I've just read: healthunlocked.com/thyroidu.... As ever the answer seems to be "it depends"! Some better on or off lio, some better at bedtime or on waking, etc.
My sleep pattern is (roughly) one half-decent sleep followed by an utterly awful one. I finally mentioned it to my GP and he's prescribed Zopiclone 3.75mcg. I had 9 hours last night after first pill, but it was after a night with nigh zero sleep. I'm happy to try the course. I have started getting up daily at 7.30 (an 8 day run so far) and my sleep hygeine is pretty good.
I take 18.75 mcg lio split 12.5 morning and 6.25 bedtime (and 125mcg levo morning).
I'm wondering about taking all the lio in the morning, which is what I used to do.
My vitamins, etc are all fine the last time I had them tested and I take B-complex, vitamin D + B12, magnesium, selenium, etc.
I suppose it's easy enough to experiment by having a week taking all the lio in the morning, though I should probably wait until the course of Zopiclone is complete.
I should also say I'm taking Citalopram for depression as things are tough at home, not having worked in many months (again). My mojo is slowly improving.
My mood/mojo/brain-fog is probably a vicious circle of poor sleep, not energy and round-and-round.
Thanks for reading!
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Decant
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You are overmedicated - FT3 should be roughly approaching 75% through reference range - 120.5% is probably contributing to your sleep problems and any anxiety and depression you may experience
Overmedication can sometimes feel like undermedication.
I take 18.75 mcg lio split 12.5 morning and 6.25 bedtime (and 125mcg levo morning).
This is a hefty dose....are you self medicating?
I suggest you start by dropping 6.25mcgT3 from your morning dose then test again in 6 weeks....further dose changes may then be required
I've recently started a liothyronine withdrawl protocol with Prof Karim Meeran - it is an exceedingly slow tapering off to zero with very regular blood tests - his experience is that the body will start endogenous T3 again. I'm willing to give it a trial; I always have my private supply to return to so he has no real power over me!
I'd forgotten but I had bloods with Prof Meeran two weeks ago (before the trial started) and they were: -
TSH 0.01 mIU/L (0.3 - 4.2) -7.4%
Free T4 (fT4) 13.8 pmol/L (9 - 23) 34.3%
Free T3 (fT3) 6.4 pmol/L (2.4 - 6) 111.1%
T4:T3 Ratio 2.156
Vitamin D 98.8 nmol/L (50 - 150) 48.8%
So, fT3 is still high. These results weren't taken according to the protocol (they were taken at the hospital in the afternoon).
I would have thought that "very regular"/ frequent testing wouldn't leave time between doses to allow the hormone to settle into the system and so give an accurate reading.....and, as you allude to, that all testing should follow the protocol
It will be interesting to discover if the body can indeed start to produce adequate T3 after the tapering. I'm just another patient....but I'm not convinced.
I think there are other factors to consider...
If the thyroid is damaged it's T3 production will decrease permanently....and if T4 to T3 conversion is impaired (esp by the Dio2 snp) then FT3 level will remain low
Both will require exogenous T3.
Also suggest you try to raise Vit D....Vit D Society suggests 100-150nmol/L.
Vit D should be taken with vit K2 which ensures the Vit D goes to the bones rather to soft tissue where it can cause calcification
Anyway, I'm ranting again....sorry!
Good luck with the trial ....is the Prof carrying out some research into this?
I've recently started a liothyronine withdrawl protocol with Prof Karim Meeran - it is an exceedingly slow tapering off to zero with very regular blood tests - his experience is that the body will start endogenous T3 again.
Did you know that you were going to be seen by the T3 withdrawal clinic? Dr K M is notorious for taking everyone off T3. He doesn't care about his patients, he just wants to take everyone off T3 - while I'm guessing he sits there with T3 flowing through his veins naturally.
You may well be over-dosed on T3 but there is no need to plan in advance to take your dose down to zero. Healthy people don't have zero T3.
To answer your question about T3 and insomnia...
My personal experience is that I tried taking T3 at bedtime but it exacerbated my already existing severe insomnia. I switched to taking T3 the moment I woke up, which has helped a little bit. But my insomnia has been intractable for the last 50 years so the only way it is likely to go away is when I've shuffled off this mortal coil.
I had a feeling that KM was on some kind of mission....trying to make a name for himself...his reasoning seems to have as many holes as a sieve....and is potentially dangerous.
You are over medicated for sure on T3. I’d drop the night time dose altogether and split the daily dose half in the morning and half mid afternoon. Best to reduce T3 rather than taking sleeping tablets as next thing you’ll be hooked on them when the problem is T3 overdosing.
If it was me, I would drop the 6.25 dose and just take the 12.5 Lio together with your Levo in one dose in the morning. I would also drop the Zopiclone until you’ve tried the lio drop. Your FT4 is low but may rise a little after dropping the small amount of Lio. As long as your FT3 is in range, you won’t be over medicated. Be mindful of KM’s motives, he’s notorious!
I take 5mcg of liothyronine with my 137mcg Levo in the am. Then I take another 5mcg liothyronine about 12:45pm. This create a strict ‘time’ diet for me, but it works. I asked my endocrinologist regarding taking another 5mcg early evening for sleep & he told me it doesn’t really work that way. Liothyronine has a half life of about 5-6 hours
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FT4 and FT3 rising as well as TSH - confused!
What to concentrate on .....
Gullo: LT4 monotherapy and thyroid loss invert FT3 and FT4 per unit of TSH
Worried about over-range fT4
New Bloods - Very Confused
