When to take meds

[bellsjet]

I have been on levothyroxine 75mg for few years now I have to take alendronic acid and adcal d3 for my bones. I now read you should not take aa and levo at same time been prescribed to take in morn. The adcal d3 at night wondered if anyone on same how they take them. Has anyone got side effects from the aa and adcal. At moment not feeling good on all of them

[radd]

bellsjet

You can take them all daily but ensure four hours apart from your Levothyroxine, which also needs an empty stomach.

However, these meds aren’t great and likely bringing unwanted side effects. I reversed a diagnosis of osteopenia evidenced with DEXA scans, with a bone-strengthening protocol:

Ensuring adequate levels of thyroid hormones (particularly FT3), oestrogen, progesterone, testosterone and Vit D. I gain calcium from rich dietary sources, do weight bearing exercise and take a medical food grade supplement called Bone Balance which supplies the right collagens.

It took several years but the results are remarkable. I too was offered bone meds but refused preferring my own methods. If you’re menopausal it’s well worth considering HRT.

[JGBH in reply to radd]

Hello radd, May I ask what is the bone supplement you are taking Please? How soon did you noticed an improvement in your bones? Tia.

[radd in reply to JGBH]

JGBH

Bone Balance …bonebalance.co.uk

A DEXA scan diagnosed osteopenia state in roughly 2012. One subsequent DEXA showed significant improvement and a second DEXA some years later showed me out of the danger zone.

The test came in January of this year when I tumbled down a whole flight of stairs, rupturing a hamstring. I was black and blue all over, and had an actual dent in one shin they called bone-trauma from such big impact but no actual broken bones!

[JGBH in reply to radd]

Hi radd

Thank you for replying and giving me the link. I have checked but cannot see details about the type of proteins used in the product. Do you know, is it marine sourced or? Does if interfere with biologic injections (RA treatment) and thyroid treatment?

It certainly seems to have helped you. My goodness falling down a whole flight of stairs… very painful hamstring injury… how long has it taken you to recover from that?

Best wishes. J

[radd in reply to JGBH]

JGBH,

My whole rehab program is 18 months long with 3 monthly check-ins with the consultant. Physios have me doing exercises/activities that won't wrench the vulnerable reattachment, and I'm now walking and attending spinning classes (indoor cycling with very loud music 😁).

Bone Balance uses FORTIBONE which consists of bioactive hydolized bovine collagen peptides Type 1 & Type. Scientific independent studies have shown this combo to be the most efficient in moving to bone tissue, promoting new bone matrix formation and increasing BMD. (I understand the marine is best for skin, nail and hair and you can take a mix of both).

It is classified as an FSMP (Food for Special Medical Purpose) and so there are no contra-introductions. It can be taken with any food and any meds. I take mine with my breakfast at least a hour after thyroid meds.

I can't find the papers supporting FORTIBONE but thought I had once supplied to    TiggerMe ?

[TiggerMe in reply to radd]

Maybe this one... pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/345...

[JGBH in reply to TiggerMe]

Hi TiggerMe

Thank you for the link regarding BONEBALANCE.

Having read your bio, I wonder how you are able to take so many supplements, pills, etc. without causing any counter effects. I find it difficult managing all I need to take. Balancing everything is not easy.

[TiggerMe in reply to JGBH]

I take my T3 & T4 between 4-6am so kept well clear of all the others, on waking it's DHEA or Pregnenolone and Adrenal cortex

Where I can I take sublingual forms so B12 and Vit D with K2, now I have everything at a good level and to save a few pennies I tend to alternate days with the stronger formulas like B complex, I only take heme iron a couple of times a week which I'd take after lunch, testosterone and oestrogen are both transdermal

So I take a handful mid morning and then early evening I'll take magnesium, l-glutathione, then Utrogestan just before bed.

It can all be a bit overwhelming so I try not to get too religious about it 🤗

[JGBH in reply to TiggerMe]

Thank you again. My goodness… how do you cope when you go out? I have many hospital appointments at any times of the day… I am already rattling… Taking D3, K2MK7, B complex, Magnesium, prednisolone, T4, T3 …. Paracetamol, B12 injections , etc. I had to stop taking D, K2, B, Mag, BP tablets, because I felt nauseous, having abdominal cramps … starting to feel a little better. It is difficult to assess what is going on at times. I will reintroduce supplements slowly once symptoms have disappeared. Thank you for the information though. Will make a note.

[JGBH in reply to radd]

Hi radd,

Thank you for further information on BONEBALANCE. I think I will give this a try.

Tiggerme has kindly given a link regarding further explanation regarding this product.

You are very lucky to be getting all the physio support following your tumble down the stairs. What a great GP you must have. I too had such a tumble 14 years ago… didn’t damage any ligaments nor bone. It was in winter and I was wearing a very thick ´duvet type ´ long coat as I was about to go out. This must have protected my body somehow. I fell head forward (as I was going backwards and lost my balance) and landed on my right side, the impact was such that all the tissues were pushed down, compacted, my right hip had been pushed forward (so lopsided now!) and still remains as such. Was driven to A&E (was a Sunday evening) and they didn’t even do an X-ray once they were assured I could answer basic questions (so assuming no brain damage). I was then sent home ! Contacted the surgery the following day… they weren’t bothered. The bruising came up from my chest down to lower part of my thighs and most of my back. Was very sore… tired ( shock of course). I have tried for many years getting some help, to no avail. I was 64 then. It is rather shocking that no one seemed concerned. Bad practice. So I am most impressed about the treatment you are receiving. So good luck and hope you will recover as well as possible.

