When I stopped eating grains in2013, my autoimmune Grave’s Disease went away and I have been euthyroid for 5 years.
If you read David O. Davis’s Wheat Belly book you will find that modern wheat is not the same as the wheat your grandfather ate. The gluten causes more problems.
Yes the triglycerides go down due to decreases carbs.
Yes time restricted eating is wonderful.
I strive to do 16/8 daily for years along with my Ketovore, almost Carnivore diet.
I have reversed the hyperglycemia of ADT this way.
It seems you have a reason to be on a keto diet...My sister who has Crohn's is similar...she can't eat whole grains and some other foods. But she does suffer from not getting the nutrients found in whole grains and shell be the first to say that.
I'm not eating a lot of wheat products myself... I have the occasional toasted Italian steak roll but my whole grains are organic oats, organic brown rice, lentil and chickpea pasta
As I said, diet is personal choice but the whole grains provide nutrition that can't be extracted from other food sources,
When I was doing keto, my main fiber sources were avocado, olives, dark chocolate, pecans and coconut (and other nuts and seeds), along with ample amounts of greens and limited amounts of berries. [Psyllium husk as needed!]
I think you are on point about the benefits of whole grains, but aside from a desire to ensure one is in "nutritional ketosis" there is another reason, for some, to cut them out entirely: those of us who have a problem with a little thing called "portion control" will eat more of them than we should.
I am not suggesting whole grain foods are as addictive as the processed "white" versions, but with myself, one bite keeps inviting the next bite for many of the healthier foods just as surely as it does for the unhealthier ones. So eliminating them altogether can bring some increased order to disordered eating habits.
Sounds good. I am often surprised by what makes me hungrier and what doesn't, but often eating even a little of something that's "not quite satisfying" leaves me with cravings. Depending on my mental or emotional state (tired, depressed, etc.) that can be dangerous!
Thanks for highlighting the keto paradox that a diet high in fat energy with low to very low carbs results in lowering plasma fats and improving lipid profiles
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Diet
Let's change the way we're treated by adding metabolic therapy to SOC
Reversal of Apalutamide and Darolutamide Aldo-Keto Reductase 1C3-Mediated Resistance by a Small Molecule Inhibitor. 2020 Mar 3
ADT 's effect on body fat and muscle mass from Life on ADT blog by Richard Wassersug
