"Thyroid hormone profiles in individuals on non standard thyroid hormone replacement" Cardiff study about T3 suppressing TSH more than T4

[TaraJR]

This study from 2023 was done by the team in Cardiff... Peter Taylor, Aneela Arooj, Stephanie Hanna, Vinay Eligar, Zubair Muhammed, Mike Stedman, Lakdasa Premawardhana, Onyebuchi Okosieme, Adrian Heald & Colin Dayan.

Well worth reading this abstract, and looking at the related poster. Many patients know that taking T3 lowers or suppresses TSH more than T4 does, but we all too often get our dose/s lowered, going only by a TSH level. I think this paper helps to dispel that.

I'd be grateful if anyone can explain the scientific terminology better than I can understand it!

endocrine-abstracts.org/ea/...

[arTistapple]

I really like that this has been done, especially by enthusiastic endos. At least I am very aware of Dr. Peter Taylor and Professor Dayan and respect them.

The ‘suppression’ of TSH needs thorough airing.

However I remain a little wary of the enthusiasm for ‘slow release’ T3. Only in that as we know, so many hypothyroids are very individual in their response. Does slow release T3 coincide with the Circadian Rhythm (yes even my endo called it that) of ‘natural’ T3?

It’s all theory to me as I can’t get T3 prescribed as yet. It’s torture having no back up from medics. I know most people on this Forum go through this but Oh Dear, it’s blooming hard work trying to get them to remotely understand what seems pretty basic to us on the Forum. I do wonder at my basic level of understanding are we in danger of oversimplifying our cause in an attempt to speak to them on their level? Right now I have not got a clue.

Still, this piece of research I think is pretty worthwhile.

Thanks for bringing it to the Forum TaraJR

[helvella Administrator]

"T3 levels have a greater negative impact on TSH levels than T4 levels."

I don't think this is a surprise, nor is it intrinsically controversial. But...

The word "negative" is used there strictly to mean that TSH drops more with increasing T3 than with increasing T4. However, I suspect that all too many will want to interpret that as being a negative on the person. Not just the TSH level.

"See, that T3 had a negative impact...!!!"

And note that you can request a full-text version from the authors.

(Why? Doesn't it make more sense for the full text to be published as open text? For this and every other paper.)

[MissGrace in reply to helvella]

I agree. I think if you read this, they are still seeing TSH as god. They are keen to make sure it isn’t suppressed and hope ‘slow release’ T3 may achieve the over-arching aim of raising TSH. Nothing about how that make the receivers feel of course, or symptoms… but at least they aren’t getting over-excited about the use of T3 per se. 🥛🤸‍♂️

[pennyannie]

It seems to me this research is TSH centred possibly to placate the establishment -

and angled to get support for the acceptance of a slow release T3 to be readily prescribed -

In light of all the controversy surrounding the prescribing of Liothyronine -

and the very diverse viewpoints held by influential people as to it's need -

I see this as a bridging gap, looking for some consensus of opinion - so no one loses face.

But not holding my breath !!

[tattybogle]

thanks Tara, looking forward to reading but it will have to wait until my eye stops being a nuisance ~ in the meantime i have added this post to my (previously rather sketchy) list of references for 'T3 lowers TSH more than T4 does' ~ on this post : healthunlocked.com/thyroidu.... tsh-is-just-the-opinion-of-your-pituitary-about-your-dose-but-your-pituitarys-opinion-is-a-bit-warped-once-you-take-thyroid-hormone.