Nutritional therapist and supplements...

[malohant]

Hi folks

I recently went to see a nutritional therapist, as I've started following Isabella Wentz' Hashimotos Protocol but was not sure I was getting the nutritional side of it right. The NT was helpful in this regard, but has also suggested a load more supplements which I'd like to get more opinions on.

- Betaine Hydrochloride, to improve stomach acidity

- Gut Health complex including L-Glutamine, to support gut hyper-permeability issues

- Partially Hydrolysed Guar Gum (prebiotic fibre)

- Multivit including active B vits, D3 and K2

I currently take Igennus B complex, liquid K2 drops, liquid D3 drops and magnesium malate powder ( the last two of which she suggested I keep taking).

Given I am currently trying to help my digestive system recover to a better state of health (so it can make better use of the levo I take and hopefully reduce my fatigue), I think I can understand the benefit of the Betaine HCI, gut complex and PHGG - although it seems like a lot to add. But the multivit goes against what I've understood from other posts here? I understand that she makes commission if I purchase these items through a particular dispensary, and so am taking all of this with a pinch of salt too - just interested in other points of view.

She also offered an alternative to the Wentz protocol, the ReNew Food Plan, but it seems crazy to ditch one restorative diet halfway through for another that purports to do the same without good reason.

Basically she gave some good advice, along with a lot that I'd like to question, but at least she seemed to understand the importance of both T3 and diet (unlike my GP who literally said she 'wouldn't touch' T3, and who told me not to think about diet in case it gets too much in my head).

Any thoughts welcome

Much appreciated,

M x

[Mostew]

My first thought is .

Did you generally get a good feeling from her and want to keep seeing her ? If not there are plenty of Nutritional therapists about .

I have found different kinds of practioner s useful over the years. And some I have stuck with when I shouldn’t have .....

Don’t think multi vit is necessary.

With other supplements maybe give them a fair trial if you feel she is worth listening to . No use taking advice from to many people ( adding to confusion!)

If you don’t feel like she is right for you and can’t find another NT have a look at.Ayurvedic practitioners .

I’d be sceptical re. Commission to!!

Xx

[malohant in reply to Mostew]

Thanks Mostew, I'm slightly ambivalent - I did get a goodish feeling from her, certainly she was interested in all the things which I feel the GP should be, but I'm also not sure she gave that much advice (although that may be more in medical terms, which is of course not what she does especially - although she is also trained in functional medicine).

I don't know, I like to hear a range of opinions and hear what they're based on, in order to make a judgement of my own. Basically I was just looking to see if anyone thought these were either ineffective or completely wrong, and if so why. I guess I'm just a sceptic at heart ha.

[JuliaWM]

keep with the diet you are on. But have you thought of changing GP? It, sounds like yours is hopeless, and also you should be having regular endocrinology appointments. once a year at the very least. T4 just does not convert for some people. you need prescribed T3 I manage to get it all on NHS. but then I did change GPs and also I have been doing medical research. try waving a paper copy of a research paper at them. You can get many free on google scholar. if not free maybe about £30 t download. Everybody should be trying to improve their diet. what a thing to say, how patronizing . But doctors only do half a day nutrition in their training so they get scared at those with more knowledge. I have started taking the online MOOC (modular open online courses) on nutrition from EDX at Wageningen university. any layman can take and it really helps you > if you gain the certificate it is about £60 per course. if not it is free. But then, maybe we shouldn't bother and stretch our little heads. :). It is better for you if you can manage to get te vitamins from food if possible.

[malohant in reply to JuliaWM]

I was only diagnosed in Feb, have been on a stable levo dose since Julyish. I already changed my GP, this one is actually better than the last, but at my next appointment I will definitely be pushing for an endocrinologist appointment. And throwing more questions at her. And, if I don't get anywhere, changing GP. Good to know about the MOOC, I'm definitely interested in learning more about nutrition for myself.

[Cheekycharlie1981]

I’ve recently starting taking the betaine hci Viridian complex before my biggest meal which is tea. Now not to be too graphic but I’m less windy and have felt my tummy flatten a little, it has helped with reflux but still get it mildly.

I’ve got gut issues and histamine intolerance so I did also take the glutamine but have reduced it as my last bloods showed my absorption of Levo is possibly being affected by something I take. I only now take the glutamine before a run and it really helps my tired body sustain momentum. I’d be interested to know if it dose effect Levo. But I also take quercetin complex and that can effect Levo.