[radd in reply to JGBH]

JGBH,

Oh poor you. It sounds as if you should have at least had X-rays ☹️. Does it still bother you?

My treatment/on going care is all through the hospital, not my GP whom I avoid at all costs. I also received great home support with community nurses visiting and loaned equipment from some social department. I think they were trying to ensure I stayed in my own home as opposed to a rehabilitation unit where there are no beds.

[JGBH in reply to radd]

Hello radd,

It has always bothered me. Was most painful for a very long time. It felt like my muscles were pulling apart from each other… and of course caused a deformity…. Difficult to dress … one hip lower than the other. I tried several times over the years to get this sorted but every time it fell on deaf ears! They didn’t want to hear, to help. So I am not at all impressed by this health system. It is fair to say I have multiple comorbidities but that should not prevent a decent care system to try and sort out the problem. This was a serious fall. Ranting over.

Years later I was diagnosed with compression fractures of the lumbar spine (have osteoporosis) and in the past 2 years or so scoliosis and spondylitis. An MRI scan taken over 2 years ago (and I hadn’t been informed at the time, just found out recently) shows that the thoracic vertebrae on my left side are out of alignment with the spinal cord. Am pretty convinced this is as a result of that dangerous fall, which has never been investigated properly. I understand that this could have happened in time with progressive RA and osteoporosis but that fall has had a huge impact on my physical deterioration.

I am absolutely amazed regarding the service you are getting… May I ask you the area where you live?

Best wishes for a good recovery.

[radd in reply to JGBH]

JGBH,

I’m in England South East. I also received good treatment for my TIA in 2021 but must point out my thyroid treatment has been abysmal with NHS T3 meds being given and abruptly withdrawn twice in previous years.

The degree of illness caused by being left hypothyroid for so long (when I knew no better) and the stress caused by the NHS trying to cut T3 meds costs can be difficult to recover from. And along the way I explored every avenue and now don’t trust the NHS regarding my thyroid treatment, so have bought my own meds for quite a few years now to retain control.

I'm so sorry to hear of your terrible experiences. If these things aren't sorted they can lead on to further conditions arising and this sadly sounds like what has happened to yourself ☹️.

[JGBH in reply to radd]

I only know too well what it is like fighting for the correct treatments, I had to do so nearly all the time, at times with no success. . I should have been prescribed Liothyronine post complete thyroidectomy in 1980 but of course was only prescribed Levothyroxine.. I felt so ill, always exhausted, even passing out, until I decided 10 years ago to see an enlightened endocrinologist privately who was appalled at the way I had been treaded, stating I should have been prescribed T3 in combination with T4 post operation. So he prescribed combination therapy and put me back onto the NHS, stating he was not sure how I coped for so long without T3 since I was a very poor converter. He even fought for me so that the hospital provide my T3 because my surgery refused point blank to do so… because of costs! So that was very lucky indeed but I don’t think it happens often.

I understand it is difficult getting T3 in the South East….unless one goes privately. My daughter lives in the SE.

Although the NHS can do miracles it is very much a lottery as to whether one gets the necessary treatments. Unfortunately it is collapsing. Whilst I have met a few wonderful medical professionals (for whom i have much respect) I also met many pretty useless ones.

Good luck with your recovery.

[TiggerMe in reply to JGBH]

I've had great treatment from an Osteopath who realigned things I didn't even know were out of place!

[JGBH in reply to TiggerMe]

Thanks but I do not think an osteopath would help because it is rather complicated. He/she wouldn’t be able to ´reajust’ the spine… It’s well past a simple realignment.

I can assure I know something was wrong because of the high pain level and my body leaning to the right. Unfortunately not a simple case of realignment. I had this in the past.

[radd in reply to radd]

bell jet,

'Has anyone got side effects from the aa and adcal. At moment not feeling good on all of them'

Personally I would stop the bisphosphonate meds. There are known common side effects such as stomach upset, oesophagus inflammation (even erosions of oesophagus surface) and less common such as jaw osteonecrosis, atrial fibrillation, and ironically risk of femur fracture. Osteoclasts cells break down/remove bone, and osteoblasts cells build bone. Bisphosphonates slow down osteoclasts which is supposed to allow osteoblasts to work more effectively but these actions should remain balanced as otherwise risk osteosclerosis (bone stiffness) making the femur vulnerable in some.

On a side note osteosclerosis also develops from a lack T3 (that effects osteoclast/oesteoblast action) making hypos already at risk. Tania Smith has written a blog about about osteosclerosis caused by insufficient FT3 here …. . thyroidpatients.ca/2019/07/...

Adcal D3 seems to be offered as standard according to age and not an actual calcium deficiency. It is not a case of more calcium is better for bones as excess can end up in the arteries. Have you had your calcium levels tested? I wouldn't take the Adcal D3 as believe we are better of gaining calcium from dietary sources that is better utilised by the body, and extra Vit D can be taken with K2 which helps ensure calcium is directed to the bones.

[Obsdian]

I take my levo early hours when I get up to go toilet (have an alarm set in case I don't wake). Helps give me a good gap so I don't have to worry once I've wake up.

(I'm not on the addictional meds you are on).

[Capan24]

I take my Synthroid (levothyroxine) at 10:00 p.m. . This way I don't have to worry about food or supplements interacting with it. I've done this for many years and don't have any issues with taking it at night. The important thing is to take this medication the same time.