Let ssp end or agree to dismissal due to capability? Please help.

[Fwizzi]

Hi there, having a really crappy time of things at the moment. Crps sufferer plus other painful conditions. had disc removed from spine then 10 weeks later Had an accident at work which has rebulged a disc and as a result im now awaiting surgery. Work are saying ssp runs out soon so to consider being dismissed due to capability on medical grounds. Claiming this would make it easier to claim esa and also get p45 before Christmas. Then someone else said I should let ssp run out rather than agree to be dismissed. Anyone have any experience with anything like this? Really need some advice as I have never been in a situation like this before. All replies appreciated. Thanks

[Hidden]

Hi I have crps and one or to other things, my ssp was running out so agreed to be finished off I got all my holiday pay and anything they owed me I got my p45 phoned the job centre told them what has happened got esa and put in the surport group that means I don't have to go to the job centre every week. I think u need to sit down with u boss and talk to him about what options there is I hope that helps a bit

[Fwizzi in reply to Hidden]

Hello, thanks for replying to me so quickly, sounds like you had a quite straightforward time with by agreeing to dismissal. Could I ask how long you was on leave for before your dismissal and how long has it been since you were finished, also how long did esa take to come through? Sorry for all the questions, just never been in this situation before and im getting a lot of people saying I shouldn't agree to dismissal but anything other than agreeing seems to drag things out and really don't want to have no income at all over Christmas especially having a child at home who has already had to sacrifice so many things due to my conditions.

[Hidden in reply to Fwizzi]

Hi sorry not not reply be for now it was 2011 when I was finished from my work it was also the company were I also got my crps, it took about 3/4 weeks to get my esa, u need to speak to a lawyer about taking u employers to court for compo I did and I won I got payed out in May this year it was hard case for me because I had 2 companies that were liable

[Fwizzi in reply to Hidden]

Good to hear you were compensated eventually. Hope that you got a decent amount for the trauma you have been through.

[Hidden in reply to Fwizzi]

Yes I did get well compensated,i got crps in my foot from a car crash in 2013 my specialist was going to operate on my foot but then said if I had operated on my foot the crps would have spread up my leg so I told him it's going to spread up my leg any way if not now but some time in the future so now he's looking at amputating my foot, I don't want to loose my foot no amount off money will help me I would be better of dead than live like a freak no left arm and no right foot people would make fun off me. I'm sorry for talking like this but the amount of meds that I'm taking makes me feel like this

[Bevvy]

You need to get proper advice from professionals. Suggest start with CAB.

Gut instinct is don't make things easier for employers. Also if part of problem was caused by accident at work is work liable in some way?

Employment law is complicated so good advise needed.

Of course if you are in a union speak to them.

[Fwizzi in reply to Bevvy]

Hello, thanks for replying to me, yes work will be liable for the accident but I haven't spoken to a solicitor as yet as I want to speak to the neurosurgeon directly before I make any rash decisions. Not part of a union and cant get in with cab for a long time and really need more information asap. Is there any other services you're aware of which may be able to help?'

[sianr in reply to Fwizzi]

Hi there I think there's more to it with you.

1. Did employer know about your medical health ?

2. We're there any work place adjustments put in place?

3.Did you fulfil your duties at work (do your best cos we just get on with it)

4.Did you're line manager allow for any adjustment?

5.Was you're manager aware of your condition pre operation?

6. When you returned to work was there anything put in place to stop further injury or damage ?

7.what was the response of your employer following the accident at work?

8. Was the accident reported following the incident? All accidents must be recorded or it never happened. There is still time for this to be documented .

9. Did you have any witnesses

10.Could this accident of been prevented by said work force?

11. Time to get Unison on board or an employment lawyer as you may be entitled to get it paid for you .

12. Document as much as you can remember, dates , time people on shift , managers who you spoke to , what was said etc.

Don't let them sign you off just yet . Keep your cards close to your chest , get as much info as possible .

Your employers are liable and are hoping you will go quietly . If you have the energy to fight please do. However do not let on that this is your plan.