Multi vits id stay away from you don’t need all that. I used to take igennus b but it did upset my stomach a little I now take thorn b complex.

Zinc would be good to add to your magnesium before bed.

It’s really hard to get the right balance and know what’s benefiting us.

[malohant in reply to Cheekycharlie1981]

It is hard! I don't have reflux and I don't think I'm overly windy, but the NT said gut issues (ie the permeability which goes along with autoimmune stuff) start in, or are at least affected by, the stomach which makes sense to me. My diet management hasn't made me feel loads better yet (although I optimistically think there's slow if mild improvement) but I did have some potatoes a couple of days ago (which are still in my current stage of the protocol but I'm trying to limit) and felt awful after. I'm nowhere near being able to run though!

Thank you

[userotc]

Personally I wouldn't worry about the commission. It's quite common for supplement companies to offer that for practitioners bringing them more sales (as in most other areas of business) and doesn't mean you pay any more for them - even if you could access them directly which is often unlikely.

In order to make enough income to survive whilst charging you a moderate consultancy rate, the NT must consider commission. And we know medics do something similar alongside high salaries, good pensions etc!

As Mostew suggests, don't consider lots of different advice on here or you'll get confused. Give the NT the benefit of the doubt for now at least and don't look for discrepancies etc just because you have to pay. After all, you decided to see the NT for a reason - presumably to get to a root cause of your health concern rather than medics that don't. There's a reason why the latter are free in the UK...although they aren't actually as our taxes pay them.

[Mostew in reply to userotc]

Good advice.

[Roadrunnergreg]

The nutritional advice is actually quite good, also other comments on about commissiins, the medical profession is set up for commission and what's called up sells if additional medications like not getting your thyroid levels right leads to drugs like antidepressants, NSAIDS, and antacids etc. The thing you've gotta decide is do you want to take drugs for multiple conditions that's all tied back to low thyroid all because your levels are in range, in range allows for the additional drugs, the doctor gets paid for, now the nutritional commissions don't seem unreasonable, everybody makes money its just the doctor gets paid out of our taxes...

Now that's out of the way, the BetaineHCL with pepsin aka stomach acid, it does more than break foods down, undigested particles in your stools is a sign of low stomach acid, it also populates healthy bacteria that thrive in an acidic environment, it also adds a positive ionised charge to nutrients to attract to an alkaline body. You may want to consider a digestive enzymes supplement too...

The L-Glutamine at 1tsp5grams in 8oz of water or juice heals the stomach lining, it also heals ulcers in about 4 weeks too.

As for multivitamins I believe everyone should take one, heres why and what most people aren't aware of, is most vegetables ie those that grow above ground are grown in hydroponic warehouses in a solution of NPK only 3 minerals out of 74, or the 17 acknowledged by medicine, of the rest farming soils are mineral deficient in part due to overfarmed soils, without replenishing it. Also all medicines deplete nutrients ya just gotta research it...

Fibre, is healthy for the gut, and the intestine plus protects certain cancers including colorectal cancer, also fibre adds in Leptin the satisfied hormone often deficient if your always hungry...

As for vitamin D3 and Magnesium again good advice. Your vitamin D3 level on your test needs to be between 70-100 to get the full benefits from it, the closer to 100 the better, it does way more than build bones, if your levels are as mentioned you get full protection from certain cancers, its a natural pain killer, plus you produce cathelicidins the cathelicidins kill bacteria, viruses, and fungus.

The Magnesium is needed for vitamin D3 absorption, people who struggle to raise their vitamin D despite supplementation are Magnesium deficient...

B Complex also needs stomach acid, B vitamins are especially B6-9-12 are needed for methylation and homocysteine control symptoms of high homocysteine include fatigue etc also these three B vitamins need other B vitamins to be most effective just like vitamin D needs Magnesium, I call em cofactor nutrients

I hope this helps you understand the why its good advice...

[malohant in reply to Roadrunnergreg]

Thanks Roadrunnergreg ! that's a really useful and detailed breakdown of it. I have started some of the supplements (introducing one at a time to see effect) and certainly since starting the Wentz protocol I have noticed some small increase in energy. I've resolved to finish it (just in time for Xmas day) and will return to the nutritional therapist some time after that I imagine. In the meantime I have the GP to contend with next week, hopefully I can make some headway there - if not I shall endeavour to switch again!

Thanks again, very much appreciated

M