Thyroid UK
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DOCTORS PAID TO KEEP YOU ILL?

DOCTORS PAID TO KEEP YOU ILL?

Doctors are being FINANCIALLY INCENTIVISED to STOP YOUR T3 Thyroid Medication.

This is a REAL example of one CCG’s “Prescribing Quality and Savings Incentive Scheme“ which urges Doctors to stop your Liothyronine and move you to T4 Levothyroxine Monotherapy.

Disagree with this? FILL IN THE NHS Consultation Survey ASAP! Only 9 days left to have your say! 👇🏼

engage.england.nhs.uk/consu...

SIGN THE ITT PETITION NOW! 👇🏼

change.org/p/itt-campaign-g...

(Content Courtesy of ITT Facebook Page)

EDITED: To include FULL DOCUMENT link:

norwichccg.nhs.uk/publicati...

128 Replies
oldestnewest

Every time I re-read this it makes me even more mad GRRRRR

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I've been saying this for ages! Thanks for providing the actual 'proof'. For 10p a Doc will actually endanger people's health and wellbeing..? Whatever happened to "first, do no harm!..??? This is going to cost the NHS a fortune, and won't/can't save money either in the short or long term! It'll waste a lot of medications in the process of endangering patient's health and even increased demands for medical appointments from people who the alternative drugs make ill. Total Madness..!

Sorry Pamela. ❤️️ I more than understand and appreciate the problem re T3, which is totally disgusting, I didn't make it clear that I understood the point of your Post. B xx

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Completely agree. It’s madness to attach only 10p to it. Is that what our health is worth?

But I guess like most incentive programs there’s lots of meds with lots of earnings attached. They all add up in the end.

For me it’s not about the money. It’s the fact they’re targeting doctors on the removal of T3 from patients full stop.

The addition of a financial incentive only corrupts it even more - people will be aiming to achieve a performance target rather than focus on what the patient needs.

It’s all kinds of wrong.

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I don't think it is 10 pence, but 10 points - points mean prizes, I mean funding

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It’s 10pence ... full document is available in the bottom link in the main post xxx

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so ironic they will pay 600+/pcm for 30 pills but value it at .10p!!!

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Joydot,

10p per patient is the incentive (bribe) to the GP practice for switching patients from Liothyronine to Levothyroxine. The incentive will be paid out of the monthly saving the CCG makes between the cost of Liothyronine at £258+ for 28 x 20mcg tablets and the cost of Levothyroxine <£3 for 28 tablets.

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Personally I think all CCGs should go the same way as the PCTS did. That would save a fortune.

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Hi, thanks for sharing this. I have now read the full consultation, put forward my views and signed and shared the petition. This should not come to money. I would urge every thyroid sufferer to do the same thing as for some lucky people Levi alone works .... but not always forever as I know from personal experience over 22 years.

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Thank you so much xx

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I signed the CCG thing and said it was direct discrimination, 90% of thyroid patients are women.

We all know this is about money they will put every one of us on antidepressants and say it's all in our heads because it's cheaper.

Honestly we'd be better with our own mass lottery syndicate. Win big and open our own treatment centres.

It's a world gone mad. If I can't get my meds I can't work and I cost the state benefits. If I get my meds, I earn £120,000 and pay over £50,000 tax.

Just give us our medication and let us go back to work

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Exactly I've been on and off work for the last 22yrs because of this kept telling my doctors I'm over and under active no one believed me until I moved to Birmingham and told a doctor here and he did the bloods and finally referred me to Queens Elizabeths hospital but the waiting time for appointments is crazy my appointment has been changed 5times. I give up and try and find ulternatve medication. Natural remedies.

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i too moved to Birmingham for Queen Elizabeth hospital in 2006. The professor of endocrinology nearly killed me. Good luck!

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Lol hopefully I will get some one different can you remember his/her name so I can avoid them. Lol

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He moved to Leeds a couple of years ago - not sure if I'm allowed to say his name. However since 2006 I have only seen one excellent endo there in 2014 and now he's moved to Oxford. You may have more luck than me but please don't hold your breath.

