Please could anyone help women with results !? Iam on 2 grains ndt one day and 1.8 grains following day? Many thanks

[Ari3]

I have done my thyroid test and I would like to have some comments if my vitamins are ok and could anyone tell me if I produce rt3 looking at my test results are they ok?

[SeasideSusie Remembering]

Ari3

Why different amounts of NDT alternate days? With NDT the dose should be the same each day. This is because it contains T3 and this should be the same every day.

could anyone tell me if I produce rt3 looking at my test results are they ok?

No you're not producing elevated rT3 due to anything to do with your thyroid. rT3 can be raised due to many reasons, only one of which is to do with the thyroid, and that is when there is an excess of unconverted T4. Your FT4 is below range so there is certainly no excess T4.

CRP is good, it's an inflammation marker so the lower the better.

Ferritin is good.

Folate is recommended to be at least half way through range. The Medichecks range is 2.89-14.5 so half way is 8.7 and you are a bit below that. I'd want mine over 10.

Active B12 below 70 suggests testing for B12 deficiency. You are a bit above that, I prefer my Active B12 to be over 100.

If I had your folate and active B12 results I'd be taking a good quality, bioavailable B Complex such as Thorne Basic B to improve both levels.

Vit D is recommended to be 100-150nmol/L by the Vit D Society and Grassroots Health. If I had your result I'd be supplementing with 2,000iu D3 daily along with D3's important cofactors - magnesium and Vit K2-MK7, retesting in 3 months to see if I had reached the recommended level, then I'd find my maintenance dose to keep it there, testing twice a year to check I remain within the range.

Your thyroid hormones are as expected when on NDT - low/suppressed TSH, low FT4 and upper range FT3. However, even though we are all individual as to where we need our FT4 andFT3, one would expect to see FT4 within range. How do you feel with those levels?

Presumably you knew you have Hashi's, as confirmed by your raised TPO antibodies?

[Ari3 in reply to SeasideSusie]

Hello Iam happy you replied well on two grains Iam having runny stools I feel jittery and very hyperactive and shaky . What shall I do ? This dose Iam ok but not going to toilet every single day every other day and then normal again. Iam trying now to optimise all my vitamins and maybe they play a big role of how I feel as well.

[Ari3 in reply to SeasideSusie]

If I go on two grains daily I feel shaky runny stools and foggy brain basically more hypothyroid symptoms . So I have to always back up .would it change if I will increase my ducks in a row (conversion) and also does magnesium play a big part of conversion as well as zinc?

[SeasideSusie Remembering in reply to Ari3]

I have not heard that magnesium plays a part in conversion.Optimal levels of Vit D, B12, Folate and Ferritin are important, some experts say that the optimal Ferritin level for thyroid function is 90-110ug/L.

Selenium is said to help conversion, selenium l-selenomethionine or yeast bound selenium are the recommended forms, avoid selenite and selenate. Some people prefer to test before supplementing although 100mcg is thought to be a safe dose, no more than 200mcg.

[Ari3 in reply to SeasideSusie]

Mine is a bit of a high end -selenium

[Lalatoot]

Ari you cannot alternate your dose. On T4 only we can take different amounts but when on T3 we need to take the same amount around the same time each day. That's the way the body likes it.Rt3 is a red herring and is more often caused by things other than thyroid.

Some folks find that the balance of T4 to T3 in NDT doesn't suit them and as a result they also take levo or lio to raise either their ft4 or ft3.

Your ft4 is low. You may want to consider adding some levo if you are still having symptoms but first I would improve your b12 and cut d levels to see if that helps.

[Ari3 in reply to Lalatoot]

I have conversion issues as one of my genes are faulty DIO2 .I have tried synthetic levothyroxine and it made me more sick and I had ellergic reaction a rash all my body I tried all companies of Levothyroxine and no better

[SlowDragon Administrator]

As you have Hashimoto’s are you on absolutely strictly gluten free diet

If not get coeliac blood test done BEFORE cutting gluten out

[Ari3 in reply to SlowDragon]

Iam not coeliac no I did a blood test and food sensitivity test and it came all negative for gluten but came positive for yeast

[SlowDragon Administrator in reply to Ari3]

Vast majority of Hashimoto’s patients are gluten intolerant not coeliac

It’s ALWAYS Worth Trying strictly gluten free diet 3-6 months

It’s to do with leaky gut rather than a direct food intolerance

Poor gut function with Hashimoto’s can lead leaky gut (literally holes in gut wall) this can cause food intolerances. Most common by far is gluten. Dairy is second most common.

According to Izabella Wentz the Thyroid Pharmacist approx 5% with Hashimoto's are coeliac, but over 80% find gluten free diet helps, sometimes significantly. Either due to direct gluten intolerance (no test available) or due to leaky gut and gluten causing molecular mimicry (see Amy Myers link)

Changing to a strictly gluten free diet may help reduce symptoms, help gut heal

trialing strictly gluten free diet for 3-6 months. Likely to see benefits. Can take many months for brain fog to lift.

If no obvious improvement, reintroduce gluten see if symptoms get worse.

amymyersmd.com/2018/04/3-re...

thyroidpharmacist.com/artic...

drknews.com/changing-your-d...

restartmed.com/hashimotos-g...

