Normal TSH but all the symptoms of Hypothyroidi... - Thyroid UK

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Normal TSH but all the symptoms of Hypothyroidism and I have Hashimoto disease. Help!

Tice
Tice

Hi! I’m new here. I was diagnosed of Hashimoto disease 15 years ago and never did anything about it. The doctors always said to keep checking. For the last 2 years I’m very tired all the time, can’t loose weight (I run 3x a week for 5k, 8k and 10k) and I have a personal trainer 3 times a week as well) but I just keep gaining weight. I have all the symptoms of hypothyroid but my levels are in the normal range: TSH is 2.5 and free T4 is 1 and free T3 is 3.2.

The TPO is the one that is bad, always, 18 (should be <9) and the TG is 1.

The problem is the doctor don’t think I should take Synthroid 25mg (or any hormone) and I have to live with all this symptoms. What should I do?

37 Replies
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Can you give the ranges for those results please? Results are meaningless without, because ranges vary from lab to lab.

If your FT3 is low, then you are doing to much excercise, which will make you more hypo and make you put on more weight. Ease up on the excercise, is my advice. It won't make you lose weight, anyway.

What exactly do you mean by 'all the symptoms of hyperthyroidism'? Your TSH tends more towards hypo than hyper. And, it may be in the range but the range is too wide, and it shows your thyroid is struggling, even though these labs aren't showing you to be hypo at the moment.

However, the high antibodies shows that you have Autoimmune Thyroiditis - aka Hashi's, on here. Hashi's is where the immune system slowly destroys the thyroid, mistaking it for the enemy. And, levels tend to jump around a lot when ou have Hashi's.

Hashi's people are often gluten-sensitive, so one of the things you can do is try a 100% gluten-free diet, to see if it improves symptoms.

You should also get your nutrients tested: vit D, vit B12, folate, ferritin. These are likely to be low, adding to your symptoms.

Tice
Tice in reply to greygoose

Hi! Thank you!

Here is the levels:

TSH: 2,57 (0,4 - 4,5)

Free T4: 1 (0,8 - 1,8)

Free T3: 3,2 (2,3 - 4,2)

TPO: 18 (<9)

TG: 1 (< or = 1)

Vitamin D: 77 (30 - 100) (I take 10.000 IU of VitD supplement per day)

Vitamin B12: 825 (200 - 1100) (I take supplement for B12 as well)

Iron: 64 (40 - 190) (I take supplement for iron as well)

I actually take 15 supplements every day because this last 2 years has been hard...if I don’t take them I literally don’t leave the bed.

When I try the zero carb diet I loose weight but it’s not a diet you can have forever and as soon as I eat any carb, I gain the weight back.

I didn’t exercise 6x a week for the last 2 years, I started only walking 3 times a week, then it didn’t work, I stared waking everyday, didn’t work, theeennnn, I started running 3 times a week, still gaining weight like crazy, then I stared the personal. Now I do 3 times a week the personal AND 3 times a week the running. Still gaining weight....

The doctor said my levels are normal so he doesn’t think I should take the Synthroid but I eat 1200 calories/day, workout 6 times a week and still don’t loose weight. So I don’t know what to do.

By the way, I did one exame called ANA for autoimune disease and it came positive.

1:320 (my result)

Range: > 1:80 elevate antibody level

That means my Hashimoto is very active right now.

greygoose
greygoose in reply to Tice

Well, it doesn't, actually. It just means you have some sort of autoimmune disease. It's your TPO and Tg antibodies that are specific for Hashi's.

But all that exercising is not going to make you lose weight because it's not lack of exercise that made you put it on. I doubt it's fat, anyway. It's far more likely to be water weight. And, exercise isn't going to get rid of that. But, over-exercising - and not eating enough calories - is going to make you put more on.

A zero carb diet is not a good idea, either, because you need carbs to convert T4 to T3.

As I said before, you aren't actually hypo at the moment - you may have been in the past - you doubtless will be in the future. But, at the moment you aren't. So, your doctor is not going to give you thyroid hormone replacement.

Free T4: 1 (0,8 - 1,8)

20%

Free T3: 3,2 (2,3 - 4,2) 47.37%

Your FT4 is low, but as far as your doctor is concerned, it's in-range, so it must be good. Doctors don't know very much about thyroid, and don't understand the subtilies. But, your FT3 isn't too bad.