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That's always the case the good ones always move away! When I was in Coventry I had a gp he was excellent he got all the tests done for me ct scans xrays everything but he moved aboard. But the doctor here in Birmingham is good so far he's referred me to q.e. so I hope I get some one good. Appointments in December now.

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Following my own research of Levothyroxin fillers,I am looking at changing over to NDT. Here in Scotland, the nhs don't seem to acknowledge NDT therefore I am locating a private doctor for a prescription to send to England. I am fed up with the negative response from doctors and their shouting behaviour. I m leaving Scotland anyway!

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One must think out of the square!! I also will look at changing my Dr from Scotland to England. Soon it'll be Republic of Ireland to move!

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Yes!!! Natural remedies is my search!!! I am so fed up with taking ANY medication what so ever! I don't take meds, and never had to up until February of 2011!

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I said similar.

Unfortunately the only other product I know about is gluten free foods and as I'm aware that some disadvantaged girls can't afford sanitary production I linked the two together.

I pointed out that they are clearly not paying attention to the Equalities and Health Inequalities when making their decisions but finance, and in the longer term it will cost the NHS more in emergency emissions.

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i am also/ and HAVE always been writing all these things and sending to my own mp and to jeremy hunt even before jeremy hunt was the health minister-----one day when i was traisping up t o barts hospitial getting nowhere- i came across a large cardboard notice which someone had tied around the the lampost- in the middle of a busy london street, it was uneven like ithad been ripped from a box,,

and the writing quite scribbled so i would imagin e the poor person who wrote the notice was quite ill and sruggling but it named aand shamed a doctor who was suposed to betreating him for something-- i would suggestthat evrybody continualy write if you can with al the unjust health/low mney ie sanitary towels to newspspers, they love scandal-- mps and parliament. they are need bombarding. permenantly

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“They will put every one of us on antidepressants and say it is all in our heads because it’s cheaper...”

And the antidepressants are probably only cheaper because of OTHER financial incentives from the companies that make them!! The whole system is so corrupt!!!!

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You can either make a drug really expensive then the NHS won't prescribe it or you can make it at a certain price point where the NHS can be conned into prescribing it for everyone if there is enough research. Even better if it is medicine for an organ that you can't definitively research, that way other scientists can't accuse you of hiding data.

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This document needs copying and pasting to our MPs.......its disgraceful that cost comes before health.

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i am copyingand pastingthis to my MP i am furious!!!!! allyour comments are going too so if you want to delete yours tell me and i willdelete it but they should read them all!

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If you really want comments about it then visit this link which is the ITT POST where the info originated from when I posted it there!

There are over 190 comment on it from VERY angry people!

facebook.com/ITTCampaign/po...

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it has been sent to my mp and the facebook page as well.

RT Hon Mark Francois

Dear Mark. PLEASE FORWARD TO JEREMY HUNT. THANKYOU Mark.

Jeremy Hunt---- i am disgusted at this proof here. These people on this

forum are not going to let this lie- we need T3--- I need t3-i dont function

without it. Paying doctors to stop it, is killing people off, stopping them

working stopping their PIP payments and pushing people to commit suicide.

God knows i was there before i had t3.

Click open the link and see for yourself what doctors are being paid to stop

our T3 thyroid meds. Some people cannot convert the levothyroxine T4 to

active t3 so we have to have t3-big pharma are charging an arm and leg for

it and now it is being stopped it is NOT ACCEPTABLE.

it HAS BEEN SENT!!!!!!!!!!

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Well done I spoke to my doctor on Monday and he said hospital will give it to me then I will continue. When I get my next appointment at q.e I will push my Dr to give me t3 I know what my body needs feeling cold is killing me if I didn't feel cold I'd be ok. So fed up.

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.10p!!!

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Right, so basically instead of getting the medical help that I need to improve health, I am getting a death sentence!!!

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Well done for bringing this to light.

It was only yesterday my doctor rang to say they would not be giving me t3 as it has been proved to be unstable. I protested, apparently she is contacting the endocrinologist to see if he will allow me to continue!

Is said I bet it's the cost which she denied......do they think we are stupid!!

