Waking feeling tense since change of B12

[Sunnysidoop]

Wondering if I should change b12. Since switching to Pascoe hydroxo ampoules from Dr Myhill's hydroxo vial, when I wake in the morning my body is full of tension / tense energy. I feel like I want to have a round on a punch bag to release all the tension and agitation.

Whilst my body is feeling this tense energy my head is feeling tense and tired. I'm too wired to relax into a meditation or yoga nidra.

I'm waking at 5am every day and it's exhausting. I have struggled with my sleep for years. The 5am isn't anything new but this buzzy stressy tension is. If I wake at 4am then I tend to get back to sleep briefly around 6am and I feel much more relaxed for the day instead of burnt out and agitated

[Wwwdot]

Hi Sunnysidoop

I can understand why you feel out of sorts!

What were you taking before the switch? Is it just the source that’s changed or frequency or dose ?

🤗🤗🤗

[Sunnysidoop in reply to Wwwdot]

Thanks. I was taking 0.5ml of hydroxy every day (from Dr Myhill's 30ml vial) which is 1000mcg per ml. Then I changed to the Pascoe 1.5ml ampules, so moved to 1ml EOD to get the same equivalent dose.

I should probably try reducing the dose but reluctant to waste so much of the ampule!

[tomdickharry in reply to Sunnysidoop]

Why worry about that? Most of what you inject is lost via urine within a couple of days.

[Wwwdot in reply to Sunnysidoop]

Hi Sunnysidoop

So before you were taking 0.5 ml which was the equivalent of 0.5 mg (500ug) B12?

And I think you mean the 1500ug B12 Hydroxocobalamin ampules from Pascoe? They are still 1ml but contain 1500ug B12.

If so that’s what I use. So it looks as if the daily dose is now 3 times higher than before even though the liquid volume is only double.  WIZARD6787 is better at these calcs than me as I am used to tonnes!

I would not worry about trying to reduce the dose as B12 is water soluble and you will pee out the excess. Giving your body what it needs is definitely a sound investment and will not be wasted!

I hope to hear of your progress and I know from my experience that when a lot of healing is taking place I am up and down and sleep patterns are disturbed.

🤗🤗🤗

[Sunnysidoop in reply to Wwwdot]

Thanks for taking the time to calculate

I'm only using 1ml of the 1.5ml ampule and chucking the remainder. In doing so hoping that 1000ug EOD would be equivalent to 500ug daily

I'm happy to give my body what it needs but at the moment I'm not coping with how it's affecting me and can't afford to risk further ME / CFS decline or crash :/

[Wwwdot in reply to Sunnysidoop]

Hi Sunnysidoop

That seems a waste! Have you considered taking it all? You can’t overdose and your body may benefit from the extra.

Best of luck.

🤗🤗🤗

[Sunnysidoop in reply to Wwwdot]

I know I'm using insulin syringes which max out at 1ml, haven't worked out how to use different drawing up / injection needles and definitely don't have capacity to this side of Christmas

I've considered filling another syringe and keeping in fridge overnight, which dr myhill advised with her hydroxy as it contains preservatives, but Pascoe doesn't I don't think.

In any case my symptoms are already bad enough that I'm thinking of reducing dose

[Wwwdot in reply to Sunnysidoop]

Bless you it’s hard to weigh up what’s best isn’t it?

Sending you lots of hugs and positive thoughts!

🤗🤗🤗

[Sunnysidoop in reply to Wwwdot]

Thank you 🙏

[Sunnysidoop in reply to Wwwdot]

Thank you I've just realised my ampules are in fact as you descibe, 1500ug in 1ml!! I must gave got mixed up with the language barrier! On apohealth website it doesnt say 1ml and given i fill a needle to 1ml and haveleftovers it made sense it's 1.5ml. in fact now I've measured they seem to contain 1.2ml, according to my needles.

[Wwwdot in reply to Sunnysidoop]

Hi the re are two metrics to this. The amount of liquid and the dose (amount if B12 in the liquid).

The ampules are sold as 1ml but they draw up slightly more at 1.1-1.2 ml.

The dose in the ampule can be 1500ug or 1000ug but the amount of liquid does not change with dose.

It’s like a mental gymnastics.

