Thyroid UK
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Boiling at night then shivery- menopause or hypo symptom?

Does anyone else wake up through the night feeling on fire? Absolutely boiling even with just an empty duvet cover & thin blanket. It doesn't matter what the weather's doing. I manage to get back to sleep the first couple of times each night by throwing the covers off but the 3am wake up has been keeping me awake for a couple of hours every night.I then suddenly go all shivery like you do when you have flu, wrap the covers round me and go back to sleep rapidly, having lain there for ages.

I'm in the perimenopause & haven't had a period for 6 months. Just wondering if it's a sign of that or of overmedication (my T4 is slightly above range although T3 is low in range)

Just wondered if anyone else experiences the weird shivery/ instant sleep bit?

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Waking around 3am could be linked to adrenals. Not sure about the shivering/falling asleep connection though. Adrenals love VitC - lots 😊

It is possible your adrenals will be helped when you add in some T3.

rwt3.com

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Thanks Marz! I will make sure I keep up with 1000mcg of Vit C as I'd tailed it off a bit. Very much hoping to get some T3 sorted in the next month or so. Hope you're doing ok? X

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First Airbnb guests arrive today from France - so have been busy setting the scene in and around the studio. Clouds have gathered with a chill northerly wind - yikes ! X

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No way! Thought it would be hot & sunny over there! You've probably heard that we're having a heatwave at the moment- glorious. Enjoy your guests- I'm sure it'll be interesting meeting them. Hope your hip's not giving you too much trouble. I might even try 3x 1000mcg of vit C spaced throughout the day to see if I can get a night's sleep. X

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VitC benefits will take their time to emerge ! Maybe have all your hormones checked and if it's not that then test the adrenals. I have read that we become oestrogen dominant when Hypo - so some progesterone cream could be the answer. Serenity by Wellsprings could be worth looking at on-line. Have a read and see what you think ...

I was awake for hours during the night - before Hashimotos diagnosis at 59 - back in 2005. Great time for doing Greek homework and ironing Egyptian Cotton in the cool !! I found it better to be up and doing rather than tossing and turning. I found once I was on a good level of medication I slept better. Now just the hip and cramps wake me ! - and I still occasionally have a bad night :-(

Yes I love meeting new people from all over - we have so much to share ....

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You beat me to it! I've just replied below about considering natural progesterone as Heloise had mentioned it. My functional nutritionist said she suspected I was oestrogen dominant. Is it something I could introduce before I've managed to start some T3 do you think?

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I saw Dr Peatfield in the UK at the beginning of my journey - he suggested Serenity and I did follow it through. As always it was difficult to know what was working well as so much going on - with T4/T3 - supplements - diet etc. So do read the website and get a feel - maybe it will resonate with you. They also do a combined cream now I believe.

You could ask the question of Wellsprings - who make Serenity - about starting it before T3. Cannot imagine it would do you any harm - and of course may do some good ! Living in Crete has taught me to try things without fear which for many can be difficult.

Have just received a book I ordered - and cannot put it down - The Sacred Science ! All about going beyond fear :-) - and the work of Shamans in the Andes. Once watched a programme about it - so keen to learn more :-)

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Don't know if this makes a difference but I guess every little bit helps. I've been taking Vit C 1000mg quite a while. Last year I had a surgeon who I think is top of the line suggest that I take the C twice a day-500mg at a time. As excess Vit C is 'peed' out it makes sense more will stay in the body if spread out thru the day. So that's what I do. When excess Vit C is lost thru urine, the urine is a very clear yellow so you know some is being wasted.

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Thanks for that! I like the Solgar 1000mcg capsules with 250 in a bottle so have a few to get through but it's a good idea to order 500mcg ones next time 😃

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I wake up at 3 am daily - like clockwork. I just need to pee.

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Yes, I have been experiencing the same symptoms. I had my last period in late January. Before that, they were like clockwork; then, they just stopped and have not come back since. I am 49. I know it's unlikely they will come back, but I know that you have to be without your period for 12 months before you are officially menopausal. Keeping my fingers crossed...!

It turned out I needed low-dose estradiol patches (Estradot, 25 mg) to rid me of these symptoms. Before I was put on them, I would wake up several times every night, drenched in sweat. It was terrible never getting a whole night of restful sleep.

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Thanks Hidden- 1969 was a good year! I'm 49 too. Let's hope we're through this before too long.

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...my second daughter also born in 69 - so yes a good year. She suffered thyroid cancer followed by leg tumours - has had the all clear for her thyroid but still has body scans for the chondroid tumours. She is very brave 😊 Her GP ignored all tests and scans done here and insisted on doing his own - twice. Of course she was told your thyroid is fine. She eventually went Private and her cancer was found. I have often thought the delay caused further tumours .... It possibly explains my presence here in an attempt to spread the word 😊 and hopefully help others ....