If you are taking vit D, are you also taking it's co-factors: magnesium and vit K2-MK7? Vit D and magnesium work together and should be taken together or you'll deplete your magnesium - which is probably low already.

If you are taking B12, are you also taking a B complex? Because the Bs all work together and need to be kept balanced.

And, if you are taking iron, are you also taking vit C, to help absorption and guard against constipation?

I actually take 15 supplements every day because this last 2 years has been hard...if I don’t take them I literally don’t leave the bed.

Might be best if you gave a complete list because not all supplements are good to take, and some could be working against you.

Tice
Tice in reply to greygoose

I take:

Morning:

1 Mitochondrial energy optimizer with PPQ (has B6)

1 amino acids free form

1 probiotics

1 thyroid support (has B12, iodine, zinc, selenium, copper, manganese and other stuff)

1 evening primrose oil

4 gummy’s vit C

Lunch:

2 vitamin D

2 omega 3 fish oil

1 iron (with folate and B12)

1 boron

Night:

1 relora

1 5 HTP

1 magnesium

1 evening Primrose oil

1 thyroid support

But if I’m not with hypothyroidism, why am I gaining weight and just can’t loose any pound? The hormone it’s my only hope now...doesn’t have anything else I didn’t try yet...

By the way, I drink a lot of water and go to the bathroom regularly, I don’t think it’s water weight.

Tice
Tice in reply to Tice

By the way, every supplement that I’m taking were prescribe from the same doctor that don’t want me to take the hormone. He said the supplements were going to help but I’m taking them since March and still don’t loose weight. I have at least more energy so that’s why I don’t give up on them.

At the time he said for me to do more exercise (I was walking everyday), eat less and take the supplements. It’s been 7 months and more 6,6 pounds!

greygoose
greygoose in reply to Tice

1 thyroid support (has B12, iodine, zinc, selenium, copper, manganese and other stuff)

Well, for a start, this is a big no-no. As you have Hashi's, you should absolutely not be taking iodine. And, copper should be tested before taking any. Hypos are usually low in Zinc, high in copper. So, adding more copper is not a good idea.

1 iron (with folate and B12)

You will not be absorbing those vitamins because the iron will block their absorption. That is one of the most silly supplements I've ever seen - another was iron and calcium in the same tablet! lol You need to take iron two hours away from everything except vit C, and the vit c needs to be taken at the same time as the iron.

B12 is best taken sublingually, to avoid stomach acid. And, it should be taken with a B complex to get all the Bs together.

4 gummy’s vit C

How much vit C in those gummies?

2 vitamin D

2 omega 3 fish oil

1 iron (with folate and B12)

1 boron

So, all this is wrong, you won't be absorbing much of this lot, either.

But if I’m not with hypothyroidism, why am I gaining weight and just can’t loose any pound?

As I said, on those labs you are not hypo. But that doesn't mean you haven't been hypo before - maybe last week? Levels jump around when you have Hashi's.

Can't see any sign of vit K2-MK7.

By the way, I drink a lot of water and go to the bathroom regularly, I don’t think it’s water weight.

I don't think that's got anything to do with it.

Have you tried the pinch test?

youtube.com/watch?v=oI9yurd...

Tice
Tice in reply to greygoose

I feel that the supplements didn’t help on the weight problema but they really helped me on the energy problem. I was ALWAYS tired and sleepy and could never do anything. Now I workout and run a lot. If I forget the supplements for 2 or 3 days I go back to feeling bad. So basically now I’m afraid to take them out...

The Vitamin C is 4 gummy’s 500mg

The iron is this one:

Garden of Life Vitamin Code Raw Iron Supplement - 30 Vegan Capsules, 22mg Once Daily Iron, Vitamins C, B12, Folate, Fruit, Veggies & Probiotics, Iron Supplements for Women, Energy & Anemia Support amazon.com/dp/B00280M13O/re...

I never took this Vit k2. Is it good?

And I just saw the video, definitely really bad on the pinch test... 😭😭😭

greygoose
greygoose in reply to Tice

The Vitamin C is 4 gummy’s 500mg

That's not a lot. And rather an expensive way of taking it! I take at least 1000 mg with my iron, and sometimes more at different times of the day.