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If you have initially seen NHS endocrinologist and been prescribed Liothyronine (through GP) it should NOT be stopped by CCG. You have clinical need confirmed by specialist.

This was confirmed by Graham Jackson at the London NHS England consultation

nhscc.org/about-us/whos-who...

Write to your MP too

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Never seen an endocrinologist my own doctor who has now

Left the practice authorised t3 about three years ago.

Thanks for your help. Lots of good information provided from you good people

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The answer to that is : yes, they do!

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My pleasure xx Glad you found it useful x

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I think Michael Moseley could usefully devote a whole TV programme to the subject of T3 withdrawal and the appalling debacle. He touched on it in one of his recent documentaries. He is a producer as well as presenter so holds a certain amount of power when it comes to commissioning. Though perhaps he would see it as a step too far?

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Perhaps we should all contact the show, bombard them with individual accounts of how T3 has helped, the battle to get it......only for it then to be taken away due to combination of corporate greed and medical bigotry in the face of increasing clear scientific evidence that T4 monotherapy leaves many patients hypo.

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I'm definitely game for that all my life I've battled and suffered had enough. I'm hypo and hypa with graves disease. If need to get in touch <email address deleted>

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Yazz1,

I have deleted your email address for your own safety. If members want to contact you off forum they can use private messages to contact you.

To read a private message: support.healthunlocked.com/...

To send a private message: support.healthunlocked.com/...

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Ok thank you

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@AmandaK

I have sent him (DrMM) a message via Twitter it went ok hopefully he will read it and act

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I’ve tweeted him too xx

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Oh my god! I knew there was something but that's shocking!

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What is the world coming to? Why are hypothyroid suffers being targeted?

T3 stopped and NDT becoming impossible to pay for despite being perfectly legal to purchase for personal use.

This naked yet underhand move to force everyone on to T4 even if it makes us poorly/unable to work/needing a list of medicines as long as your arm to try and redress the worst symptoms of simply being undermedicated and lacking adequate T3 that a couple of NDT tablets daily can right (in my case) no amount of protest, campaigns, letters to MPs etc seems to make one blind bit of difference in fact it seems to have brought all this persecution to a head. It is a great injustice about which we seem powerless to redress. It is all very depressing.

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Does this mean 10p a month (which is usually how it is prescribed) or 10p a one off? I would suggest if the GP is so much in need of that 10p I would offer them 20p to keep prescribing it lol. What happens if a non thyroid patient comes to the doctor with say a bad infection, does the doctor collect 10p because they only needed to prescribe an antibiotic and did not prescribe T3 ;) Doctors should be paid for curing a patient, or giving them the best quality of life. By doing that the patient will end up being less a drain on the NHS and money will be saved that way.

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10p per patient!

They are targeted to get 4 patients in any of the categories of meds switched and they make 40p per patient switched x

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It's disgusting. Denying the role of t3 in thyroid health is like denying the world is round! This will all go down in history. Pharma and NHS corruption, negligent treatment. Persecution. What a pathetic medical model we have.

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Human Rights abuse in fact

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Which CCG?

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Norfolk's but suspect there's a lot more ccgs doing this.

What happened to first do no harm! Our lives worth so little

I wish they had thyroid Desease and needed t3 bet it wouldn't be on list for deprescribing then

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Norwich x

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Total corruption and the deeper you go down the rabbit hole the darker and deeper it gets! Millions of people have been harmed by statins all because doctors were incentivised and still are! Also antidepressants are incentivised! But when it comes to B12 injections or thyroid medication we have to go into battle.

Big pharma are in control!

The biggest money spinner for doctors are vaccinations, they are paid for each one and then receive a bonus for teaching a certain target percentage of the total patients.

Flu jab = £19.80 read the patient information leaflet!

F O L L O W

T H E

M O N E Y

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This one, exactly! Same in America where if pediatricians can get certain "compliance" vaccinations on time every time they get $500 plus bonuses!

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USA paediatricians have said that vaccinations can bring in $70,000 a year which is why, tragically they turn patients away who choose not to vaccinate. Who on earth have paediatricians? They seem to be just vaccine sales people!