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So much suffering, Marz. You need a big hug xx

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Hi im 48 and have suffered like you have on and off for 3 years-it has recentley started again-3 nights ago, every time i turn in my sleep it wakes me up, burning hot flush from head to toe for at least 5 mins and then freezing cold, that is how it goes on through the night until around 5am-mine usually last around 4 weeks and then trail off until a few months later😊 i checked mine out around 3 years ago and gp said you are going through peri menopause-also had the blood test to confirm it.

I will be so glad when all this period business has been and gone for good.😊😊

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Yes I completely agree- you've described pretty much what happens to me. Have you considered natural progesterone cream? Heloise suggested it but I haven't pursued that option yet as still trying to sort my thyroid out and don't want to do too much at once.

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Hi again😊i haven't tried anything as like you im still trying to sort out my thyroid and anemia and celiac so i tend to just get on with the hot flushes etc as i know they will die down very soon though so i soilder on, i know lack of sleep is tiring especially if you have work but at the moment im still off work with my other problems so sometimes i will have a little sleep in the day if needs be.😴

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Kipsy, I know it's hard to take advice unless you are CONVINCED it's good advice for you. Here is a bit more persuasion if you read the first paragraph.

raypeat.com/articles/articl...

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You're such a help! I guess the only thing stopping me is that two GP friends insist that replacing oestrogen is what everyone should do and it's that old fear that maybe they're right...

Years ago a homeopath prescribed me some progesterone cream made from yams. I can't remember why- I'd gone to her with adult acne which had suddenly appeared out of nowhere.

When I read your link, the bit about needing progesterone for a healthy pregnancy really resonated with me- both my children didn't grow properly when I was pregnant (I had the tiniest bump even at 7 months) and were delivered early as the doctors felt they were better out than in! Maybe I've always been deficient! Thank you- I'm seriously thinking of ordering some & will keep you updated. The symptoms had been alleviated by a supplement called Equifem which a functional nutritionist put me on. However, it contains iodine and I have Hashis so I felt uncomfortable taking it & have stopped. The symptoms have returned!

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I do understand, Kipsy, and it's such a muddle. We've had these wonderful summits by alternative or functional doctors who look at the research. Doctors have avoided the whole area of nutrition so how can they connect the dots. Have you watched any of the videos I've posted by John Bergman on healing thyroid or David Clark's 20 Reasons for Low Thyroid? These are on you tube. I think the acne comes about when testosterone is elevated. When estrogen is high it interferes with thyroid hormone because they both use the same carrier so estrogen dominance is a problem. You also get estrogen from nuts and seeds and from the pesticides used in agriculture. The adrenals also rob progesterone when necessary.

I looked up Equi-fem. I do like Biotics Research products and good to see it has molybdenum and lots of vitamin A. I'm not usually a fan of multi vitamins but this looks good. I wouldn't be fearful of that little bit of iodine. It helps evict bromides and chlorine and if you get fluoride in anything (they put it in U.S. water). It may also be contained in any bottled drink you may buy.

It is sad that there is such trial and error involved but we have so many side issues when it comes to determining what will work. I do think your body tries to give you messages. Keep listening, keep learning.

Optimal labs include female hormones from STTM: stopthethyroidmadness.com/l...

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You are so informed! Thank you so much. I'm delighted you didn't throw your hands up on horror at the Equifem as I'm thinking about going back on them. They did balance me out after a month or so of taking them. For the moment, I've ordered some sage tablets and will give those a go for a month then maybe progesterone or the Equifem.

I haven't watched the latter person you mention but I enjoyed the first one when you posted about it a while ago.

As ever, am very grateful to you for your knowledge.

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You are so welcome, Kipsy. I'm convinced we have to be our own personal physician to some extent. Good health to you!

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Thank you! And good health to you too!

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Ah ha! Another lightbulb moment...your post on one of The Broken Brain episodes mentions a little chap being given progesterone for inflammation after a horrid accident. I started to develop RA recently...

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Right, I had forgotten about that. Are you convinced yet? I actually told my sons to consider it because they also can have too much estrogen.

Enzymes are my new interest. If you are interested and have lots of time on your hands, lol. It's funny how everyone says they are too busy and I feel like I have loads of time. I must be doing something wrong. Anyway William Wong has interesting comments about enzymes and hormones. He's done research and made up his own formula. So have Jon Barron. I haven't gone so far as those but tried others. Suzy Cohen makes a thyroid supplement that includes a few enzymes. Enzymes can be very effective. I had a post about those as well.

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Hi. I’m pretty sure I’ve been on one or two things with enzymes in that my functional nutritionist recommended. I’ve followed so many of her protocols over the last 12 months though that I’ve forgotten so many of them! Still thinking about progesterone but definitely not dismissing the idea. Thanks x

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It may be worth asking your GP friends to point you in the direction of any research about Oestrogen being needed. Radd posts very well about oestrogen etc. - maybe look up some of her posts 😊 She is not often around these days ....