Speak to citizens advice they may be able to sail you in the right direction.

Good luck SA

[Fwizzi in reply to sianr]

Thanks for your reply. I have spent the last 2 days solidly on the phone to acas, cab, welfare rights, employment law advisory services and anyone else who may be able to help. Yes work were aware of all medical conditions when I went for the job interview, after my surgery there were no risk assessments done nor did I need a fit note before returning. The incident happened in the wash room, one of the managers actually asked why I went into the washroom that I did as everyone knew there were problems with it yet nobody had thought to put a sign up or block it off or anything. I have had oha done and report states there's no adaptations or adjustments that would enable me to return to my job and thats what has lead up to them wanting to dismiss me. I have written the time, date, what happened, how it happened and do have witnesses who are willing to make a statement if necessary.

[Hidden]

Hi hope this helps in just going through the process of being dismissed through capability. I'm at the last stage where my company has agreed I'm not fit to work. If your ssp Has run out and your gp says your still not fit for work you can claim esa as long as you get a certificate.I had to get one every month for 10 months.esa is just under £75 a week.if your gp feels your not fit to work at all. Your better off being dismissed if your ok financially (IE) having a pension. If your 55 or over you can get your pension released at that age,not sure of your situation.

I had been with my company for 25 years. I'm just waiting

[Hidden in reply to Hidden]

Sorry sent it to soon. As I was saying just waiting for a figure of how much I will get monthly from my pension. As someone has already said if your in the union speak to them.my gp was very supportive. But it is a long process.the company I worked for asked if I wanted to go down the route of occupational health.which is what I did.they wrote to my gp for a health report.of which can see before it gets released to who you work for.which u should always do.because you can discuss it with your gp. Depending on what he is like u can ask for more things to be put into it or omitted if you don't think it's a fair assessment. There lots more involved but if you have anymore questions feel free to ask.just send me a private msg

[Fwizzi in reply to Hidden]

Hello, thanks for your reply, I have already been to see occupational health and their report was pretty upsetting to read really. So thats why im considering accepting dismissal as it feels like im just dragging things out. Im not part of a union and cant get in with cab so kinda stuck between a rock and a hard place.

[Sandra2015]

You can get light duties at work, if your employment is difficult. Your employer has a duty to make adjustments for you, where possible. You may also be entitled to PIP/DLA. Contact the DWP? Think very carefully before giving up work? If you are a member of a union, contact your steward, otherwise phone CAB? With warm wishes and I hope that you get sorted.

Take care from a fellow CRPS Type 2 sufferer. X

[Fwizzi in reply to Sandra2015]

Hello, thanks for your reply. No light duties or other positions are available in the company and occupational health report was pretty damming and stated there's no adaptations etc that would help me to continue to work, hence why they're talking about accepting dismissal. Im not part of a union and cant get in with cab so kinda stuck.

[sianr in reply to Sandra2015]

Equality law recognises that bringing about equality for disabled people may mean changing the way in which employment is structured, the removal of physical barriers and/or providing extra support for a disabled worker.

This is the duty to make reasonable adjustments.

The duty to make reasonable adjustments aims to make sure that, as far as is reasonable, a disabled worker has the same access to everything that is involved in doing and keeping a job as a non-disabled person.

When the duty arises, you are under a positive and proactive duty to take steps to remove or reduce or prevent the obstacles a disabled worker or job applicant faces.

You only have to make adjustments where you are aware – or should reasonably be aware – that a worker has a disability.

Many of the adjustments you can make will not be particularly expensive, and you are not required to do more than what is reasonable for you to do. What is reasonable for you to do depends, among other factors, on the size and nature of your organisation.

If, however, you do nothing, and a disabled worker can show that there were barriers you should have identified and reasonable adjustments you could have made, they can bring a claim against you in the Employment Tribunal, and you may be ordered to pay them compensation as well as make the reasonable adjustments.