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Exactly. Thank you!

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Yes! Have you noticed how they are pushing the flu jab this year?

I keep getting texts from my GP for myself and my kids to sign up for a free jab.

Then I read the other day in the news that they’re expecting this to be a particularly bad flu season. Probably the vaccine makers are releasing these “bad” flu bugs themselves, just to sell more vaccines!

Pure evil.

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ohyes- i managed to get 11 loadingdoses of b12- each time i go-- have you had the flu jab? advertised in the street on the walls in the chemists--- germ warfare at its best

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There are even more texts this year because Tesco and Boots are taking some of their business away from them!

Yes look up in the sky at the chemtrails, then what they spray on crops, what they put in the water! It’s good that more people are waking up but will there be enough people lucid enough to put a stop to this in time?

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Lucid enough — probably not!

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Thought my head was going to implode when I first saw this.

So important to fill in survey. It's a bit complicated but the ITT Formal Response will help answer questions.

Then please sign the petition!!😀

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Well said Chippysue - and every time the Government pours a few more million into the NHS - where does it go, into the pockets of Big pharma and bonuses for GP's. This information should be in the public domain, its nothing short of a national scandal and worst of all the majority of people are totally unaware.

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I know ThyroidUK shared it on Facebook and I've given it a public share on there too! I suggest everyone with a FB account goes and does the same. Make sure you share to 'Public' not just 'Friends'... And Twitter! Get it out there and cause a public storm!

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I wonder if Billy Kenber from The Times would be interested in this new twist. He broke the story about Concordia extortion last year.

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I’ve tweeted him and he replied to me today. I’ve sent him the details and link to the full document x

Which is here incidentally:

norwichccg.nhs.uk/publicati...

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Fantastic. There is so much momentum on our side 😊👍

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Hooray for you!

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where can this information be found please so that it can downloaded and hard copies made. I notice other medication is also targeted. 10 pence seems a small amount, was wondering is this a one off?

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Here’s the full document link:

norwichccg.nhs.uk/publicati...

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Bless you and thank you - will forward it on to others. How far we have fallen to reach these depths of corruption.

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You’re welcome x

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This post is still being 'liked'. Have read through it again, OMG it is so incredibly depressing

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I think the reason for this is definitely money - but through an indirect route. I think they know very well that T3 helps most people, but if our thyroid is working well all the knock on problems like digestion issues, exhaustion, weight gain, (possibly leading to Diabetes), chronic pain, foggy head and more, followed by depression, (because of all these genuine issues), is now, if not entirely gone, severely depleted, thus removing the need to visit the GP and him or her prescribing lots of ghastly drugs. Big Pharma needs and loves us to be ill of course, not help us in the slightest, but simply make people feel more ill and helpless. Then when rock bottom is hit they are told it's all in their heads because the 'blood test' says they are just fine. It's always been this way and I know I'm sounding negative, but it's simply not in their financial interest for us to be fit and well - on only one medication.....

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Thats exactly whats happening in italy too! My doctor never want to test my vitamin level, neither the t3 levels, he only wrote on the rx paper to do the TSH test (and other minor important test) because for him i dont have a problem and if nothing shows up in the results i have to go to a psicologist

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Why 60%? That sounds like a nice round number. It indicates acceptance that the other 40% still require T3, but how is the differentiation assessed? Does any one work in the NHS and could find out how these figures are worked out?

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As with anything 60% is the minimum target.

They’ll work it out like any company does with incentive schemes .... % switched to Levo = total saved £ in annual budget spend!

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Where exactly does that document come from? Have we got the entire document available?

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Thank you.

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pamela how did you manage to get this? iam furious reading that lio is no better then levo...

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I have my sources 😉 lol x

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This fraud is also very prevalent with so called cancer drugs. The whole "medical industry" is basically legalised Organised Crime.

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How on earth did you find this?

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We have it sources Haha!

Here’s the full link:

norwichccg.nhs.uk/publicati...

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For anyone wanting the FULL DOCUMENT, here it is:

norwichccg.nhs.uk/publicati...