It doesn't matter which iron supplement it is, if you take iron with other supplements, you won't absorb the other supplements. Iron should be taken two hours away from everything else except vit D. And vit C and iron need to be taken at the same time for maximum absorption. So, with that supplement, you're paying for a lot of other stuff that you're not absorbing. Also, you're taking it with your vit D, so you won't absorb the vit D.

I never took this Vit k2. Is it good?

Not that I know of, but it does its job.

When you are taking vit D, it increases the absorption of calcium from food. Vit K2 makes sure that this extra calcium goes into the bones and teeth and doesn't build up in the soft tissues and arteries. It is essential to take it with vit D.

My personal opinion is that you ought to get your vit D and iron tested to make sure you haven't over-dosed on them - which can be dangerous - and then completely revise your supplements and when you take them. :)

Tice
Tice in reply to greygoose

I got them tested. They are both in the middle of the range, even with me taking the supplement every day.

greygoose
greygoose in reply to Tice

OK, good. Not surprising, really, because I doubt you've been absorbing much.

But, you do need to revise your supplements. Cut out the iodine. Test for copper if you want to take it, or cut it out. Take iron on its own, except for vit C.

Mhymer
Mhymer in reply to greygoose

Interesting @greygoose I’ve just tried the pinch test with my husband and I couldn’t do it but my husband could..... I wonder if this is why I sometimes feel like my hands, feet and legs feel massif, is there anything I can do myself for this?

greygoose @Mhymer I'm the same I can't do it either, I was unaware of this test although not sure what to do with the realisation that I can't pinch the skin on my arms though 🤔 x

Well, it's just telling you that your weight gain is not fat, it's water-weight, so diet and exercise is not going to help you. And next time one of these ignorant doctors tells you to eat less and exercise more, you'll have a reply for him! It ain't gonna help!!! All that might help is the optimal dose of thyroid hormone replacement.

What happens is that the mucin part of the skin is excessive in hypo - not all hypos, obviously, but a hell of a lot of them - and this mucin attracts and holds water. And, that means that the skin is not as loose as it should be so you can't pinch it up. And, I doubt any doctor you're likely to come across has every heard about that!

Susieg1
Susieg1 in reply to greygoose

Any tips on losing the water weight? That seems to be my problem too, since I keep putting on weight and I can't pinch skin either.

Would a diuretic help?

greygoose
greygoose in reply to Susieg1

Absolutely no tips, no, as I said above. I wish I had! It's my main problem and it doesn't go away.

Would a diuretic help? Who knows.

A few years ago, I found myself in hospital on a duiretic drip (for reasons that have nothing to do with thyroid), for a week. Followed by many months on diuretic tablets. That week on the drip was sheer hell! And when I left hospital after two weeks, I was like a skinned rabbit! There was nothing of me. But, you can't take diuretics forever. And, as soon as I stopped them, it all started creeping back on again. Now, I'm back to being that chubby girl that people think it's ok to make food jokes about!

If you do a search on here, about mucin, you will find many posts on the same subject. People who think they might have cracked it. But, they never follow up, so we don't know if they cracked it, or if it was just another futile attempt to beat the mucin. I've tried all the suggestions they given, but I haven't cracked it yet, I'm afraid.

Susieg1
Susieg1 in reply to greygoose

Thank you, greygoose. I will check into mucin and I will keep you posted. It means a lot to know that it is water, not fat, since I do eat a very healthy diet.

greygoose
greygoose in reply to Susieg1

You're welcome. :)

Susieg1
Susieg1 in reply to greygoose

I have just seen posts and comments about NAC and vitamin C plus glutathione. Then I saw many that said we shouldn't take NAC with mercury fillings, which I have. I have been taking NAC for a while now (not religiously though). It sounds as though I should stop.

Is there anything I can do if I now have mercury in my brain?

Thank you for your help.

greygoose
greygoose in reply to Susieg1

Yes, I tried the NAC with vit C, but it didn't help at all -- and there's one other supplement you should take at the same time, can't remember the name, but I took it. No help at all.

Some people say you shouldn't take NAC with mercury fillings, others say it doesn't matter. So, worth looking into that further and making up your own might.