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Thank you, Marz. I will do on both counts. For now, I've ordered some sage tablets and thinking seriously about progesterone but one thing at a time...you're a great help as always.

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Sometimes we feel better when doing positive things like ordering sage ! I have just cleared our living space for yoga in the morning - that too feels positive 😊

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Absolutely! Also very satisfying to be taking action. Enjoy your yoga- I shall think of you when I'm dog walking in the early morning.

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I had a total hysterectomy at 58 so went thru M. all at once. I was hot for almost a year-so much so-that I had small desk fans I kept on all the time at work even in winter. Went through those fans like the Indians thru Custer's men!. Glad it's over (74 now). 😊

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Oh you poor thing! Very glad it's over for you- this whole heat intolerance (combined with freezing hands & feet in the daytime due to hypo) started intermittently two years ago but it's definitely worse now as it's every night. Hoping it will be over soon!!

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Hope it ends soon for you too. A cheery note. Once you're on the other side life is good again. No more cramps etc.😀

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Hello there it's awful what us ladies have to endure, it must have been 2 years ago that i was going through similar aswell with my desk fans on at work and that was in the winter too but it was quite nice when everyone else was freezing cold and i was strutting around in a shirt sleeved dress.The days my periods stop i will be dancing around and burning the sanitrary protection🌟🌟

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And break out the chanpagne!. Like burning our bras in the 60's. LOL🐱🐢✌

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I have been exactly the same for last 2 years. Originally thought it could be menopause( had hysterectomy so have no clue) but no other symptoms so have put it down to my AI diseases. Still get it now. I have just got used to it and decided like everything else I just have to work( or rather sleep/not sleep and freeze/boil around it 🤷‍♀️

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Yes I don't get any other menopause symptoms. The hot flushes after a cuppa or spicy food have stopped but this wretched sleep thing is an absolute bore. I can't get up in the night as we have a puppy who barks the house down if I go downstairs and hubby gets up at 5.30am for work every day so needs his sleep! So interesting that so many of us get it- it really helps to know I'm not the only one!

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I have this every night test your adrenals I kept thinking it was menopause my saliva test showed very low DHEA and cortisol so I'm thinking it's.probaby that Doc has told.me I'm post menopause but I'm.seriously wondering if all.due to my flat lining DHEA?? How can I make sex hormones with no DHEA?

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Thanks Claire. I had them tested a year ago, along with DHEA. Think the results were ok and haven’t been working so not stressed but it’s worth considering again. Thanks!! X

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Claire- do these results mean anything to you? They were done last June.

Cortisol

Sample 1: 8.11 (2.68-9.30)

Sample 2: 1.38 (0.75-2.93)

Sample 3: 1.21 (0.36- 1.88)

Sample 4: 0.47 (<0.94)

DHEA Sample 1 (am) 0.36 (0.25-2.22)

DHEA: Cortisol ratio 0.04 L (0.05-0.32)

Secretory IgA 136 (56-212)

You sound like you know more about this kind of thing than I do!

Thanks for any light you can shed!

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Hi Kipsy I'm afraid I'm a complete novice when it comes to adrenals? I only tested mine on the advice of seaside Susie and glad I did as seems I have issues there? Maybe make a new post with these results? They look ok to me? All in range except the ratio? My doctor didn't even know what DHEA is which is worrying as mine is way way low as is my cortisol? I have been reading that correcting thyroid hormones before sorting adrenals can stress the adrenals even more ? Looks like mine are shot? Doctor has done a blood test but I've not got the results yet? I work but don't have stress in my life I think hashimotos is stress enough to wipe out the adrenals? And of course I used to love running so think I've caused problems with physical stress rather than emotional stress? I am going to consider HRT I feel way to you to be post menopause :-(

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Thanks Claire- I'm sorry you're having such a tough time. I know how active you used to be! Although the functional nutritionist I used is not aware of as much thyroid stuff as I'd like, she might be able to help you with adrenals or at least give you some pointers. Her names Jo Gamble embracingnutrition.co.uk & she does Skype. If you get desperate, maybe she can help. She ordered my Genova tests.

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Thanks Kipsy once my blood tests are back from GP I will make some decisions about what I need to do?

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Good luck & keep us posted x

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Invest in a pure silk satin sheet and pillowcase..and a very thin duvet. I still wake up boiling hot quite often - it's not the same as when I had hot flushes. Hubby and I have different weight duvets on our bed. I am on HRT fem 7 conti patches and Levo and T3 but suspect I'm probably undermedicated. Good luck.

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Thank you- have got the silk pillowcases and they help a bit although I sometimes have to put a frozen hot water bottle under the pillow so that when I turn the pillow over, it's cold enough. Yes, separate duvets help too. Not sure I've got the funds for silk sheets but will do some research. Thank you!

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