In particular, the need to make adjustments for an individual worker:

must not be a reason not to promote a worker if they are the best person for the job with the adjustments in place

must not be a reason to dismiss a worker

must be considered in relation to every aspect of a workers job

provided the adjustments are reasonable for you to make.

Many factors will be involved in deciding what adjustments to make and they will depend on individual circumstances. Different people will need different changes, even if they appear to have similar impairments.

It is advisable for you to discuss the adjustments with the disabled worker, otherwise the adjustments may not be effective.

The rest of this section looks at the detail of the duty and gives examples of the sorts of adjustments you could make. It looks at:

[Toplady]

Hi Fwizzi,

I'm in a very similar situation to you as my SSP ran out and my headteacher is now discussing dismissal (I'm a secondary school teacher and just been told that I've probably got CRPS) My main advice about my situation is coming from my Union as employment law and procedures is very complicated. I would say that you need to get real solid advice from someone qualified in these things, do you have access to a union rep? It's such an important decision, you need support. Also, have you applied for PIP? You can claim this even when you're employed, I got it and it's been a real help. I also got ESA once my SSP ran out and am waiting for my assessment with the DWP, get in touch with them or Citizens Advice to find out what you're entitled to.

It's a horrible stressful time so I can understand what you're going through, sending all best wishes X

[Fwizzi in reply to Toplady]

Hello, thanks for your reply. Im not a union member and cant get in with cab. I applied for pip and was refused even though I can barely walk and in constant agony. Currently getting it reviewed but won't hold my breath. Can you apply for esa before your p45 arrives? Im just so worried about being left with absolutely no income apart from child benefit over Christmas.

[Toplady in reply to Fwizzi]

I'm getting Contribution based ESA and I'm still technically employed so I think you can if you qualify, ring the DWP to find out? As for the PIP, I had it straight away but I did make sure that I took along and sent every piece of evidence I could, every letter, scan results etc and they said they couldn't really refuse as there was so much evidence for what I was saying so I'm sure that helped. Hope you get some good news soon x

[Hidden in reply to Toplady]

Hi Toplady. i know this is an old post but I am in a very similar situation. I am a teacher with CRPS. I've been off for 6 months, my HT doesn't communicate any longer with me. Just seen OH, who say I'm still not well enough to return and I should be seen again in Dec. I'm petrified that I'll be dismissed. Wondered where you are up to now. Gentle hugs x

[Toplady in reply to Hidden]

Hi Debbie, sorry to hear that you're in such a tricky situation. I would definately advise that you get in touch with your Union if you haven't already, they were and still are very supportive and helpful with my case. They will be your representative at head teacher meetings and you should have them with you at any meeting, formal or informal. They can then liaise with the education authority if you can't return to work.

My story has developed somewhat since I posted a year ago. I have had to finish teaching, my contract was terminated in March. I am now dependant on ESA and PIP to get by and I won't deny it, it's been very hard. I have been told by my consultants that my condition is permanent and I won't ever be able to go back to teaching. However, I do think that now I've 'accepted' my pain condition and my 'disability', things have improved slightly.

Please make sure you use the union and the support they provide. It's a very scary process and you need them behind you for everything. Keep records, copies of hospital appointments, generally keep a file of everything so you can refer to it when you have meetings or apply for benefits. I applied for and got PIP and when I'd gone down to no pay, I was able to get ESA which helped a bit.

Hope your situation improves, let me know how you get on Xx

[joannie1964]

hi hun your situation sounds really complicated! you have been given some solid advice but please don't accept dismissal at this point. Sounds to me like your employer is looking to get out of this easily. Also I'm not sure if you are dismissed before you make your work injury claim how this might affect things. If your ssp runs out you can claim esa as previously advised while still employed but receiving no pay. This was my situation and eventually I was dismissed on health grounds but granted Ill health retirement. you can make your initial esa claim over the phone and then send in sick notes monthly. Eventually you will be medically assessed to see which group you go into. check out employment at acas.uk. employers have to follow procedure, informal and formal sickness meetings etc. You don't say what type of company you work for but pretty sure all employees are protected irrespective of company size. I know you don't want hassle but you must protect yourself. Iin terms of benefits check out the work and benefits site where they guide you through benefits so well. annual membership £20 atm but think they are offering a discount! also ask your employers for a copy of their sickness policy and get a copy of your contract of employment if you don't have one and DON'T let the pressure you. Feel free to ask anything else.