Thank you very much for the explanation greygoose that is really helpful 👍 xx

You're welcome. :)

I've been aware of and unable to do this pinch test for years, and yes I hold a LOT of water weight.

greygoose
greygoose in reply to Mhymer

Not that I know of, no. It's one of those hypo symptoms that dosn't go away for everyone.

shaws
shawsAdministrator in reply to Tice

I am not medically qualified but many people, when hypo, can gain weight and they don't understand why this is. Could it be due to not being on a satisfactory thyroid hormone replacement (or dose).

I believe the name is 'mucin' which can be found in hypo patients.

The following is from link below:

stopthethyroidmadness.com/h...

Hi There,

I hope you manage to get things sorted. Cant really offer advice but I was recently recommended a book that whilst it didn't resonate with my situation (originally diagnosed with Graves Disease) it might be helpful for you:

drknews.com/why-do-i-still-....

You wrote you have symptoms of hyperthyroidism, did you mean hypothyroidism? Also, what symptoms do you have other than tiredness and weight gain?

It’s possible to be hypothyroid with normal thyroid hormone levels. There are substances in the environment that can disrupt thyroid hormone action - endocrine disrupting chemicals (EDCs). Doctors are largely unaware of these. The definitive approach is to give you an incremental trial of thyroid hormone and see if it helps. It’s very difficult to persuade a doctor to do this.

Your mildly elevated TPO antibodies are a red herring, they are not affecting your thyroid hormone levels. Lots of healthy people have elevated antibodies, they may develop thyroid disease in the long run. Hashimoto’s strictly speaking is inflammation of the thyroid, often with a goitre. I don’t think you will get anywhere by continually looking at thyroid blood tests, the only way to find out is a trial of thyroid hormone.

Tice
Tice in reply to jimh111

Besides tired and weight gain, I do have upper back pain, sleepy, cold all the time and pretty much all the hypothyroidism symptoms.

If I try to take the hormone, and it doesn’t change anything, can I stop taking it?

How long should I try to see if really works?

jimh111
jimh111 in reply to Tice

Yes you can come off thyroid hormone if it doesn’t help, you would do it gradually. A trial of three months would be reasonable. Note I’m a patient not a doctor.

Tice
Tice in reply to jimh111

I know! The doctors I saw the last 2 years just want me to eat less and less, work out every day and take supplements. Doesn’t work for me unfortunately!

Tice
Tice in reply to jimh111

Thank you! Should I start with 25mg? (Synthroid 25mg)

jimh111
jimh111 in reply to Tice

I would start with 50 mcg so you will notice a difference but it will be up to the doctor who prescribes.

I can't comment on the serum levels, but I have experienced something similar {also have Hashi's} but it turned out my symptoms were actually due to two factors:

First, I have haemochromatosis {too much iron} which clearly doesn't apply to you, and

Second, I'm coeliac - cutting out gluten was an absolute revelation! You might like to try a gluten free (not carb free) diet for a few weeks and see if it makes a difference. Good lick

Tice
Tice in reply to Sleepymoley

That’s a good ideia! I might try a gluten free diet for one or two weeks and see how it works. 😉

I like you thought that diet and working out would help with weight loss and just kept going up and up

I am hypo and on Medication for it .I have just found out while not doing a lot of exercise my weight is going down .It sounds like you could cut back on exercise.I also went to a trainer which did not help me loose any weight .

I feel lazy not working out every day but am just stretching everyday and weight is on the way done

Never thought that all my activity was not helping with weight loss.

Good luck in getting fit

Hello Tice

I have struggled with weight for many years and recently found out I was insulin resistant. Every carb made me put on weight! I am now being treated for this. Just wandered if you might be too.

Tice
Tice in reply to Spuke

Hi! Thank you! I do know that I have a little bit of insulin resistance but I don’t think it’s a lot.

What is your treatment? Can you still eat carb? I’ve already did the zero carb diet many times (desperate times!) and I do loose weight but the moment I start eating again I start gaining weight again.

Spuke
Spuke in reply to Tice

I ended going to see a private thyroid consultant. I have reduced carbs but not cut them out. He gave me a diet sheet. Not that strict and a couple of pills. I’ve lost a lot of weight but am still obese. I don’t know if I’m allowed to discuss anymore on here.

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