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Finally managed to get GP to refer me to endo, but not because of thyroid (that's fine!!!!! not) but because cortisol is very high. Saw him 2 days ago, but when I said I'd noticed that my cortisol goes up when my T3 is low (i,e not taking T3 I bought online) but comes down when it's above bottom of the range (when I am), he immediately said "you can't have T3 on NHS". When I said that this was under consideration he said that he didn't know about other areas, but there's no chance whatsoever of it be prescribed here: Staffordshire.

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Hope you’ve written to the Health Board or CCG as well as your GP Practice Manager or Endocrine Department Head to dispute the claim?

And your MP too! X

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Not yet, but I'm about to.

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how on earth did you find that damning eveidence - this page, if you people dont mind, i am sending the whole lot and your comments to my MP to send to Jeremy HUNT it is DISGRACEFUL!

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I know a man who knows a man 😉 hehe xx

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i have had a field day with the survey on liothyroine herbaL/ homeoathy- i will NOT BE LIKED VERY MUCH HEY HO! i hope they read it probably i told them to read dr michael mosley on t3!!!!!!!

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i cant find the survey i am furious

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The survey link is in the main post x

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Here it is just incase. Click it and scroll down a wee bit x

engage.england.nhs.uk/consu...

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You all can follow ITT and the original post for this and you can like the page for more documents and scandals like this one using the following link:

facebook.com/ITTCampaign/po...

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i HAVE SENT THIS PAGE AND THE FACEBOOK PAGE to my MP to send to jeremy Hunt BUT everyone should be doing it-please dont just complain onhere we need to make a stink and send it every MP. i posted my grouse below- it has been sent already please do the same

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I have. And many others have too. It’s why ITT campaign exists. And same with the Thyroid UK T3 campaign.

We’ve been giving out template letters for people to send.

We’ve had 3 articles published in national newspapers.

We have 25000 signatures on our petition.

Trust me. We are shouting loud.

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Pamela that is good thankyou so much.

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I wonder if the pharmaceutical companies make donations to political parties, and if politicians have shares in the companies?

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Would you be surprised to learn that Concordia who until recently was the single only T3 supplier in the UK donates regularly to the BTA and BTF?

Now ask yourself why the BTF aren’t out slamming Concordia for shocker prices on T3 ........ hmmmmmmmm

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i have printed off the picture but it has come out full page and leftoff the reviews of liothyonine-- can any one make it smaller so i can copy n paste it please

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The full document can be seen using the link at the bottom of the main post. You can print the whole thing!

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10p? The going rate used to be 40 pieces of silver.

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This is the real world we live in today. And it is up to us to change when United together.

However, in the mean time you have a choice to buy your own t3 from abroad and improve your health as I am doing since last 10 years. And even including customs & VAT charge paid t3 can be imported from abroad at much lower cost than buying in UK or Europe.

We buy many other items eg clothes, shoes, mobile phones, TV etc made in China or Korea etc.

Be positive, get better and continue fighting NHS & System together without getting angry. Anger cost thyroid sufferers very dear in valuable lost energy.

One day I intend to see imported t3 of good quality available in UK to all those who do not have knowledge for importing from abroad.

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I get mine on the NHS and it’s imported from America!

It’s possible.

We just need to push for it ... peacefully but strongly! X

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I've been buying my Thyroid meds successfully from abroad for about the last 15 years since my private doc retired. Trouble is it's now virtually impossible to get any T3 past Feb 18, I've been spending most of this week on it and trying to avoid losing another load of money. £118 already well and truly down the pan to the Greek site.... I've got a few months left and that's it.... :-(

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restartmed.com/t3-medication/

so stick that where the sun dont shine.....

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You should join the following group in Facebook and make use of the library of evidence to support T3 that we already have on file.

We have LOTS of it!

m.facebook.com/groups/47337...

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pamela i am on a close dpage for lyme but i don tuse facebook i know its sad but i dontknow how to or ho wto keep my privacy there- the instructions are too complicated for my fuzz brain.