Non Coeliac Gluten sensitivity (NCGS) and autoimmune disease

ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/296...

The predominance of Hashimoto thyroiditis represents an interesting finding, since it has been indirectly confirmed by an Italian study, showing that autoimmune thyroid disease is a risk factor for the evolution towards NCGS in a group of patients with minimal duodenal inflammation. On these bases, an autoimmune stigma in NCGS is strongly supported

ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/300...

The obtained results suggest that the gluten-free diet may bring clinical benefits to women with autoimmune thyroid disease

nuclmed.gr/wp/wp-content/up...

In summary, whereas it is not yet clear whether a gluten free diet can prevent autoimmune diseases, it is worth mentioning that HT patients with or without CD benefit from a diet low in gluten as far as the progression and the potential disease complications are concerned

restartmed.com/hashimotos-g...

Despite the fact that 5-10% of patients have Celiac disease, in my experience and in the experience of many other physicians, at least 80% + of patients with Hashimoto's who go gluten-free notice a reduction in their symptoms almost immediately.

hypothyroidmom.com/how-to-l...

Eliminate Gluten. Even if you don’t have Hashimoto’s. Even if you have “no adverse reactions”. Eliminate gluten. There are no universal rules except this one.

[Ari3 in reply to SlowDragon]

Thank you I will try this x

[jamesal0]

Hi Ari

The first question should be how do you feel. If you are dosing correctly you will feel nearly normal. If you're feeling jittery then you are probably over doing it. You can take NDT anytime you want , you have upper and lower limits of course but fundamentally you take as much as you need on any given day. It's cold today and I'm working in the garden all day - I'll take 2 grains. I'm inside watching Utube next to the heater - might be a 1.5 grain day. You will know your signs - jittery is too much, feeling cold and slow is not enough, tingly scalp is too much etc. You can take it 3 times a day if you want - 1/2 a grain for breaky, half for lunch and so on. You should take it with food - stops acid reflux, diarrhea and gives you a bit of a delayed action. You may need to take a tinny bit more when you take it with food or it might be perfect - maybe you can take 2 grains every day and the food will just knock the edge off it. NDT and Levo accumulate in your system (pooling) so if you take a little extra 3 days straight on the 4th day you will get hyper symptoms - heart palps, jittery etc. Don't be concerned, just back it down or skip a day and you will be back on track . You can also use a maternity thermometer and track your temp 4 times a day - it will travel up and down through the day, once you know what's normal then you can drive NDT dose by adding or subtracting to stay normal.

The main thing is not to be scared of NDT or feel like there's a big mystery that only a doctor can interpret for you - just take NDT until you feel good and stop when you don't.

J

[Ari3 in reply to jamesal0]

Thanks for your reply it makes sense .Today I woke up like foggy brain (like Iam drunk or have hangover feeling and it’s so hot outside had lose stool smell and quite lose stools too) maybe I should go back again on 1.8 grains daily and see how it goes .does it take 4-6 weeks for a slight decrease or increase in med to work? I also woke up with achy muscles

[jamesal0 in reply to Ari3]

No it is instant - NDT increases/decreases that is. I always go down and and work my way back up. It's a lot nicer to be under medicated than over.

Brain fog is a symptom of too much NDT. You also need B12, but don't go crazy smashing the vitamins. If you have a balanced diet you mostly get enough eating greens and red meat. Also a good double shot of real coffee helps that first thing brain fog.

Not sure about the muscle aches some people get that from being under medicated on Levo . I get tendon and cartilage pain when over medicated (NDT) - also the tips of my fingers hurt, soles of my feet, burning skin (feet and hands mostly), crawly scalp.

The other one is I have to spit dose - 1 gain from Breakfast and one for Dinner. If I take 2 grains for breakfast - I will have a thyroid headache/ brain fog for 5-6 hours about 30 minutes after taking NDT. I was considering giving up work until I discovered split dosing

[Ari3 in reply to jamesal0]

I will decrease my second dose 2 grains and will try 1.8 grains daily from now on and see how I feel with a brain fog .I think it’s also because it’s hot not sure . All I know on 2 grains I have diahrea type of stool and pains every place brain fog massive headaches etc . I will skip today the dose I think for afternoon and go 1.8 ahead like one grain Morning and 0.8 grains afternoon and see how it goes .!? I have increased vitamins yes b12 specially recently vit d and folate as they are not optimal.once I stop their level goes down I really appriciate your comments James

[jamesal0 in reply to Ari3]

Every time I think I have some rare disease (Dr google leads me astray) - I work out it's just incorrect NDT dose.

Something I for got to say - you need more NDT in Winter and less in Summer

[Ari3 in reply to jamesal0]

Yes same here …talking about b12 … mine drops quickly if I don’t take supplements does it mean I need injections ?

[jamesal0 in reply to Ari3]

I self inject B12 every 5-6 weeks

[Ari3 in reply to jamesal0]

Is this what I should be looking at too? Is this a sign that I would need injections myself or supplementing ? How did you find out you need injections James?

[jamesal0 in reply to Ari3]

I had B12 blood test and was low but in range and my GP tried me on really high doses for 12 months 1400pg/mL But to be honest I didnt notice much change. These days I just shoot up when I'm feeling a bit dumber than normal. It all really comes back to getting your NDT dosing right on the day