big hugs

Jo x

[joannie1964]

Ps forgot to say google work related injuries too.

x jo

[donna19]

Hi i had an accident at work 2 and half yrs ago now all their fault still trying to figure out why im suffereing had bad whiplash my osteopath says he swears i have crps like yourself but trying to get dr to agree is murder i am still under pain clinic and on morphine drugs and all sorts . I have been told as i worked in a warehouse i wont be able to do manual work again so i was placed in an office a yr ago now to help out but as a transport clerk thos is all under capability the only difference is i have been work you havent . Capability is a very long legal process to go down if you were on the mend and something happened that was not your fault surely they have to help you . O know its fine for me to say i should practice what i preach dont worry . Go seek advice from citizens advice or look up the disability act as if you are ill with a problem physical or mental for 12 months or more you are covered by that . Hope this helps xx

[Fwizzi in reply to donna19]

Thanks for your reply. Have you sought legal advice about your accident? Sounds like you could be due some compensation, not that money can ease your pain but it could help with private treatment or something else. I will look into the disability act. I have tried contacting an employment solicitor to try and get some clarification but just keep getting voicemail so just waiting for a reply from one of them.

[donna19 in reply to Fwizzi]

Hi sorry for late reply i have a union involved hun everyday we are all hoping this is not going to be like yesterday with the pain . I do hope you get sorted soon and some advice that opens up a door to make things easier for you its stressfull knowing others have control over your life x let us know if you have joy with the disability act take care xx

[littleeffie]

Strongly suggest you speak to solicitor asap as better to show ,if it came to a compensation fight,that you felt they were liable before leaving work as it maybe seen as an afterthought due to income drop if you leave it til later.The solicitor will be able to advise you on both compensation and sickness benefit route to take as a big desicion now will impact you and your child for years to come.I believe that taking the incorrect job end route can in fact shut you out of certain benefits later so you don't want to regret any desicion next Christmas.

I hope you get a good resolution financially and some relief and help health wise.

Take care and kind thoughts sent your way.

[donna19]

Hi i have the union solicitor sorting a claim out and work no this . Ive had lots of time of on and of with medication problems pain and depression in fact it was ohn that signed me of with that . Thats when all my treatment started its still on going costs me a fortune . I have good days and bad trouble is you never know which your going to get sometimes you can read the signs . You can call the employment rights people or acas they will advice you . I fully undwrstand how u feel i got told 8 wks ago i couldnt keep doing what i was doing or others at work they were going to decrease the capability numbers . I had to apply for a job along with everyone else and went on hol for 7 wks as it was planned .that has all been sorted i didnt get enough scores so got bak to a letter . Now the big manager has told me he put me forward for another posistion that came up while i was away . I got that to face now nxt week . He told me to carry on as i was before i went away . I thought that was it i even threw my work boots in the bin ive had to buy some today . Everyday you expect something to happen like yourself you get fed up with it and want it to end . Please try ringing these people i hope they help they have given me good advice . Like if they offer money dont take it because it will effect my claim so they can not even offer to pay me off . Xx

[Fwizzi]

Thank you soooooo much for all your replies, you have all been so supportive and helpful. I have spent the last week on the phone to anyone and everyone who would listen. Employer is now being more empathic but the situation still remains the same unfortunately. It seems they have followed all the correct procedures so one of the acas people I spoke to said that a possible leaving package could be negotiated kind of a good will gesture due to the fact that although I have many health problems, I did soldier on through the fatigue and pain barrier (as we all do) up until the accident I had while at work. So although the situation is still the same, im much more informed and thats all thanks to you guys. Wishing you all a blessed and achy rather than painful day 😀