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So pleased this has been exposed! :)

If you scroll down to the bottom of the document where they discuss their 'Rationale' in detail and see the pittance ( in relative terms ) they claim they save by doing this compared to the havoc and downright harm caused to patients lives it makes me sick! They claim from this report their estimated saving per annum would be £58.000

SMH!!

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i posted this on a facebook TYPE of community forum. you should see thebacklash i got-- quote-- we are not doctors, and if i was given this i would be worried- look at the side effects and they had printed drugs. com liothyroine- another said doctors -do not do this- do not accuse

doctors ( one of them has a doctor son) it went on- if you don ttrust yourdoctor on this don t use him- another said liothyroinne is no better than levo- and one sister was treated at a specialist clinic- so she knew what she was talking about even though i said i had

aproblemconverting t4 to t`3- i think they eother dont read or do read and ignore it totally - i wa s tearing out the last of my few strands. and they kept repeating the crap-- i am evenmore angry now

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I wish they’d see this isn’t an attack at the NHS or the doctors within it. It’s in their defence! They shouldn’t be targeted to remove a drug where there is no alternative (and they can say T4 Levothyroxine is the same all they want - it’s NOT).

It’s a dig at the people behind the money wheel. It’s not to scorn an already underfunded NHS.

I really wish people would get that!

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i knoe pam but they are thick and arrogant and havent read whati have posted. it i s infuriating

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this is actually crazy... they are 2 diff medications for different problems!!! all that crisis for 10p! how stupid are gp's and endo's? any endo who agrees to this should immediately have their license yanked - lets start publically naming and shaming as nothing else is going to work. lets put together a site and call it something like 'licensed doctors and specialists who do not have a basic grasp of essential health facts'

as i am no longer literate in tech stuff we should make a pooled skills group without delay. any interest?

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you bet!

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Joydot,

Your anger would be better directed at the CCGs, Health Authorities and perhaps NHS England, NHS Wales, NHS Northern Ireland and NHS Scotland who make the decisions and instruct endocrinologists and GPs not to prescribe Liothyronine.

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no. they are untouchable/ impenetrable. your gp cannot lose their job(house)/ doesnt want to be sued every other week. your best voice is theirs - it shouldnt be bottom up but in this case there isnt an option - there are some seriously incompetent people in nhs upper management and their names need outing as well. you have to target their paycheck - nice wont work we have to make it about money

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I am shell shocked.

Too angry and upset for words.

But shared the petition and everyone sharing again.

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Done. Both surveys completed. Thanks for posting this as I'd have missed it otherwise.

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I signed the petition and filled out the survey. Wish we could get more signatures!!

Mollie

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This sort of thing is also going on in the USA. The argument goes like this:

This is one reason why most “natural” treatments in America are now private-pay. The patent-drug-oriented medical care system would like to shutdown naturopaths, chiropractors, and other “alternative” care providers COMPLETELY, if they could. I’ve known about this for years, but don’t know how to do anything about it. The average medical consumer, who wants health insurance, doesn’t understand that their insurance doesn’t cover the style of care that will truly make them well - and (in the longterm) reduce overall medical expense. It makes perfect sense that the patent-drug-oriented medical system doesn’t want to reduce their income. They are similar to the fossil-fuel industry, which also has people addicted to a toxic product.

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ican see natural things up and coming as more and more nhs chemical drugs etc are getting so expensive an dthey are stopping them-what will the drug companies do then? not everyone can afford private all the time

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I can't afford private all the time, too. The problem is, corporate interests and hyper-capitalism have created a healthcare system which DOES NOT WORK for those with even moderately complex conditions. The debate about universal coverage is a hollow exercise because of this.

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I will pay 10p to get it. Pull out the payment box so we all put in 10p and hopefully get our medication. 😠

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Thanks 👍

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Hi. I m new here. patient of hypothyroid from 2 years. Right now taking levothyroxine sodium. Do you guys know about any side effects of this medicine???

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Why have you posted in this thread? Please start your own and include any test results you have. Also have you read the PIL as that will tell you about side effects?

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shes new cinnamon girl and probably has thought that she would add on here. Sunshine18 if you go to the top of page and find Post, ther eyou can start a new thread with your question and welcome to tuk.

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