🤗🤗🤗

[Sunnysidoop in reply to Wwwdot]

It is isn't it?!😱

When the dose in the ampule is given as 1500ug, do you know if that's 1500ug in the 1.1-1.2ml, or 1500ug per ml so that it'd be 1650ug in 1.1ml (I e.1500 + 150)

[Wwwdot in reply to Sunnysidoop]

It’s the dose in the ampule. Forget the volume of liquid but focus on the dose ie 1500ug.

[Sunnysidoop in reply to Wwwdot]

Thanks! Well that's annoying, because if I have a 1ml syringe to draw up the 1ml ampule, I wouldn't get the full 1500ug if it's spread out over 1.2ml 🤯

[Wwwdot in reply to Sunnysidoop]

The syringes are so cheap so perhaps donate the 1ml to charity and get the 2ml ones, then you get the full B12 benefit which is by far the more expensive?

🤗🤗🤗

[Sunnysidoop in reply to Wwwdot]

Oh thanks it's fine, I just mean it's tricky isn't it to juggle things like that.

I use insulin needles and the max is 1ml I think. In any case I seem to be responding better to a lower dose

[Wwwdot in reply to Sunnysidoop]

That’s really great news - I believe it’s the body’s response thats most important. So great you are being guided!

Hope you continue to have success! Delighted!

🤗🤗🤗

[WIZARD6787]

If you check the label I think you will find that the whole vial of Dr Myhill's hydroxo vial contains 1000 mcg which is 1 mg per 30ml.

If you were to inject 1 ml a day of Dr Myhill's hydroxo vial you would be injecting 1 mg a month.

I do not know the concentration of Pascoe hydroxo ampoules. If it is higher than 1 mg per 30ml you may be experiencing symptoms/healing of taking more B12.

[Sunnysidoop in reply to WIZARD6787]

Hi! We've discussed this before the label says 1000mcg per 1ml

[WIZARD6787 in reply to Sunnysidoop]

I knew I had been involved in a discussion. I did not remember it was you. Or that the resolution was the amount listed on the vials you are using is 1000 mcg/1ml

No idea why my vials are 1000 mcg/30 ml. I double checked.

Glad I am a hoarder and did not throw them out🙂

[Sunnysidoop in reply to WIZARD6787]

☺️

How fascinating!

Mine was this one, where I believe it translates "each ml contains..... 1,000mcg"

salesatdrmyhill.co.uk/b12--...

Bottle b12

[WIZARD6787 in reply to Sunnysidoop]

"Hydroxocabalamin 1000 mcg in injectable water."

The above is from their website.

I am not saying you are incorrect. Only that one of us is.

I read it as there is 1000 mcg in the vial.

I sent an email to Dr Myhill's and will let you know the reply in a private message.

[Sunnysidoop in reply to WIZARD6787]

Great idea. Thank you ☺️

[helvella in reply to WIZARD6787]

What the bottle actually says is this:

Formula:

Cada ml contiene 1,000 mcg Acetato de Hidroxocobalamina

Vehiculo c.b.p. 30 ml

c.b.p. = cantidad bastante para = q.s.

The specification of quantum satis for an ingredient essentially means "Add as much of this ingredient as is needed to achieve the desired result, but not more."

My translation is this:

Formula:

Each ml contains: 1000 mcg hydroxocobalamin acetate

Sufficient quantity of the vehicle to make up to 30 ml.

In other words, every millilitre of the contents contains 1,000 micrograms of hydroxocobalamin.

(No - I do not know Spanish and anyone who does is welcome to correct me.)

[WIZARD6787 in reply to helvella]

Excellent, thank you so much!. I was incorrect. I did check with somebody that knows Spanish and they did not pick it up.

[Sunnysidoop in reply to WIZARD6787]

Did you hear back from Dr Myhill's office out of interest?

[WIZARD6787 in reply to Sunnysidoop]

As of yet. You're working with him under that. Did you see helvella's reply

[Orchard33]

I recognise that 3-4am wired feeling. I've had it for the last two years of treatment, the last year EOD SI. It's just starting to improve. And that term you use, burn-out. I relate to that very strongly. The sheer mental and physical struggle of firstly, the long term decline into B12D/PA and then the equally long term recovery after treatment begins is a depleting, exhausting process. And that's before whatever life demands! I've recently acknowledged that I'm burnt out and it has helped me very much to accept that. I will live from that context for a while.

[Sunnysidoop in reply to Orchard33]

Ah that Sounds like it's been such a struggle. Did you test as being deficient? I don't even know if I am so it feels futile sometimes :/

[Orchard33]

Yes. Very deficient at 93. Yes, a struggle but so much to learn.